S'mon's page

The wording is very exact: "While under the effects of this spell, the target is immune to any new attempts to possess or exercise mental control over the target." In my reading, mental control is something which extends to things like Confusion, because the caster is making the target do things he would not do if in his right mind. Your reading sounds too much like nit-picking a spell to circumvent its function for my taste.

And, believe me, I get it. It sucks that a level one spell can render the main offensive powers of a whole class meaningless. But that is what the designers gave us and I am not going to twist and turn a spell function until it doesn't work anymore. Ileosa can dispel magic with the best of them, after all.

FWIW my reading of it is that it is much more limited - it stops the conduit from the controller to the controlee, so they can't order them around, dominate them etc. The intent does not appear to be that it gives blanket immunity to mind affecting magic, and it certainly does not say that. I'm not sure why you think that is its function; going back to 1e it was a "no touch" spell, including mental touch.

WoTC's old D&D survey had 18% of respondents say they were female, AIR. The demographics at my Meetup, which has a few hundred members, match that pretty closely.
IME Male players often play female characters, female players often play male characters, so I'm not sure that the demographics of players is very relevant to the demographics of minis.
Paizo certainly have a lot of female characters. I think they have a decent number of male characters too; though it would be nice to have male representatives of every class, it's pretty easy to substitute.
Companies like Reaper that sell minis individually say the female ones sell better than the male ones, btw. It may be that painters (of both sexes?) like painting female minis. >:)

Luckily I've never had the kind of players where this would be an issue. I've never seen the kind of player happy to abuse the system with nonsensical multiclassing, though apparently they're common on the Internet! I guess if I were running 3e or Pathfinder and this came up I'd (a) point out the multiclassing didn't make sense, then if the player persisted (b) I'd suggest they find another GM better suited to their proclivities.
But like I said, never been an issue.

Edit: Playing a Cleric of Erastil recently, I proposed taking a level of Ranger. Obviously not nonsensical, but the other players & GM told me no, they didn't want my healing ability weakened. Certainly none of them thought it was solely up to me what class I took.

Resting
Here's my draft house rule for resting in 4e CoTCT. It lets low level PCs recover Dailies quickly so they still have options, while bringing back attrition, which allows for a much lower general threat level while keeping the game interesting:

Extended Rest: An Extended Rest requires one week (7 days) in typical circumstances such as wilderness camping, or 4 days in particularly salubrious circumstances such as a luxurious inn. Intermediate cases require 4-7 days (GM may roll 1d4+3). An Extended Rest restores all hit points, healing surges, and Daily powers.
Overnight Rest: An overnight rest may be taken once per day, normally overnight, takes 6 hours, and restores 1 Daily power and 1 Healing Surge. If you are trained in Endurance an overnight rest restores 2 Healing Surges.

I don't think this would work well with most published 4e adventures, but should be ideal with converted 3e etc adventures like CoTCT that have different assumptions, and where XP can be easily tweaked. The Endurance rule makes it a valuable skill and helps out the tougher classes, who get it as a class skill.

I was wondering if anyone else tried tying PCs' backstory in to the major NPCs prior to the start of the campaign, as I am planning to do? I thought that for a 'noir' feel it would work better to have pre-established connections in many cases - old friends, lovers and enemies - rather than the usual 'blank slate' approach. My thinking is this would ensure the AP felt like it centred on the PCs' story, and strong connections would help avoid it seeming artificial.

If you tried this, how did it go? Pitfalls to watch out for?

Thanks Alexis, lots of good ideas! I especially like the idea of having NPCs compare the PCs to Blackjack early on.
I'm not planning to use the Guide to Korvosa though, I find I can improvise stuff easier than remembering it, and I want the players to take part in creating bits of the city.

I thought about giving a character dying words instead of just knocking out. I find this more exciting to give that bad guy a final dying "curse you" before knocking out.

Yeah, that sounds like a great idea, thanks! :)

One thing I want to take the opportunity to do is to play up the humanity of (most) human opponents. Gaedren is utterly vile, but I can also see him whining and pleading for his life even while his croc is digesting some unfortunate 'orphan' (I might mention the real-world fact that most 'orphans' are actually the unwanted children of illicit liaisons, playing up the Victorian theme. Historically, until Charles Dickens, orphanages were pretty much death camps, where very few survived to adulthood).

I also had an idea for the first meeting with the Gray Maidens in book 2, taking advantage of the fact that players are often more likely to empathise with female NPCs. I'm portraying them as skilled warriors, initially arrogant with their heavy armour and intense training, but as soon as one goes down, another tears off her helm, revealing a frightened-looking and teary-eyed young woman:

"What are you doing?! She's dying! We've got to save her!"

>:)
I'm taking some inspiration from old WW2 movies (ca '60s-'70s) and Sven Hassel books, with the portrayal of the Gray Maidens influenced by the Hitler Youth. Hand-picked and heavily indoctrinated, but still human, and initially with little real combat experience.

Yeah, Gaedren certainly deseves to die (IMO)! It might be a bigger issue with his lackeys, and certainly the PCs shouldn't be using lethal force vs the children. As I'll be running it in 4e D&D, I'm thinking that in most cases I'll ask the players if they are using deadly force, or just trying to KO the target. I'm also thinking of tracking when NPCs die, rather than just assume they die when dropped.

