Reksew_Trebla's page

Like, Monkey Swarm is a thing. Can I apply Foo Creature to it? If yes, can I apply the upgraded version, Imperial Foo Creature (found at the bottom of the regular version's page) to said Monkey Swarm?

Can I make a Monkey Swarm be the animal of an Animal Lord or a Lycanthrope? Or could I make it the base creature (not base animal) for Lycanthropic Creature? Probably easier to confirm, but back to Lycanthropic Creature, could I make a Sprite Swarm be the base creature, and the base animal be a Monkey Swarm?

Bonus question: Can I apply Giant to a size Tiny Swarm?

I know that is a lot of questions, I just have a lot of ideas, and want to know if there is any rules at all for this before I throw something like one of these at a group of players. Any help would be appreciated.

Tsukumogami

So normally I'd say yes and yes. You just apply the Construct only templates first, and apply the Tsukumogami template before Undead templates.

But the problem I'm having is the lore, which should affect RAI. While Tsukumogami is applied to Animated Objects as an acquired template, this is only because regular objects don't have a stat block as creatures. The actual lore is that Tsukumogami used to be regular objects, not Animated Objects.

Since they technically were never a Construct to begin with, only being one for the purposes of applying the template, this would suggest you could not apply Construct only templates.

For a similar reason, I am unsure if they could become undead. While you could say they are now Outsiders (kami, native), the living part is strictly the kami part, as without it, they are just regular, impossible to be undead, objects.

I know RAW this template stacking works, it's just the RAI for the lore that I am unsure about.

The mythic rules are broken. Anytime you use a mythic ability to counter the argument it is not broken you just lost that argument. Don’t get me wrong the mythic rules can be a lot of fun. I have run a mythic game and it was a blast, but it raises things up to a whole new level and anything not on that level is left in the dust.

The CR adjustments are really only for assigning XP. Using them for anything else is not useful.

Reksew_Trebla wrote:

Also, you say it is "broke as hell" without the penalties, but it really isn't. It is a worse version of the Mythic Ability Dual Initiative. The Agile Mythic Simple Template is only MR 1, thus technically only CR +1/2, which rounds up to CR +1, and it gives a few things on top of Dual Initiative, which means D.I. is less than a +1/2 CR increase, and the T.A. is a slightly worse version of D.I. if you are immune to the negatives of it. Meaning, the T.A. without penalties is worth less than a single class level, CR wise.

So Mythic is broke as hell, so if this is anything close to that, then it's broke as hell too.

Your better argument would be to say it's only slightly better than Haste, but then again Haste is basically broken too.

You two do not know what you are talking about, like at all. The Mythic Simple Templates are weaker power upgrades than most normal templates. They are literally called Simple Templates for a reason.

The facts are that Dual Initiative is less than +1/2 CR, and the Temporal Accelerator is weaker than that even if you are immune to the penalties.

But if you want more proof, the T.A. doesn't duplicate things like Fast Healing, or other things that are once per round. This means 1 Creature with Temporal Accelerator is weaker than 2 copies of the same Creature but without the Temporal Accelerator.

And guess what. 2 creatures of the same CR=CR +2. No Mythic involved.

That means even if I was wrong about the Mythic Simple Templates, the T.A. is worth less than 2 class levels at the maximum. If you think a weaker power up than 2 class levels is broke as hell, then you have no business being here.

The "easiest" way around it is to use the reincarnation spell.

The item says it's brain degradation that causes the reduced life span, so a new body should fix that right up.

I don't think being immortal is going to stop it because I think the brain damage basically accumulates to a point where you would die at whatever your "current" physical age is.

But honestly, this is something you should work out with your GM. Because that item is broke as hell if you can ignore the penalties.

As a GM I would either not let you have it, or not let you find a way around the penalties. I don't really care what the rules say.

Yeah, I guess reincarnate would work.

I don't have a GM for this. I was just trying to figure out if it would ever be worth it in the long run to ever use one of these, since you only get one life (normally), and due to how Pathfinder's cosmology works, you kind of don't get an afterlife, or at the bare minimum, don't get one as yourself (becoming an Outsider with no ties to your once mortal life), so decreasing your maximum lifespan by 5 whole years each time you use it (or 10 years if you use it more than once per day) just does not seem like a fair trade.

Also, you say it is "broke as hell" without the penalties, but it really isn't. It is a worse version of the Mythic Ability Dual Initiative. The Agile Mythic Simple Template is only MR 1, thus technically only CR +1/2, which rounds up to CR +1, and it gives a few things on top of Dual Initiative, which means D.I. is less than a +1/2 CR increase, and the T.A. is a slightly worse version of D.I. if you are immune to the negatives of it. Meaning, the T.A. without penalties is worth less than a single class level, CR wise.

Temporal Accelerator

What I mean is it hastens how soon you die of old age, without actually aging you, by shortening your maximum lifespan. This should mean even the artifact Sun Orchid Elixir won't save you if you keep using the T.A., so is there anyway to get around this?

Would making it where you are immortal (aging wise) make you immune to dying prematurely, or would you still die when your maximum lifespan is equal to or less than your current age? For example, if you wore the artifact Icecrown of Irrisen, putting it on when you are 20 years old, and then decrease your maximum lifespan to 20 or less through the T.A., would you die or not?

If you still die, then is there any way to increase your maximum lifespan, and/or make it so you can't die of old age, preferably without becoming evil, so not being undead if it can be avoided?

Also would have liked elemental wisps for time, wood, and void as well.

We need elemental wysps for ice, lightning, magma, and mud first.

Also, I'd love mythic elder elementals for aether, ice, lightning, magma, and mud, just like we got them for the main 4 elder elementals.

