Commencing Battle - Stealth Mode

[Ravingdork]

So not impossible, just improbable. Yuck.

[NorrKnekten]

That ofcourse also relies on the GM ignoring the whole idea behind the noticed during the first turn, But as said. The GM has the power to rule as they see fit for the circumstance so as long as they make actual adjustments to rules to fit a previous adjustment or ruling that is all fine.

And yeah Assassinate was never really a good feat, Its not impossible or improbable to get it off(I believe against an on level enemy you its roughly 35% chance you get noticed before using it, either by their initiative being higher or you rolling under their DC.

But the whole Assassin archetype is so close to just being the rogue archetype with the extra steps of having to mark targets before combat. (I certainly would never mark someone while in combat unless I had nothing else to do)

[Captain Morgan]

I mean you can use it semi-frequently if your party lets you scout ahead so you can Mark people before combat begins. I just haven't found scouting to be as popular in PF2, which I blame partially on misunderstandings like many in this thread around how the stealth rules work.

It's kind of like snares or switch hitting. They are really really good if your party cooperates, and nearly useless if your party does not.

Edit: the archetype adds a fair amount of raw combat power, but it's namesake ability is one of those things that usually works better for NPCs.

[NorrKnekten]

Yeah, it adds plenty of damage if you actually get the mark.
Sneak attack is no joke, Backstabber is no joke, Suprise attacker also is no joke.

But thats also available elsewhere without the need for a setup to enjoy Sneak Attack.

[Captain Morgan]

Huh, I missed that they changed that in the remaster. You used to get backstabber and deadly d6 against marked targets, and had to take an additional feat that granted sneak attack against all targets.

That's probably a good change. Assassin felt overtuned and overused pre-remaster. It was one of those things that made me say "hey y'all unrestricted free archetype is less balanced than we like to pretend." Flurry ranger with an animal companion and assassin really shredded stuff.