I was wondering if other GMs have played up the Gotham angle, with the PCs as Batman-to-be? How did it go? Pitfalls to watch for?

One thing I was wondering about was the casual murder ethos assumed by D&D adventures. If the PCs are in the Batman mindset, will they even want to murder Gaedren Lamm? Perhaps they'll take him in for a fair trial?(!) I'm definitely thinking that in their first fight I'll ask them "do you really want to kill this guy? It's a terrible thing to kill a man (or gnome)..."

Just started a blog for my upcoming campaign - Campaign Blog.
Right now I'm focused on getting things off to a good start when we begin, prob in June. You're welcome to take a look and let me know what you think, and hopefully something here might be helpful to other GMs too.

@Jeremy - thanks, yes, I agree. I tend to find with 3e & PF the major monsters have far more abilities than they can ever use in the scene in which they appear - a pain for story-path but useful for sandboxing. Also in 3e & PF challenge level is highly circumstantial; I recently played the end of Burnt Offerings and our initial encounter with Nualia we were totally overwhelmed; second time round knowing what to expect plus a lucky Will save fail (Command - 'Approach!') made it a pretty easy fight. 4e seems a lot less variable & more predictable.

If/when Paizo do 2e Pathfinder they might like to take a look at monster design with this issue in mind.

Here's a Gray Maiden Corporal, to liven up encounters with squads of baseline Maidens:

Gray Maiden Corporal Level 7 Soldier (Leader)
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 300
HP 77; Bloodied 39
AC 23; Fortitude 17; Reflex 19; Will 20 Speed 5 Initiative +7
Perception +5
Standard Actions
m Broadsword (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +12 vs. AC
Hit: 1d10 + 9 damage, and the target is marked until the end of the Maiden's next turn.
M Imposing Smite (weapon) • Recharge 5 6
Attack: +12 vs. AC
Hit: 2d10 + 9 damage, and an S or M target is pushed 1 square and knocked prone. .
"Take them down!" • At-Will
Effect: (1 ally within 10, of a lower level than the Corporal.); The ally can shift 1 square and make a melee basic attack as a free action with a +2 bonus on the attack.
Move Actions
"Move it, Sister!" • At-Will
Effect: (1 ally within 10.); The ally can Shift 3 squares as a free action.
Triggered Actions
Fanatic (weapon)
Trigger: She falls to 0 hp.
Effect: The Gray Maiden makes a melee basic attack.
Combat Supremacy • At-Will
Trigger: Marked enemy shifts or makes an attack not including the Grey Maiden.
Effect (Immediate Interrupt): She makes a Broadsword attack vs the marked target.
Skills Intimidate +12, Athletics +12, Endurance +9
Str 18 (+7) Dex 15 (+5) Wis 14 (+5)
Con 13 (+4) Int 12 (+4) Cha 19 (+7)
Alignment evil Languages Common
Equipment plate armor, heavy shield, broadsword

Here's Cressida Kroft, based off the MM2 human noble, whose warlordy powers felt very appropriate. She could be used eg in book 6 as a useful companion character for an undergunned PC group, or to arrest the PCs if things go wrong earlier.

Marshal Cressida Kroft Level 14 Controller (Leader)
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 1,000
HP 137; Bloodied 69
AC 28; Fortitude 26; Reflex 25; Will 26
Speed 5 Initiative +10
Perception +10
Traits
"Shield Wall!"
She gains a +2 bonus to all defenses while an ally is adjacent.
Standard Actions
m Longsword (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +19 vs. AC
Hit: 2d8 + 13 damage.
C "You! Take him down!" • At-Will
Effect: Close burst 10 (targets one ally); the target makes a basic attack as a free action and shifts 1 square before or after the attack.
C Inspirational Authority • Encounter
Effect: Close burst 10 (targets one ally); the target uses an at-will, encounter, or recharge attack power as a free action.
C "Stop in the name of the Law!" (charm) • Encounter
Attack: Close burst 5 (targets enemies); +15 vs. Will
Hit: The target cannot use a standard action during its next turn.
Skills Diplomacy +17, Insight +15, Intimidate +17, Streetwise +17
Str 20 (+12) Dex 17 (+10) Wis 17 (+10)
Con 17 (+10) Int 19 (+11) Cha 21 (+12)
Alignment unaligned Languages Common
Equipment pitmail, light shield, longsword

In statting for part 2 onwards I'm generally finding that:
1) Once the PCs have a few levels, most NPCs look to convert best to 4e at '3e level+4'; for monsters it looks more like 'hit dice+4'.
2) If there are more than half a dozen creatures in an encounter then some convert best as minions. If they are very low level then they need extra levels, up to +8; keep an eye on the 3e EL to get a similar threat level overall.
3) There are a few obvious 'name' characters like Sabina Merrin that convert best as Elites at '3e level = 4e level'. Elite status comes with a huge wad of hp and is best reserved for NPCs with some 'plot protection' - it ensures they won't die fast which is good if you want/need to keep them alive, but risks tediousness if overused.
In general I'm finding that 4e monster statting rules work very well for this 'story' based play mode, whereas they often struggle in status-quo sandbox mode. I find 3e the opposite btw! :)