In a second, for all three.

Since the only downside of the ring of lifebleed (when it also has the powers of resumption and/or regeneration is taking combat damage. So as long as you aren't getting in a fight (or maybe running through a fire-fight or shootout in the street, you're coming out way ahead. Most people IRL aren't injured in combat.

The only time I wouldn't wear it, would be if it was only the cursed ring of lifebleed and even I did, I've gotten in like, three legitimate fights in my life, and I was a bouncer (now, it might count one or two more from fights I broke up between other people if I got hurt incidentally), but still, that's very few. We're not adventurers going out to fight goblins every other day.

The biggest real world issue is probably getting through metal detectors and not being able to take it off, depending on the material it's made of and security or police getting upset at you not taking it off.

What if any entity that counts as your direct avatar counts as you for the purposes of activating the Lifebleed (on your real body, not avatar)? For example, if a video game character, PC in a pen and paper game, or whatever counts as you in a board or card game, etc, that you are directly controlling (so not Pokémon for most of the games, as you are directly controlling the trainer, not the 'mon), takes weapon damage, your real body takes 1d4 damage from that.

Would you still be willing to go for this then?

Ring of Lifebleed, Ring of Resumption, Ring of Regeneration

Would you wear a Ring of Lifebleed...

Question 1: if it was also a Ring of Resumption?

Question 2: if it was also a Ring of Regeneration?

Question 3: if it was also a Ring of Resumption and a Ring of Regeneration?

For me, it'd have to also be a Ring of Regeneration, though I wouldn't need the Resumption part if it wasn't included.

I apologize but, what is the actual problem and question you have? Is it just that their NPC wealth per level is too not sufficient? I am not sure what you are asking to alter. Are you accounting for items being 1/3rd cost if crafted itself or 1/2 cost for magic items. Presumably it's a crafter.

I did have a minor problem with the build (almost all money going into the Soul Tether) and I came up with a possible solution, just to give clarity to anyone looking at this.

The actually issue is one I'm struggling to put into words. The best I can describe it is it feels "off". Maybe it is too excessive, maybe I should drop one of the three main templates, maybe I shouldn't make the armor be a Scaling Item fused with a Technology Artifact. I don't know. It just doesn't sit right with me, so I was hoping everyone could look over what I have so far to see if it should be changed so it can have better vibes.

If you read to this point, I'm sorry for the colossal length of this post. Thank you for reading it though. How would you change this up to work better, whether making it weaker, making it stronger, or any other changes you might make?

Tulpa

So this is really three questions, but each extra question only is relevant if the previous question's answer is "yes".

1: Could a character have a Tulpa of a Heavy Horse, which among other things, is a horse with the Advanced Template?

2: If yes, can a character have a Guardian Spirit Tulpa, applying the Guardian Spirit template first, then the Tulpa template, meaning the base creature for the Tulpa is a Guardian Spirit?

3: If yes, would they get to choose which spell level the "Guardian Spirit" is "conjured" by, assuming the Tulpa is intentionally created?

Do I have standard equipment, or only my clothes? If I have standard equipment, then I have my pocket knives, and proceed throughout the mansion to see if I can find supplies to survive out in the woods with. A compass, a flashlight, maybe a better weapon, and if possible, something to store water in, and if anything looks safe to eat, food.

If I don't have standard equipment, then I'd probably do the same, but this time, I'm prioritizing finding anything sturdy enough to be used as a weapon, regardless of how great of a weapon it may be. Once I find a weapon, I'll still keep a look out for a better weapon, but I'll mostly be looking for the other stuff.

Either way, I'll leave once I feel comfortable with the supplies I acquired. Climb a tree and see if I can see any civilization nearby, then head to it if I do see one, or if not, then head due north. If I hear any river nearby, I'll head to it and follow it downstream, as humans will likely settle near the river, otherwise, continue till I'm out of the forest.

I don't know what I'd do from then on though, as I'm starting to get to too many alternate situations. Plus I'd have to figure out what I'd do if I can't find supplies in the mansion.

I used to know how to make a simple compass with a cup of water and a stick(?) (maybe made of metal?), but I don't remember the process now, unfortunately. I might be able to figure it out if I try hard enough, but no guarantees there.

I do not know how to make a torch nor lantern, so I'd have to travel during the day only. I'd also need to prioritize finding a source of water if I don't see an end to the forest soon while occasionally climbing trees, even if only to find something I can hunt, as I do not know at all what berries, nuts, etc. are safe to eat.

I don't give myself good odds of survival though, as I'm a bit overweight right now.

Sorry for not responding sooner. I did read all of your posts though, and I appreciate the help. I'm not sure which option I'm going to use for this, but you all have given more than enough to do what I want, so thank you all.

So if you must know, the inspiration for this is the Stone Mask from The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.

A basic description for its powers is that it makes the wearer as uninteresting as a basic rock in a field of rocks. You are very much still visible though, as some creatures (minibosses and bosses) can still see you, with the Gerudo Pirate minibosses claiming something along the lines of the mask being impressive, but it won't work on them, suggesting they can easily make their Will Save to disbelieve the illusion, due to being powerful enough to count as a miniboss.

Now I don't want to make the mask necessarily. I just like the concept of not actually being invisible, but people THINK you are invisible.

This means it wouldn't be a glamer spell like the normal Invisibility spell, as you aren't actually invisible.

Is there any way to do this? I'd also accept the ability having an HD limit, like how the Sleep spell does, if there is a way to do that instead.

porting it to another plane doesn't work as a long plan option anymore. not since it became a herald.

see 'Azothath' link above:

"Herald, Tarrasque
...
...
(go to bottom of age)
...
...
Herald Subtype: Heralds are unique representatives of their respective gods and sometimes have a specific outsider subtype such as “devil” or “psychopomp” that grants it additional abilities. A herald has the following traits.

