Kingmaker can't have bastard half-elves? (no spoilers)


Rules Questions


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The Kingmaker player's guide has this to say about half-elves:

Often the victims of unfounded stigmatization in communities of primarily human or elven populations, half-elves typically find Brevoy a welcoming land. The Chelish and Taldan upper classes have long exiled their embarrassing—if common—illegitimate half-elf progeny to the unruly River Kingdoms, and as a result, many of the region’s half-elves claim some noble heritage (even if such claims aren’t formally recognized). Other half-elven settlers in the region are the result of trysts between locals and elves from nearby Kyonin. Regardless of their origins, half-elves find their adaptable nature well suited to Brevic life, especially those settlements in which adherence to local custom is of paramount concern. Many half-elves rise to positions of power thanks to their ability to roll with political changes and bypass unexpected social impediments.

Then it goes on to say that only humans can take the bastard trait (shown below in italics for your convenience), which the above description seems to be describing to a "T."

Bastard (limited to human characters): One of your parents was a member of one of the great families of Brevoy, perhaps even of the line of Rogarvia itself. Yet you have no substantive proof of your nobility, and you’ve learned that claiming nobility without evidence makes you as good as a liar. While you might own a piece of jewelry, a scrap of once-rich fabric, or an aged confession of love, none of this directly supports your claim. Thus, you’ve lived your life in the shadow of nobility, knowing that you deserve the comforts and esteem of the elite, even though the contempt of fate brings you nothing but their scorn. Whether a recent attempt to prove your heritage has brought down the wrath of a noble family’s henchmen or you merely seek to prove the worth of the blood in your veins, you’ve joined an expedition into the Stolen Lands, hoping to make a name all your own. You take a –1 penalty on all Charisma-based skill checks made when dealing with members of Brevic nobility but gain a +1 trait bonus on Will saves as a result of your stubbornness and individuality. (The penalty aspect of this trait is removed if you ever manage to establish yourself as a true noble.)

Is the parenthetical text under the Bastard trait a typo? Shouldn't it say humans and half-elves only? Or perhaps just half-elves?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

If you want half-elves or half-orcs to be able to take the bastard trait, that's fine. There are VERY few human/elf (or human/orc romances for that matter) in Brevoy as the kingdom is established, so we assumed that most Brevic noble bastards would be humans is all.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Is the Bastard trait considered a racial trait and thus can be selected by someone with the Adopted social trait?

Also, if I am limited to two traits, can I pick Adopted (and thus get bastard) along with one other trait? Or do I have to waste one of my two traits in order to get Bastard?


Since half-elves and half-orcs count as humans (and their respective demi-human component), is there even a problem with them taking 'human only traits? Anyhow, like James said, I think you're good allowing it. I'd even allow if for Dwarven characters since there's apparently a Dwarven line of nobility semi-integrated in the Brevoy power structure. It's just that 99% of Brevoy is humans, so the writers kind of just assumed that.


One nit-picky point is that the half-elf writeup says they come from Chelish or Taldan families, and the trait applies to bastards from Brevoy.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Ravingdork wrote:

Is the Bastard trait considered a racial trait and thus can be selected by someone with the Adopted social trait?

Also, if I am limited to two traits, can I pick Adopted (and thus get bastard) along with one other trait? Or do I have to waste one of my two traits in order to get Bastard?

Bastard is a campaign trait, not a race trait. You don't need to take Adopted to take the Kingmaker's Bastard campaign trait, and more to the point, Adopted won't LET you take that trait since it's not a race trait.

And now that I've thought it over... the fact that half-elves have the elf blood racial trait, which means they're counted as both elves AND humans for any effect related to race, more or less means that they DO qualify for the Bastard trait. Because they count as humans, and thus fill the prerequisite for the Bastard trait. Same goes for half-orcs.

yay! no errata or houseruling needed!

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