Here's a Gray Maiden Throneguard, the elite Gray Maidens guarding Castle Korvosa in Book 6:

Gray Maiden Throneguard Level 12 Soldier
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 700
HP 120; Bloodied 60
AC 28; Fortitude 23; Reflex 25; Will 24
Speed 5 Initiative +12
Perception +9

Standard Actions
m Broadsword (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +17 vs. AC
Hit: 2d10 + 9 damage.
M Imposing Smite (weapon) • Recharge 5 6
Attack: +17 vs. AC
Hit: 3d10 + 9 damage, and an S or M target is pushed 1 square and knocked prone. .
Triggered Actions
Fanatic (weapon)
Trigger: The Maiden Falls to 0 hp.
Effect: The Gray Maiden makes a melee basic attack.
Defender Aura • At-Will
Trigger: An adjacent enemy shifts or attacks someone neither marking the enemy nor imposing defender aura on the enemy.
Effect (Opportunity): She makes a Broadsword attack vs the triggering enemy.
Skills Intimidate +15, Athletics +16, Endurance +14
Str 21 (+11) Dex 18 (+10) Wis 17 (+9)
Con 16 (+9) Int 15 (+8) Cha 19 (+10)
Alignment evil Languages Common
Equipment plate armor, heavy shield, broadsword

My current thinking on the Grey Maidens is to present them initially as very much a volunteer high-prestige elite bodyguard, like Hitler's Leibstandarte SS...

Talking of which, I thought a sort of '1930s Berlin' vibe might be quite a good approach to go for in the early part of the AP; 'Cabaret' and all that. :)

I was wondering if this is mentioned anywhere in the AP, or what approach other GMs take? It would affect stuff like:

Whether Cressida Kroft is unusual as a female commander.
Size of Gray Maiden recruiting pool.
Possible PC backgrounds.

I was thinking about using something in the 10%-25% region, but it could go higher if Cheliaxan culture is gynarchic, or lower if female warriors are unusual.
My current thinking on the Grey Maidens is to present them initially as very much a volunteer high-prestige elite bodyguard, like Hitler's Leibstandarte SS, with onerous indoctrination rituals, scarification etc all *increasing* their prestige, as commonly happens IRL - basically the extreme hazing you see in many similar RL organisations. This would argue for a broad recruitment pool of potential female warriors, and female fighters not being seen as too unusual; although it also works well if supply outstrips demand - eg lots of young women who *want* to be fighters, but families who want them to be wives & mothers.

What do you think? If you ran CoTCT and thought about this, what approach did you take?

(If for some reason you think this is a stupid question, please ignore this post, thank you.)

It is kind of interesting to think about what a world without effective sexual dimorphism would look like. If women are as effective warriors as men, are women warriors as common? Are women assumed to be non-combatants and protected, at least by those who honor such conventions?

I tend to treat surface elves in non-Tolkienesque settings as having reduced sexual dimorphism as compared to humans. Female elves are more likely to be warriors, on the other hand they are still the ones who bear children; you're not likely to be a nursing mother and a professional warrior at the same time. Typically either a female warrior won't ever marry or will retire from the warrior role when she marries or conceives.

With dark elves the females are bigger and stronger, but again they still bear the children. In their chaotic-evil society the result is that males, being expendable, are still commonly warriors, even though females have a strength advantage, but usually in relatively low-status positions and often with female leaders.

Anyway somebody up thread suggested this was off topic for a thread about homosexuality, and some of the responses were a bit depressing (but thanks for the good ones), so I'll leave it. I got some good ideas about Cheliaxan cultural norms, and I think "some women are as strong as men" is pretty immanent in most modern fantasy RPGs, so I'll likely use both.

S'mon, the primary reason of women being the "inferior sex" throughout the ages was people who think like you do.

I don't think I'm the primary reason for sex discrimination throughout the ages, and that's pretty nasty IMO.

Well, at the risk of being piled on, it should be noted that, historically, virtually all great military leaders have been men. This has happened because men have dominated in martial positions throughout history. Why? Well, despite the fact that I believe men and women to be innately equal in terms of value as human beings, that does not equate into equality of capability. Nature has made men larger, stronger, and more able to handle the rigors of combat. Hence, many more men have been able to rise to positions of military authority.

I think for me the challenge for justifiying a Golarion type setting is to combine (a) lots of butt-kicking warrior women (N)PCs with an in-world Human species that in most respects resembles the real world. (a) Means no Runequest style STR penalties on female Fighters, (b) means that sexual dimorphism can't just be abandoned so that there is no average strength difference between 'mundane' men and women.

I'm currently thinking something like: The bulk of the population are similar to the real world, but a substantial minority of human females are born with an 'amazon gene' that makes them as large and strong as men; probably also more aggressive than most women, they may become town guards, Gray Maidens etc. This is sufficiently widely appreciated that women in positions of martial authority are not uncommon. Add in magical, divine and other power sources, and women in leadership positions is not uncommon in many human societies.