Always Armed (Su) ...

...
Emissary (Ex) Heralds can always be summoned by the faithful using greater planar ally or gate, regardless of limitations of that spell, even if it’s not an outsider."

one gate by a true follower of Rovagug and he's back to munching cities.

That doesn't work. Despite being a Herald, the Tarrasque doesn't have the Herald subtype.

This is because the Tarrasque is way, way more powerful than the standard CR 15 Herald.

In fact, the only way to summon the Tarrasque is through Mythic Spawn Calling, which obviously requires you to be Mythic, as it takes 16 uses of Mythic Power to specifically summon the Tarrasque.

That will probably work, actually. There is even a Scaling Item version of the Necklace of Fireballs, Necklace of Infernos, that I could get, which has the ability to regrow the beads after a week, or after a day at level 18.

Thank you.

False Teeth

I want them to explode after moving, like Joker's from Batman: Arkham Asylum, when you play as him.

I don't necessarily want to actually play as Joker though, as I'd need access to guns, even if I'd only ever plan on firing one bullet per combat, as playable Joker in the challenge maps of Arkham Asylum only has a single bullet for his gun, which I can represent by using a Legacy Arrow (in the form of a Bullet) from the Scaling Items of Pathfinder Unchained, which stop working for some time after being fired, explaining why I only have the one shot.

But anyways, exploding teeth. Is this possible? Maybe a Delayed Blast Fireball would work, placing the bead inside the Clockwork Teeth, but that would technically be a house rule, or alternatively, would have a 25% chance of detonating prematurely, per the rule of picking up the bead and throwing it if it hasn't exploded yet.

Thank you all for the help. I'm going to add what I found looking into this, in case anyone looks at this thread later on:

Wreath of Blades.

It is a spell that is actually pretty on par with both the mechanics AND flavor/fluff of the Infinite Sword Glitch, though of course obviously not at the same intensity.

Look up the "Infinite Sword Glitch" in The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, and its sequel, Majora's Mask.

I want to do that basically. Obviously not at the same intensity (its called "Infinite" because while it obviously has a hard technological limit, it is such a high number, that nothing survives more than a moment getting hit by it, so may as well be infinite), but something like that is what I want to do.

I'm willing to consider GM only options, as I sometimes am the GM, but would prefer if this could be done by someone of the good alignment, and thus by a player character.

Also, if Mythic can do this, I'd like to know about it, even if I most likely won't get the chance to do it, just to know my options in the event I do get to play in a Mythic game.

Reksew_Trebla wrote:

mehs wrote:

OmniMage wrote:

Eagle Cape

Feather fall - at will: 2000 gp
Beast shape 1 (eagle only) - 1/day: 6000 gp
+5 bonus on perception (in eagle form only): 2500 gp

In addition to that, it gives a fly speed of 80 when using beast shape 1, which is normally limited to fly 30. I would be tempted to raise the price because of that. I would lower the price of the skill bonus because its limitations.

Total: 10500 gp.

However, its priced at 7000 gp, so maybe the designer thought the item a lower price to be worth buying.

The beast shape being restricted to certain animals is an ad hoc restriction with an unknown price reduction. Oh and note it's beast shape as the spell plus the restriction of eagles only, so you only get 30 ft fly speed. Instead I calced the other two abilities, ring of feather fall and eyes of the eagle with the "50% increase for different abilities", and it came out to ~7000 right there with no room for the beast shape no matter what the price reduction was. Whereas if you calc them as similar abilities, you still have room for some ad hoc discount for the beast shape only turning you into a single specific animal.

For cloak of the hedge mage, I calced them as use activated. The 1800 vs 2000, which brings it to 2,520, within rounding range, etc.

This is flat out false. A spell that normally has more options never gets reduced in price for losing those options. Look at every item that has Endure Elements, but ONLY towards heat OR cold, not both. They still have the full cost of the spell, despite the fact that you are only benefiting from half of the spell

I'm having difficulty finding example of endure elements items that protect only from heat or cold that don't have so many odd effects that make pricing them hard. Can you provide some examples?

There's the Scaling Item Crystal Tiara. At its starting version, it only has Endure Elements as an ability, but only towards cold climates, yet it has the full market price of 1,000 gp of the full spell being on it. I haven't looked much more than that, because I actually asked about that, here I think, and the consensus was that it was priced correctly.

EDIT: It actually seems like the consensus in that thread was to argue about physics and why it makes sense that additional/multiplied increases in healing effects have an exponential increase in price to make. Yeah, no wonder I stopped looking into it after that.

OmniMage wrote:

Eagle Cape

Feather fall - at will: 2000 gp
Beast shape 1 (eagle only) - 1/day: 6000 gp
+5 bonus on perception (in eagle form only): 2500 gp

In addition to that, it gives a fly speed of 80 when using beast shape 1, which is normally limited to fly 30. I would be tempted to raise the price because of that. I would lower the price of the skill bonus because its limitations.

Total: 10500 gp.

However, its priced at 7000 gp, so maybe the designer thought the item a lower price to be worth buying.

The beast shape being restricted to certain animals is an ad hoc restriction with an unknown price reduction. Oh and note it's beast shape as the spell plus the restriction of eagles only, so you only get 30 ft fly speed. Instead I calced the other two abilities, ring of feather fall and eyes of the eagle with the "50% increase for different abilities", and it came out to ~7000 right there with no room for the beast shape no matter what the price reduction was. Whereas if you calc them as similar abilities, you still have room for some ad hoc discount for the beast shape only turning you into a single specific animal.