>>Sometimes so many female characters in positions of bureaucratic (Deverin) or military (Croft) authority are a bit difficult in a quasi-medieval setting though.<<
Why? This is a fantasy setting. Just because a civilization is at a medieval level of technology doesn't mean that it must automatically partake of the absurd views of women that co-occured with that level of technology in Earth's history.

Well the presence of magic, different physical laws etc could change things, otherwise technology would tend to constrain the range of viable societies. Eg with real-world sexual dimorphism societies which favour physical strength and fighting ability will tend to be male dominated to a greater or lesser extent - there is a wide range in real life over the past two thousand years, roughly corresponding to the societal range on Golarion (which has 'ancient world' and '19th century' societies) but nothing approaching sex equality. Fertility and reproduction is also an issue, IRL effective contraception seems to have been a big driver of twentieth century social change towards sex equality.

I'm not particularly interested in trying to make Golarion realistic though, I'm more interested in accepting the premises of the setting, understanding it to the extent authors may have put some thought into it, and finding (semi) reasonable in-world justifications.

You're assuming Golarion is based on the social mores and taboos of Earth's Middle Ages. It's mythological history has numerous examples of extremely powerful women, which has effects on how civilizations form.

As for women in positions of power in places like Cheliax, remember that Hell serves Cheliax. Hell's hierarchy is misogynistic, but it was a woman (Abrogail Thrune) who made the deal with the church of Asmodeus to begin with. Cheliax does not suffer the hierarchies of hell to command it. They pick and choose of their own free will and if the devil's don't like it, they can go screw themselves.

That and it's important to bear in mind that the ruling class throughout human history has always behaved as the exception to cultural rules and...

Thanks - yes, I'm more interested in getting a handle on the Golarion societies and how they might work, rather than try to replicate eg real world medieval society (although eg Brevoy seems quite 'grounded' in reality, depending on which part of Kingmaker I read). I'm focusing on Varisia/Cheliax preparatory to hopefully running Curse of the Crimson Throne. This isn't the only societal issue I've had trouble deciphering but it was one that occurred to me due to this thread.

Magical power is clearly a big thing; a fireball-slinging demigod is a fireball-slinging demigod whatever his/her/its gender. Arguably Xena style superhuman fighting ability falls into the same bracket, which would cover the likes of Sabina Merrin and maybe Cressida Croft. I'm not still not sure about Sandpoint's Mayor Deverin - I've played not read Burnt Offerings; maybe she has a plausible backstory as a successful businesswoman or somesuch who went into politics, for some reason though her very mundanity always made her seem less plausible to me.

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It is necessary. Just as it's necessary to move beyond having every PC and NPC in the game be white. And why it's important to show women in positions of power (be they bad like Queen Ileosa or good like Mayor Kendra or whatever.) It's called diversity, and it's a Good Thing. If diversity isn't something that you're interested in, Paizo products might not be for you.

Just musing on this: I can't say I'm 'interested' in Diversity in the 'Celebrate Diverstity!' political sense. On the other hand I think having the occasional gay or lesbian character works well, and obviously most of Golarion's humans aren't white. Sometimes so many female characters in positions of bureaucratic (Deverin) or military (Croft) authority are a bit difficult in a quasi-medieval setting though. Given that few of the Golarion nations are Seattle-style Liberal utopias I have some trouble imagining how they attain their positions. There were a lot of political, cultural and technological developments that made senior female professional women somewhat common in the latter part of the twentieth century, but they are still pretty rare in our societies, I have trouble imagining how the (eg) Cheliaxan society is so accommodating.

Those are some good ideas for the queen. Thanks for sharing.

Hmm, the links no longer work for me. Any way you can re-post or upload the conversions Scott? I have been running this adventure path for my group and we start A History of Ashes Saturday. It would be great to get some ideas other than my own on how to convert this to 4E. I love the adventure content and my players are having a blast by the way.

Thanks Llacheu! :)

I took a few hours and did a document that compiles much of Scott's conversion from his blog and tried uploading it to the first file storage site I found on Google. Try http://filestor.com.sg/xo528y2go592.html
Obviously I'll take it down if Scott no longer wants his work distributed.

Edit: Bit slow but I was able to download the doc, hope you can too. :D
I added some of my own ideas, I left out some stuff I can run straight from the 3e version, and I had the advantage of WoTC's Monster Manual 3 to refer to for Derroes. Where it says "DT" in the Minion stat blocks, I use a Damage Threshold for minions - the first number is to-Kill, the second is to-Bloody; I'm using Level+2 for this conversion. This replaces "no damage on a miss" which I find works poorly in play, but you should ignore if desired of course.

I've done some more 4e NPC conversions/stats, but I'm putting them over in the 4e forum thread, which seems the best place - http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k2cu?4th-Edition-Curse-of-the-Crimson-Throne

Here's a Book 1 Ileosa as a level 6 Elite, although at this time she will avoid combat if at all possible, other than a 'scornful gaze' at Blackjack in the cutscene. >:)

Queen Ileosa Arabesti (level 6) Level 6 Elite Skirmisher
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 500
HP 140; Bloodied 70
AC 20; Fortitude 18; Reflex 18; Will 19
Speed 6
Saving Throws +2; Action Points 1
Initiative +7
Perception +2

Traits
"This is my Right!"
Ileosa does not provoke opportunity attacks.
"My mind is clear!"
Ileosa cannot be Dazed, Stunned or Dominated.
Standard Actions
m Scepter of Rulership (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +11 vs. AC
Hit: 1d8 + 10 damage (crit 20 5d8+18).
M "Thus Perish All Who Oppose My Cause!" • Recharge 5 6
Effect: Ileosa shifts 2 squares and makes one scepter attack against each enemy she moves adjacent to.
Minor Actions
r Eye of Scorn • At-Will
Attack: 10; +9 vs. Will; Psychic Damage
Hit: 1d10 + 6 "Ileosa glares angrily at you!".
Aftereffect: The target is Dazed (save ends).
Special: May be used once per Turn. Targets reduced to 0 hp are Unconscious but not Dying.
Skills Bluff +12, Diplomacy +12, Insight +7, Intimidate +12
Str 8 (+2) Dex 14 (+5) Wis 9 (+2)
Con 14 (+5) Int 13 (+4) Cha 18 (+7)
Alignment evil     Languages Common
Equipment scepter (+5 mace)

Korvosa Royal Guard - these are men at arms defending the palace and royal family, and are tougher than most of the regular street guards from whom they are drawn.

Korvosa Royal Guard Level 8 Controller
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 350
HP 87; Bloodied 43
AC 23; Fortitude 20; Reflex 19; Will 19
Speed 5 Initiative +7
Perception +5
Standard Actions
m Glaive (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: Reach 2; +13 vs. AC
Hit: 2d8 + 7 damage, and the guard can shift 1 square.
M Powerful Strike (weapon) • Recharge 5 6
Attack: Reach 2; +13 vs. AC
Hit: 3d8 + 7 damage, a S or M target is knocked prone, and the guard can shift 1 square.
R Crossbow (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: Ranged 15/30; +11 vs. AC
Hit: 1d8 + 7 damage.
Skills Streetwise +11, Athletics +13, Intimidate +11
Str 19 (+8) Dex 16 (+7) Wis 12 (+5)
Con 15 (+6) Int 12 (+5) Cha 14 (+6)
Alignment any Languages Common
Equipment plate armor, glaive, crossbow, crossbow bolts (20)

The Long Live Korvosa stuff is great! :) This seems a decent place to put some 4e CoTCT stat blocks I've been working on.

CURSE OF THE CRIMSON THRONE 4E CONVERSION

Queen Ileosa - this is a general high powered version of Ileosa based off the MM2 Insane Noble, but as an 18th level Solo. I'll likely do a different 'end boss' version.

Queen Ileosa Arabesti Level 18 Solo Skirmisher
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 10,000
HP 344; Bloodied 172
AC 32; Fortitude 30; Reflex 30; Will 31
Speed 6
Saving Throws +5; Action Points 2 Initiative +16
Perception +8
Traits
"This is my Right!"
Ileosa does not provoke opportunity attacks.
"My mind is clear!"
Ileosa cannot be Dazed, Stunned or Dominated.
Standard Actions
m Scepter of Rulership (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +23 vs. AC
Hit: 3d8 + 13 damage (crit 19-20 for 5d8+27).
M "Thus Perish All Who Oppose My Cause!" • At-Will
Effect: Ileosa shifts 6 squares and makes one scepter attack against each enemy she moves adjacent to.
Minor Actions
r Eye of Scorn • At-Will
Attack: 15; +21 vs. Will; Psychic Damage
Hit: 2d10 + 9 "Ileosa glares angrily at you!".
Aftereffect: The target is Dazed (save ends).
Special: May be used only once per target per Turn. Targets reduced to 0 hp are Unconscious but not Dying.
Triggered Actions
C "How dare you!" (weapon)
Requirements: Ileosa takes damage.
Attack (Immediate Reaction): Close burst 1 (targets enemies); +21 vs. AC
Hit: 3d8 + 13 damage (crit 19-20 for 5d8+27), and the target is knocked prone.
Skills Bluff +21, Diplomacy +21, Insight +13, Intimidate +21
Str 14 (+11) Dex 20 (+14) Wis 9 (+8)
Con 20 (+14) Int 13 (+10) Cha 24 (+16)
Alignment evil Languages Common
Equipment scepter (mace)
 
Gray Maiden - this is a typical Gray Maiden such as the ones encountered in Book 2. Unlike the Fighter-2 stats given, four of them out to somewhat threaten 4-5 ca 5th level PCs.