For cloak of the hedge mage, I calced them as use activated. The 1800 vs 2000, which brings it to 2,520, within rounding range, etc.

This is flat out false. A spell that normally has more options never gets reduced in price for losing those options. Look at every item that has Endure Elements, but ONLY towards heat OR cold, not both. They still have the full cost of the spell, despite the fact that you are only benefiting from half of the spell

This is purely for fun, of course, as Pathfinder is a game, not real life (even with the fact that World War I Earth exists in Pathfinder).

I discovered a possible way to break physics yesterday, but it is next to impossible to pull off.

For the Drawbacks options of Cursed Items, one of them says "Temperature around item is 10° F cooler than normal."

Well if the temperature is -459.67° F to -450.67° F, then having such an item would break physics. Because that would make it less than 0° Kelvin, which is scientifically impossible.

Anyways, are there other ways to break physics?

Quote:

First, the subject gains a +2 deflection bonus to AC and a +2 resistance bonus on saves.

...
Second, the subject immediately receives another saving throw (if one was allowed to begin with) against any spells or effects that possess or exercise mental control over the creature (including enchantment [charm] effects and enchantment [compulsion] effects, such as charm person, command, and dominate person.
...

Third, the spell prevents bodily contact by evil summoned creatures. This causes the natural weapon attacks of such creatures to fail and the creatures to recoil if such attacks require touching the warded creature.

The range of the magical barrier doesn't matter, it protects only the warded creature and his equipment (as long as it doesn't stick too far from his body). Other creatures aren't protected.

Sticking to the text of the spell makes all other questions redundant.

If you and your GM want to play it non-RAW, the one answering your questions should be the GM. I would refer to Magic Vircle against Evil yo decide how it works.

It also says in the third effect that if the warded creature tries to force the barrier against the summoned creature, they become immune to it. If they are only effected by the ward when attacking the warded creature, this text would serve no purpose, as it would be redundant. This means that while RAW, you are right, RAI, the intent was they can't get past the barrier at all, regardless of what creature they are specifically attacking.

But again, you are right under RAW, so let's try this: the Sprite Familiar is a weirdo who, instead of hiding in a pocket, hides in the master's mouth (maybe using a Large race instead of Medium if the Sprite wouldn't fit, or maybe a Medium race under Enlarge Person, again, if the Sprite wouldn't fit normally). In order to hit the Sprite, when the master's mouth is open, most creatures would still make some form of bodily contact with the master (who is the warded creature) in the process. Since summoned creatures of prohibited alignment cannot make bodily contact with the warded creature (literally the first sentence of the third effect), this would mean that they can't hit the Sprite, right?

Now, assuming that is true, let's say the Sprite attacks the summoned creature using either their Daze, or Color Spray SLA. Is the barrier still working against the summoned creature or not?

So I'm looking at the Protection From Chaos/Evil/Good/Law spells, and they say they create a barrier that is 1 foot from the creature you cast it on. A Sprite Familiar (but possibly other Diminutive/Fine sized Familiars) are approximately proportional to humans in terms of shape and size, and since they are only 9 inches tall, this means they are definitely less than a foot thick, so if they were in their master's pocket when he casts this spell on himself, what would happen?

I'm going to list more specific questions now, like what happens if an evil summoned creature tries to attack the Sprite when they are inside the barrier of a Protection From Evil spell cast on their master?

Technically, the spell is only supposed to work on the creature it was cast on, but the barrier flat out prevents an evil summoned creature from passing it, unless the master attacks the summoned creature or tries to force the barrier on it, in which case it becomes immune to the barrier.

Okay, maybe that is an obvious one. I would rule on the spot that the Sprite is protected. But now let's say the Sprite shoots their bow at the e.s.c. (evil summoned creature), while benefiting from the barrier. Let's also say the master has NOT attacked the e.s.c. nor tried to force the barrier on it. Does the barrier still work against the e.s.c.?

Another angle, if the barrier protects the Sprite from an e.s.c. despite being cast on the master, do the other protections of the barrier work on the Sprite while they are within the barrier?

I've never had a player, myself included, try this, so I've never had to think about this possibility, but I was looking at spells while considering having a Sprite Familiar, or maybe Guardian Spirit Sprite instead, decided to look at the Protection From Alignment spells, since I often forget exactly what they do, and that's when I thought up of this conundrum.

I was going to stay out of this, but there is nothing in the rules that state regeneration will do this. If you choose to do this in your game that is your right as the GM under rule zero. But to claim this is RAW is incorrect, this is a house rule.

The subject's severed body members (fingers, toes, hands, feet, arms, legs, tails, or even heads of multiheaded creatures), broken bones, and ruined organs grow back.

That seems pretty clear cut that the Regenerate spell restores a broken body.

Reksew_Trebla wrote:

Broken Soul Template

So a Regenerate spell from a level 13 Cleric should...

you posit a GM Dramatic/game story question. Then assume a Regenerate spell will remove the template. This shows that you really don't understand the issue at hand.

It will take a story/adventure to overcome this dramatic hurdle and resolve when the GM feels it should after suitable trials and successes. An example would be the story of Valais in the PFS 1 Scenarios.

While you can create a PC backstory using various information, that is not what the templates are for.

Regenerate fixes broken bodies, while Wish, Miracle, Limited Wish, Greater Restoration, Heal, and Psychic Surgery all fix broken minds. That is literally the sum total of what makes a Broken Soul a Broken Soul. As for the possible alignment change (which isn't even guaranteed, since the Broken Soul template only says they are usually Chaotic Evil), that can be solved with roleplaying rehabilitating them with trusted NPC allies (or maybe retiring the PC so they can rehabilitate the wife/daughter themself, which I am also considering).