Gray Maiden Level 6 Soldier
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 250
HP 69; Bloodied 35
AC 23; Fortitude 16; Reflex 18; Will 18
Speed 5 Initiative +7
Perception +5
Standard Actions
m Broadsword (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +11 vs. AC
Hit: 1d10 + 8 damage, and the target is marked until the end of the Maiden's next turn.
M Imposing Smite (weapon) • Recharge 5 6
Attack: +11 vs. AC
Hit: 2d10 + 8 damage, and an S or M target is pushed 1 square and knocked prone. .
Triggered Actions
Fanatic (weapon)
Trigger: The Gray Maiden drops to 0 hp.
Effect: The Gray Maiden makes a melee basic attack.
Combat Supremacy • At-Will the maiden
Trigger: An adjacent marked target Shifts or makes an attack not including the Grey Maiden. .
Effect (Immediate Interrupt): She makes a Broadsword attack vs the marked target.
Skills Intimidate +11, Athletics +12, Endurance +9
Str 18 (+7) Dex 15 (+5) Wis 14 (+5)
Con 13 (+4) Int 12 (+4) Cha 16 (+6)
Alignment evil Languages Common
Equipment plate armor, heavy shield, broadsword

I think Ileosa really ought to be 'redeemable' in the sense of being turned back into the typical Cheliaxan aristocrat brattish noblewoman/girl she was prior to her possession - not a very nice person ("3e evil" - might have been 'neutral' in 1e!), but probably not genocidal! Of course this would probably take powerful magic, but not necessarily beyond the capabilities of very high level PCs. Going by the backstory in part 1 she never chose to become the vessel of the BBEG, she never committed serious crimes of her own free will (I don't think just thinking "mm, I wish hubby would hurry up and die so I can be Queen!" really counts as a capital offense), and I can definitely see unusually Good PCs wanting to try this.

I'm interested in running Crimson Throne in 4e D&D, which seems like potentially a good system for it. To kick things off I thought I'd have a go statting Ileosa. I currently have the first two parts of Throne and I've seen Queen Ileosa in 3e D&D online somewhere, ca CR 18 AIR; I am adapting the rather appropriate 4e Monster Manual 2 Human Insane Noble as a high Paragon Solo. I don't know if this has been done previously and/or if anyone uses 4e for Paizo Adventure Paths? I halve all monster hp BTW.
If you are familiar with 4e D&D and with Crimson Throne
could you take a look and let me know what you think, thanks! :)

Queen Ileosa Arabesti Level 18 Solo Skirmisher
Medium natural humanoid (human) XP 10,000
HP 344; Bloodied 172
AC 32; Fortitude 30; Reflex 30; Will 31
Speed 6
Saving Throws +5; Action Points 2
Initiative +16
Perception +8

Traits
"This is my Right!"
Ileosa does not provoke opportunity attacks.
"My mind is clear!"
Ileosa cannot be Dazed, Stunned or Dominated.
Standard Actions
m Scepter of Rulership (weapon) • At-Will
Attack: +23 vs. AC
Hit: 3d8 + 13 damage (crit 19-20 for 5d8+27).
M "Thus Perish All Who Oppose My Cause!" • At-Will
Effect: Ileosa shifts 6 squares and makes one scepter attack against each enemy she moves adjacent to.
Minor Actions
r Eye of Scorn • At-Will
Attack: 15; +21 vs. Will; Psychic Damage
Hit: 2d10 + 9 "Ileosa glares angrily at you!".
Aftereffect: The target is Dazed (save ends).
Special: May be used only once per target per Turn. Targets reduced to 0 hp are Unconscious but not Dying.
Triggered Actions
C "How dare you!" (weapon)
Requirements: Ileosa takes damage.
Attack (Immediate Reaction): Close burst 1 (targets enemies); +21 vs. AC
Hit: 3d8 + 13 damage (crit 19-20 for 5d8+27), and the target is knocked prone.
Skills Bluff +21, Diplomacy +21, Insight +13, Intimidate +21
Str 14 (+11) Dex 20 (+14) Wis 9 (+8)
Con 20 (+14) Int 13 (+10) Cha 24 (+16)
Alignment evil     Languages Common
Equipment scepter (mace)

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Just played the Pathfinder Beginner Box with my 5.5 year old, Bill (using the rules!) Bill wanted to play an Orc Boss called Korkas, so he was Korkas, Boss of Orcshire, exploring Black Fang's Dungeon. Lots of fun roleplaying with his incompetent and cowardly orc minions, Samael and Tomael (RIP Tomael, roasted by the dragon). B)
He didn't kill the dragon (we were an hour in and his attention was slipping, so he made me play Korkas while he played Black Fang and chased me away!) but Korkas did get out with the giant ruby and a scroll of new life stolen from the dragon's hoard. :)

I'd definitely recommend the Pathfinder Beginner Box for parents wanting to introduce their kids to D&D. Bill made a good choice of PC too, as the Orc Boss is tough enough to survive a few fights. The 'Evil Fighter' 'Evil Rogue' 'Evil Cleric' and 'Evil Wizard' should also make good pregens for solo play. Or you could use the free Hero Builder Starter Edition for Beginner Box to make a 3rd or 4th level PC - http://wolflair.com/index.php?context=hero_lab&page=starter_edition

If you want to play Pathfinder Society, you don't need the BB.

If you want to create your own group and GM then I strongly recommend the BB, especially if your players are also new to tabletop RPGs. Even if your players are experienced Pathfinder players the BB is still worth having as a GMing aid; ignore the Heroes' Handbook and the rest of the box is still great value for what you get.

The Beginner Box is an awesome product, and the thing that finally lured me into Pathfinder - I had been resisting for two years after being burned out on 3.5 D&D's complexity and poor balance at high levels. I'm now playing in a Rise of the Runelords campaign and own a bunch of Pathfinder product, but the Beginner Box remains my top choice for GMing. It's pretty well the perfect RPG product.

The only monsters that, in the opinion of Ryan Dancey in 2000, met both those criteria were "beholder, gauth, carrion crawler, displacer beast, githyanki, githzerai, mind flayer, illithid, umber hulk, yuan-ti". So they were reserved, while everything else in the 3rd edition Monster Manual was released.

The actual copyright status of most of those is pretty ambiguous. And copyright law itself doesn't really let you monopolise either 'monster ideas' or 'monster names' - Trade Mark law may enable you to do the latter, if you are actually using them as a badge of origin. I could for instance use githyanki and githzerai in a non-OGL product, deriving them solely from their original appearance in White Dwarf magazine, which text was copyright Charles Stross, their creator.

But the copyright status of these monsters is completely irrelevant to the OGL. The OGL is a contractual license that lets the user use SRD material and prohibits the user from using designated 'Product Identity' such as mind flayers and githyanki. The copyright status of mind flayers or displacer beasts or githyanki is irrelevant to their status as forbidden PI under the SRD. If you use the OGL then you can't use designated PI.

They took her in before the rest of them died, that's how I read it.

Ruyan.

PS: Funny nobody commented on the blog post in 2007...

I think I followed a link on TV tropes' Pathfinder page. :)

I can't work out how Seelah could have been taken in and trained as a paladin if none of the Order survived the siege. I suppose she could have been taken in, THEN they all died, THEN she found some more Paladins to train her... but it doesn't say that. I think on balance the 'none survived' line does not fit with the rest of the backstory below it, and may be an error.

"although none of them survived the siege..."
"The knights of Iomedae took Seelah in that night."

How could they take in Seelah, if they all died in the siege? It sounds from context as if the first line is wrong.

You could go with "You can't cast arcane spells while wearing armour"? :)

That would seem the most BB-ish way to treat the issue, by analogy with the 'no casting in melee' rule.

S'mon wrote:

I just started playing a Cleric in a Core PF game and don't know much about it; this sounds like something I need to check up on! :D

Have fun! The silliest thing I did in my first public game (and around my 4th tabletop RPG game ever, a Society game, playing a cleric for the first time) was select cure light wounds for one of my spells. With spontaneous casting this is a waste of a slot (not called spontaneous casting in the BB, but it's there, I just missed it somehow. live and learn). But everyone was super-cool and I had a blast.

Sadly, that feat needs CHA 13 and I have CHA 12! :C

Selective Channeling is in the BB...

Thanks for the tip; I just started playing a Cleric in a Core PF game and don't know much about it; this sounds like something I need to check up on! :D

On channel positive energy - since it heals living enemies as well as living friends, you don't want to be doing it during combat. But the game pretty much assumes that PCs can and will heal up to full hp in between combats, via channel positive energy, cure light wounds spells (750gp for 50 of them in a wand!), etc. If the party is completely out of healing magic they would often be wise to retreat back to town, rest up, and return in a day or two at full hp - two days would let them return at full hp AND with full healing spells & channelings replenished.

I think this is the kind of rule that's fine to use in your BB campaign - the player has requested it, the rule is well balanced and does not add a great deal of complexity.

A handy Core rule I do use in my PBB campaign is Readied actions, for instance. Rules to be wary of (IMO) are those that do add significant complexity, such as Concentration checks, Combat Maneuvers, and Attacks of Opportunity.

WHAT WOULD YOU DO.

I wouldn't hide info from the other players. That's a really bad idea. I wouldn't use 'metagaming' as a shield to defend my bad behaviour, either.

For a new GM, most cost effective investment is: another blank flipmat, a flipmat with generic wilderness/forest scenes, and some Pawns eg the Rise of the Runelords set or the Bestiary Box. Or you can look for cheap minis; em-4 sells Orcs and Dwarves at 21p a go for instance - http://www.em4miniatures.com/acatalog/Copy_of_Fantasy.html
They also have very nice metal minis at £1.28 - http://www.em4miniatures.com/acatalog/Fantasy_Warriors.html

Here's some sample NPC stats I just made up, suitable for Beginner Box play. They are based loosely on the core rules NPC classes, except fotr the bandit they are heavy on relevant skills; light on combat ability.