I get that this is not how you would run this, but this is how this works by the rules.

Vindictive Bastard, Sin Monk, Channeler of the Unknown, Planar Extremist, Heretic, Ronin.

Before I start, this is something that I don't think I'll ever get around to using, but I already put in a lot of work just to make it work with the rules, including the story for how this happens, so I am sharing this with all of you in the hopes that someone can make use of it.

If you haven't noticed the theme, it's basically a lack of commitment to your classes. The first four are archetypes that (I think) require you to start as an actual member of the actual class (though you can have archetypes as normal), and when you become an ex class member, you can immediately switch to the ex class archetype.

The fifth archetype can be taken right from the beginning, but, with GM permission, can be swapped to if you become an ex inquisitor.

The last one, the cavalier/samurai one is just a bonus, since you never become an ex cavalier/samurai, but follows the same theme since you become an ex order member.

As for how this would work, it would work like this, levelwise:

1: Paladin

2: Monk

3: Cleric of LG Deity

4: Inquisitor of LG Deity

5: Switch to NG, Druid, Ex Paladin/Monk-> Vindictive Bastard Paladin and Sin Monk.

6: Cavalier/Samurai. Order doesn't matter, but in the interest of keeping with the theme, you'll have to make use of/follow the order for at least one battle, if not a whole level. At this level or next switch to Ronin.

7: Which class gets the level doesn't matter much. Become CG, Ex Cleric/Inquisitor/Druid-> Channeler of the Unknown Cleric, Heretic Inquisitor, and Planar Extremist Druid. If not already a Ronin, switch to it this level.

Proceed with taking levels with what fits best for this monstrosity.

In a gestalt game, it would look something like this:

1: Paladin//Monk

2: Cleric of LG Deity//Inquisitor of LG Deity

3: NG, Druid (Change Paladin to Vindictive Bastard)//Cavalier or Samurai (Change Monk to Sin Monk). This level or next become Ronin.

4: CG, which class gets the level doesn't matter much (Switch Druid to Planar Extremist/Switch Cleric to Channeler of the Unknown)//which class gets the level doesn't matter much (Switch Inquisitor to Heretic/if not already, switch Order to Ronin).

Proceed with what works best.

Now before I continue, I know that is a sudden shift from Lawful to Chaotic, especially if Fast Level up XP is used, but it doesn't have to be quite that fast. There are plenty of levels that can be used as filler levels where no change in alignment occurs to make it more smooth of a transition.

I also know this is spread thin, but whatever.

For some actual story of how this could work:

Start off as LG Paladin. You strongly believe in the good of people, but also the authority of people. You then start disciplining yourself to better help people. You are now also a Monk. You are so much in love with your Deity's teachings, as they align with your beliefs, that you learn how to benefit from them, in various ways. You are now a Cleric and Inquisitor.

But then, disaster strikes. You are rudely awoken to the harsh reality of people being more inclined to evil than good. Whether this is true or not is irrelevent, as you've seen some bad stuff. Maybe you took a trip to Cheliax. Maybe you saw a cult legally sacrifice a small child because they were a slave the cult purchased, and you were nearly deemed a criminal for trying to stop them. Whatever this rude awakening is doesn't matter. You switch to NG.

You are now a Vindictive Bastard, and you give up your self discipline in your anger, making you also a Sin Monk. You turn to nature, as nature is not evil, due to not having people. You are a Druid.

You also find some somewhat like minded people and join their order. You are a Cavalier or Samurai.

However, your troubles don't end here. You soon learn that just because nature is primarily filled with animals and plants, doesn't mean intelligent life doesn't live in it. In fact, you come upon the most important realization: Nature created people. You are repulsed by this fact, and turn to the planes. You switch to CG. You are now a Planar Extremist.

But in doing so, you fall out of favor with your Deity. While you continue to pray, they don't answer you. But something has been watching you. Something else grants you powers now. You are now a Channeler of the Unknown.

You mistake this as your Deity answering you, so with your new teachings, you become a heretic of your old faith. You are now a Heretic.

You also get into a disagreement with your order, and decide to forge your own path instead of binding yourself to a specific group. After all, you have learned that the authority of people is illegitimate. You are now a Ronin.

Anyways, I hope someone can find some use of this. You don't have to use all 6 classes for this, I just wanted to be extra when I was coming up with this. Thanks for reading all that.

The process that creates a broken soul changes the creature in fundamental ways that go beyond the methods used to create it. Its attacks are supernatural abilities not extraordinary abilities. Its mere touch can cause wounds to appear on a creature. This is no longer the creature it was it is a completely new creature. Regeneration or even Heal will not work, because they simply fix the problems that caused the transformation in the first place. Only something that can change the past like a Wish, or a Miracle is going to work.

I would agree with you if it weren't the fact that most people have some inherent magical ability (remember, supernatural abilities are magic in nature). For example, a Fighter that takes his next level in Sorcerer isn't considered a new creature. They always had the potential powers of a Sorcerer, they just never knew how to use those powers till now.

The potential to become a Broken Soul exists in most creatures (of Intelligence 3 or higher) on Golarion, but you'd be very hard pressed to find any human on Earth (Earth during World War I exists in Pathfinder canon, thanks to an AP) that has the potential to become a Broken Soul, and we know this because laws restricting torture didn't always exist, yet no human in Earth's recorded history has ever become a Broken Soul.

So all you have to do is cure the physical and mental damage, and they shouldn't have the trauma anymore. Regenerate can undo the physical damage, and all the spells I previously listed can cure madness/insanity, so can cure the mental damage, so that should work.