BEGINNER BOX QUICK NPCs

Human Merchant (Expert): AC 10 HP 5 (or 1d8) CHA+2 Saves Fort +0 Ref +0 Will +2 CR 1/8 (50 XP)
wpn: Dagger +0/1d4 (19-20x2) Skills: Bluff +6 Diplomacy +6 Sense Motive +4 Knowledge (Local) +4

Human Aristocrat: AC 10 HP 5 (or 1d8) CHA+2 Saves Fort +0 Ref +0 Will +2 CR 1/8 (50 XP)
wpn: Unarmed or Rapier +0/1d6 (18-20x2) Skills: Bluff +6 Diplomacy +6 Intimidate +6 Sense Motive +4 Knowledge (History) +4

Human Farmer (commoner): AC 10 HP 6 (or 1d6+2) CON +2 Saves Fort +2 Ref +0 Will +0 CR 1/8 (50 XP)
wpn: Dagger +0/1d4 (19-20x2) or Scythe +0/2d4 (20/x4) Skills: Knowledge (Local) +4, Knowledge (Nature) +4

Human Bandit (Warrior): AC 13 (studded leather) HP 6 (or 1d10) STR +2 Save Fort +2 Ref +0 Will +0 CR 1/3 (135 XP)
wpn: Battle Axe +3/1d8+3 (20/x3) or Short bow +1/1d6 (20/x3)

The Aristocrat is a Mayor Deverin type; for a warrior-noble use the Evil Fighter stat block in the Monsters section.

With NPCs lying, I don't make Bluff rolls unless the player requests to Sense Motive, in which case we then make opposed rolls - in the open. If the player wins, they get a good 'read' on whether the NPC is lying.

The Core Rules NPC building stuff is useful, but you already have a good number of NPCs and reskinnable monsters in the BB - eg Orcs & Orc Bosses make good barbarians and warchiefs. For noncombatant NPCs, you can default to 1st level types as follows:

Everyone has AC 10 and a +0 to-hit bonus, unarmed or weapon as appropriate - a farmer might have a Scythe, a merchant or aristocrat perhaps a dagger or shortsword.

Commoners, regular people - 4 hp (or 1d6), saves at +0.

Experts and Aristocrats, skilled people - 5 hp (or 1d8) Will save +2, other +0.

If desired You can also give the NPC a +2 attribute bonus to any one* stat, eg high STR gives +2 to hit & damage, high WIS gives +2 to Will saves. Trained skills as appropriate, should have a +4 bonus each skill, +6 if it's also a high-stat skill.

*Non-humans get it to 2 stats, as per their race.

So if the PCs decide to attack Mayor Deverin of Sandpoint, I'd use the Expert/Aristocrat line above, probably give her the max 8 hit points as she's quite important. If negotiating with her I'd give her a +2 CHA bonus, with a net +6 on her Diplomacy and +4 on her Sense Motive.

I probably wouldn't give any XP for killing these noncombatant NPCs; maybe CR 1/8 - 50 XP.

For combatant NPCs I'd use the stat blocks in the Monster section, eg a Cleric uses the Evil Cleric stat block, the head of the Town Guard uses the Evil Fighter stat block - regular guards use the City Guard stat block, of course.

Here are some quick NPC rules I did years ago for 3e - http://immortalshandbook.com/simony2.htm - but really for the BB the above is all you should need.

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My boy is 5 - he loves to 'play D&D' with me, but that actually comes down to just playing together toy-style with my figures, 99% of the time (I always lose) :). For a regular game attention span is the big issue. Lots of good ideas on this thread; I like the idea of 'freeforming' an adventure, I did a bit of that last year and I think that might work better than trying to use rules. He is not interested in the kind of 'newbie quest' adventures you get in Beginner Boxes sadly; he wants to be killing the dragon right away. :)

Cool :D :D

>> I stumbled through creating my own adventure for them. As someone new to this world - it was hard work! And now my kids want to take turns being Game master. I am going to buy some modules, because I fear that we might destroy the fun by creating sloppy adventures.<<

I suggest very short adventures, such as the one-page dungeon entries. It's very easy to get bogged down in the longer published adventures, especially when just starting out.

Remember that the PBB gives you a lot of support in leading you into creating your own adventures. Look at the one-page one with a map and plot for you to develop. Look at the page of sample adventure plots. Look over the Sandpoint setting & wilderness material.

If stuck, remember you (and your kids if they GM) can use the random encounter tables, including the Dungeon table, and the treasure tables, to stock your adventure. The PBB tables are extremely well done and easy to use, IMO. You can also use random dungeon generators free online - usually best for creating simple maps that you then stock yourself, IME.

Edit: The PBB monster section includes a nice selection of sample NPCs who can easily be 'reskinned' - the orc boss may become a Barbarian Chief; the Evil Fighter can become a Goodly Knight; the Evil Wizard & Cleric can be used for friendly NPCs, and so on.

I thought about it; but I found that using the regular XP chart but making every PC start at 1st level & track their own XP (instead of new-style party XP) had a similar effect - with attrition and variable player group, the actual advance in average party level is similar to using the slow XP chart. I've run 10 ca 4 hour sessions since February and the regular PCs are 2 2nd level & 1 4th, so average just under 3rd.

http://www.ennie-awards.com/blog/congratulations-to-the-2012-ennie-award-wi nners/

Gold for both Product of the Year and Best Production Values, both very well deserved. I think on production values the PBB sets a standard that has never been equalled.

Oops, I see it got Gold for Best Cover Art, too! :)

Yea Attacks of oppourtunity is the only thing that I struggle with for realism. Although if you walked past a guard who isn't occupied he should get a free swing sure...

I allow Readied actions in my BB game, and I'd count the guard in your example as Readied to hit any hostiles coming within reach.