The question is now "can you do this earlier than level 13" which I don't think you can. Of course, I could save money for this, and hire a Cleric of level 13 while I am a lower level, but I'll have to find some way to drag the Broken Soul to a Cleric, or get a Cleric to agree to make a house call.

I don’t think a broken soul can be fixed. The transformation is more than just physical torture; it shatters the mind and soul of the target. Regeneration only fixes the physical problems. A wish may be able to do it, but anything less probably is not going to work.

I forgot to mention the mind, but as a form of insanity, it can be cured with the following spells, per the Gamemastery Guide and Horror Adventures:

Wish, Miracle, Limited Wish, Greater Restoration, Heal, and Psychic Surgery.

Broken Soul Template

So a Regenerate spell from a level 13 Cleric should in theory fix their body, but can you help them out reasonably sooner than level 13?

Just writing a character's backstory, and they will have a missing wife or maybe daughter who ends up as one of these, so I was wondering how quickly they could fix her once they are reunited.

Claxon wrote:

Diego Rossi wrote:

The Scrying spell allows you "to observe a creature", and you see a small area around him/her/it. It is not guaranteed that you can recognize the location. Pathfinder has very few ways to scry a location.

I only mention scrying because it's explicitly mentioned in the teleport spell as counting "having viewed once".

Sure, maybe you viewed them once, but did you recognize who they were when you saw them, enough to know they are likely someone in a certain place, are they actually, etc. It's still also dubious to say you can teleport with any level of accuracy having only seen an approximately 2,000cuft of space (a 10 ft hemisphere) around the target. Any GM would be remiss to not treat this as an automatic false destination if you've seen just the corner of a room. Oh and that's if somehow they fail your scry DC of 5+[casting stat] for having no knowledge of the target.

Any GM that did that would be using a house rule. Seeing as this is the Rules Questions forum, house rules are not a valid answer.

Teleport says Scrying counts as viewing once, not Scrying counts as viewing once only if you saw a noteworthy section of the area.

Oli Ironbar wrote:

No, more of a 10th level spell of the cheese school. Your character dies and you bring in their twin brother/sister, who looks a lot like them except for [insert distinguishing facial feature] and has the exact same stats and abilities.

Ah not what I'm after that I want this character to survive not introduce a twin.

If you are high enough level that you can pay to revive them, just bring in their brother or sister who is a cleric that "happened" to be in the area just as your character died, use their starting wealth on the diamond dust necessary to cast the ressurection, do so then return the sibling to NPC status and resume playing your original character.

Contact typically means you are directly touching it. Wearing gloves would protect you from the damage when holding them. Using a metal knife and fork to eat would cause damage because you are putting it in your mouth. Technically you could avoid it by being extremely careful, but you will probably drop food or accidently touch the utensil when you eat. Using soup spoon would be nearly impossible. You could use wood or silver utensils to avoid this.

Wearing metal armor also prevents you from casting spells, so that will also have to be dealt with. This is more than arcane armor failure; it is a total inability to cast spells while wearing metal armor. Some modern clothes may cause similar problems.

While I'm glad to note that I could hold steel items when wearing gloves, I didn't even consider that I still couldn't use steel utensils due to them touching my mouth. Also, I never considered the metal on some clothing, like zippers, possibly counting as metal armor. It'd be really bad if I had to take off my pants- or during winter, my coat- just to cast spells.

Oof. Yeah, this is a big yikes from me.

Thanks for the help.

Green Whispers

So it says "contact with either metal (iron and steel) deals 1d3 points of damage each round". If I had this Unique Patron, would I be safe and avoid the damage if I wore gloves so that I didn't directly touch iron or steel, or would it still affect me?

The reason I'm asking is stupid, but I'm imagining myself gaining Pathfinder levels, and I'm trying to find something nature related that also gives a Familiar, since I love my cat and would want her to benefit from this too, while also wanting to protect nature (I'm imagining that I am gifted this power by nature), so I saw this, but then, I don't know if I'd be willing to give up ever holding steel. Iron is okay, since it is uncommon for things to be made of pure iron in modern days, but a significant amount of things are made of steel in modern Earth, so if I can never hold those things again, I'll have to find a different option than this.

Thank you in advance for the help.

If you're still looking for ideas, might I suggest:

Brute Vigilante 8//Alchemist 7/Master Chymist 1?

Take levels of Brute only on the Vigilante side, and take more levels in Master Chymist on the Alchemist side, until you have ten levels in it, then take the remaining levels in Alchemist.

You have two alternate forms. What's more, nothing in them prevents you from assuming both of these forms at the same time. You are basically the Incredible Hulk, including his history of having multiple personalities/forms and even his history of combining forms.

Of course, be prepared to have the book thrown at you, as you could attack your fellow PCs due to the Brute form's rules. And a possible reading of both the Mutagenic form and Brute form, when assuming both at once, could require you to pass both forms' saving throws at once to return to normal form, instead of doing them individually.

In before someone mentions using Kn Nobility to scry the leaders of exotic locations to "have seen a location" to try and teleport there, and the ensuing discussion of why political leaders getting randomly scried and high level magical nobodies (to the population of the destination) just suddenly, frequently, and randomly appearing in court rooms is hilarious breach of sensible decorum.

Just scry on the noble, then separately scry on the lower class people that were nearby, and wait until they are outside castle walls to scry on them again, in a public location. You will get funky looks for randomly teleporting in the middle of the town square, but as long as magic is known about and not illegal in that kingdom, everyone will be go about their business as usual.

so, first off, fluff is not rules.

Second, Order of the Green is a requirement of the Green Knight Archetype. Both Herolab and the PFSRD seem to back this up, and as such, I'm pretty sure there's no FAQ or Errata about this.

It seems you are trying to read way too much into Fluff.

Look, I'll buy that as an answer, but all I'm saying is you shouldn't be allowed to write a description of something if that description is not true. So I'm not at fault for thinking the description they wrote of the class is a description of the class.

Hear me out. I'm writing this from memory, as I don't have the book with me right now, but there is a rule that outranks even the authority of the GM. Since Rule 0 is meant to be the one rule above them all, this means this rule I am about to remind you of would actually be Rule 0.

That rule, is the rule that determines the GM's role in the game, and thus who even gets to be the GM. Again, I'm writing this from memory, but the text says something like this: It is the GM's responsibility to keep a balance of fair but also fun in the game.

So yeah, if the GM is not being fair or fun, technically, they are breaking the rules, as this rule outranks even the GM, as it determines who gets to even be the GM.

EDIT: In case it wasn't obvious, I'm just venting about the abysmally bad GM I just dealt with. Literally killed the party with "rocks fall, everyone dies," just because my character had a Ring of Sustenance, and didn't need more than 2 hours of sleep, preventing the party from having all of their gear stolen in their sleep.

it's an archtype that is set as part of a specific order. even if his ideals work long side other orders. he is a green knight of the green order. not just any fey\nature venturing cavalier.

just like the pathfinder prestige classes are meant to be agents of the pathfinders, the mantis assassins working for their cabal or the Aspis agents for Aspis society.
it's not an archtype that is set only by a way of doing things. it's a sect dedicated specifically to this one order.

The OotG has absolutely nothing to do with Fey though. Even the Green Knight Archetype only deals with Fey in the sense that they supposedly get blessed by Fey powers to have Vorpal on any slashing weapon they use.

There is absolutely no valid reason to say they serve Fey when they don't. And before you say they could still serve Fey non-mechanically, the Archetype says they protect nature OR serve Fey, not both. If they serve Fey without protecting nature, they are breaking their Edicts as a member of the OotG.

The description flat out doesn't work unless they can choose between OotG or OotB. Or maybe be a weird combo of the two like that Cavalier Archetype Sister-in-Arms.

Some knights serve nature itself and can be found protecting unspoiled natural places or serving fey beings.

The cavalier knows his place in the natural order and strives to defend the balance of nature. He must be willing to allow nature to take its course, and he must stop all those who would do harm to its delicate balance. He will not tolerate aberrant creatures, undead, or the irresponsible and greedy consumption of natural resources. He may be farsighted and seek to establish agreements that lead to lasting protection of the natural world, but resorts to violence if it is the most effective way to enforce such protection.

The cavalier cannot refuse a fey’s request for aid unless it will interfere with his existing duties, or he believes the fey seeks to directly oppose his other aims and goals. He must strive to prevent gates to the First World from being exploited or corrupted. If the cavalier encounters blighted fey or other corrupted fey, he must strive to destroy them.

If you look at the fluff description for Green Knight it says they protect natural places OR serve fey being.

If you look at the Edicts of OotG, it says you protect nature.

If you look at the Edicts of OotB, it says you serve fey.

OotB already existed when the Green Knight Archetype was created, so you can't say it just didn't exist yet, because it did. Yet Green Knight only allows you to have the OotG.

Is this an oversight that has been addressed, or am I being dumb?

What I found interesting about the Green Knight is that it doesn't just allow a player to replace a ton of the Cavalier's class features, but gives them a chance to jettison the "knight trope" altogether in favor of an antagonist from the Arthurian mythos--albeit with an entirely different thematic context (a knight of the Green Order protecting nature or serving the fey, as opposed to a knight transformed by a witch to test other knights).

I think it is in reference to the Green Faith, The Green Mother, or both, which are both divine sources for nature worshipers. The Green Faith being the personification of nature itself (though is not actually an entity), and The Green Mother being an Eldest (Fey Deity) of nature.

First of all, thank you all for the quick reply.

@tottemas -> that's a really interesting archetype that I wasn't aware of, thank you for this! I'll probably use it for other game! Although, I don't really like to loose the sneak attack with it.

@belafon -> these are what I usually do. For exemple, right now I'm doing a Fighter (Tower Shield Specialist)/Kineticist but I wanted to see what else was out there. There's so many stuff and even if I read lots of it, I haven't touched everything yet.

@Melkiador -> I love the Summoner/paladin idea. I'm working on a build as I write that and it looks promising! I'll look into your other suggestion afterwards

@Deathlessone -> I glance over what you sent, but they are classes I'm not too familiar with and I'll have to look deeper into it before making a real idea about it, sorry >_<

@Reksew_Trebla -> Wow that is quite the build! Although very interesting, my DM sadly won't allow it. I won't use it as my own character, but if I ever need to make a BBEG for a game I'll dm, I may keep it stashed somewhere *evil laugh*

@gm turin -> ?!

May I ask why they won't allow it? Everything I listed is first party Pathfinder.

EDIT: In either case, if you use this for an evil NPC, replace one Vestigial Arm's hand with a Maniac Hand. Along with some other stuff, it'll give you an extra attack, and Vestigial Arms, despite not giving extra attacks on their own, are noted as being able to make attacks in place of a normal arm, though again, this is an extra attack. It has to be an evil NPC, because the Maniac Hand is technically a cursed item that forces you to sacrifice innocent creatures every now and then, otherwise it will try to make you its sacrifice.

Also, consider replacing the last Vestigial Arm's hand with the artifact Nargrym's Steel Hand, just cause you can since you'll be the GM.

Constructed Pugilist 20//Jistkan Artificer 20

Play a Kasatha, who start with four arms, and can make extra attacks with each arm thanks to Multiweapon Fighting. There is also Multiweapon Defense and Multiweapon Specialist to consider.

You can also replace your extra two arms and your two legs with Clockwork Prosthesis.

If you do this, I'd recommend some levels of Clocksmith Wizard, which lets you take any familiar you qualify for, and make it a Clockwork Construct instead of what it would normally be. If you do this, you really should take the feat Hand's Detachment, and its prerequisites, which would make one of the Clockwork Prosthesis hands be possessed, detach from your arm, and become your familiar, which is now a Clockwork Construct thanks to the Clocksmith Wizard levels. Don't forget to add the Mauler archetype to your Hand Familiar, to make it extra strong, and if you do so, take the feat Mauler's Endurance to give it extra HP. Don't forget that due to the author's statement, the Mauler's Battle Form is a Polymorph effect. Since the Hand Familiar is Diminutive, it gets a +6 to Strength and -4 to Dexterity, per the Polymorph rules, on top of the changes for the Battle Form.

If you go down this path, you can replace the hand on the Clockwork Prosthesis with a Wizard Hook, and just have the hand familiar always detached. A Wizard Hook lets you cast spells through it in a similar way to how Magus do so with their weapons, so you can cast your Wizard Spells through it and get free attacks from the process.

Look into getting Alchemist levels on the side that does NOT have Wizard, up to four levels, to get two Vestigial Arms, so you can have a Shield and a free hand for potions, wands, etc, and look into (at a later level since it will put the total starting gp over what you specified when added with everything else) Arms of the Marilith which can give you extra Attacks of Opportunity.

Anyways, thanks for reading this far. Hope you like playing what is essentially a Construct Cyborg.

I'm looking at Green Knight (Cavalier Archetype), and I'm pretty sure it replaces and alters more class features of Cavalier than Samurai does, yet Samurai is the Alternate Class and Green Knight is only an Archetype.

Anyways, are there any other Archetypes like this?

I borrowed a copy of the book (my city library somehow had a copy) and unless I missed something, no, the Dryad doesn't have special rules saying it is exempt from the Druid alignment restriction. However, that same book also says that Nymphs often take levels of Druid, despite also being CG, so I'm inclined to believe there is a rule somewhere, whether or not it was ever published, that says Fey can be Druids regardless of what alignment they are, as long as they continue to revolve around nature, or something to that effect, because Fey in Pathfinder are stated to have a strong connection to nature and whatnot.

Can't say I have, buuuut, I have wanted to drop a build because it outshined everyone else, due to me having better system mastery.

In fact, with my first group, I would avoid spellcasters as much as I could, because I didn't want to outplay everyone else. I was actually outshining them as a martial character in fact. The GM tried to limit options to the books he owned, so I just bought him new books with stuff I wanted for his birthday and for Christmas.

Unfortunately, that GM, who was engaged to my mom, was a pain killer addict, who was only with my mom to "borrow" pain killers from her. In fact, while I unfortunately don't have proof, with this fact known, I know he stole pain killers from his own patients in the nursing home he worked in, because multiple times someone "forged" his signature in the style of a different employee's handwriting, and everytime he refused to press charges, maybe cause a police investigation would prove it was him all along. Yeah, it was him that stole those pills. So yeah, I no longer am a part of that Dinkleberg's group.

Constantly.

It's why I started avoiding spellcasters in general and tend to play extremely recklessly... and quit playing with a particular GM who would always run the GM-as-antagonist style and basically just hard-counter, or worse just ape, my character (and unsurprisingly have "we're just not going to play that anymore" be the "good ending" for their campaigns).

It's a big part of why I don't play certain systems anymore, PF1 included. I absolutely hate having to deliberately avoid options because they have too much impact on game-play. I know some people like the feeling of being able to sandbag until some crazy moment and then pull out their actual power to win, but for me it feels like sitting down to play Super Mario Bros and trying not to push the jump button.

There is an entire large community dedicated to playing Mario games with as little "A" presses as possible (A typically being the jump button in Mario games).

So uh, bad example there dude.

Alright then. Thank you both for the help.

Amalya

She is CG, a Druid, and not a Planar Extremist Druid.

I know it makes perfect sense from an in-universe perspective, but from a mechanical rules perspective, this shouldn't be possible.

However, I do not own Fey Revisited, the book she was published in, so maybe they addressed this in that book. Would someone please let me know what I'm missing?

I think Clocksmith wizard is a better option myself. I’m not too keen on having the hands normal stats overwritten with the Clockwork Spy’s stats but I figured I’d include it anyway. With the Wizard option familiar archetypes are more viable as you won’t lose them because of becoming an improved familiar like you would with Tinkerer. I think it would be funny but not practical to take Mauler for the hand and make it grow to medium size :)

Oh I'm aware of the awesomeness of a Mauler Hand Familiar. If you play as a Small race, you can ride your own hand using that combo.

One item I can think of to suggest is the magic item Arms of the Marilith. This would grant you an additional 4 clockwork arms that you can strap on. A generous GM might let you implant the arms rather than wear them. I guess you could get them made as a magic item tattoo and then the arms would be attached to you but that would add cost to an already pricey item. Also Clockwork Armor might be a cool addition but again a fairly pricey item.

I like both of these suggestions.

Alternative to a clockwork hand you could get a removable clockwork eye by combining Eyebiter Mesmerist and Clocksmith Wizard. A cool addition to this would be to give it the Elemental Familiar archetype and choosing fire as the element. Then you could have your eye shoot fire at enemies (note that this should work even while attached as it functions as a tumor familiar and nothing in the text of tumor familiar prevents the tumor from taking actions while attached). It would also gain the ability to speak its elemental language.

This is interesting, but I think I like the Clockwork Hand Familiar better.

Anyways, thank you for all the help.