This is a branch off of my previous thread.
But, what APs would work well in Pathfinder 2nd Edition?
Following on, despite the Lost Omens World Guide presuming outcomes for the PF1E APs, which ones would still work in the new timeline?
Wrath of the righteous of course, because of the videogame popularity. Might also be a nice drop for when they'll reintroduce the mythic system in PF2.
The runelord trilogy of course is iconic, altho I'd say that it's more likely that paizo skip the shattered star since it's the least popular of the three (altho I'd like if they also adapt it). Also with xanderghul appearing on the new gamemaster core, it's likely that the special "nostalgic" 200 special AP is based around runelord too and him in particular somehow, so having these remaster could help bring new player "up to speed".
Curse of crimson throne is almost as iconic as rise of the runelord, so it's a likely candidate too. Second darkness was impopular (for good reason), but people express interest in seing it "remake" quite often, and I recall james jacob saying that it's one of the AP he would like to have a second go at the most, so it may also be likely.
Other than that, it's a lot less certain, I feel like a remade jade regent, or skull and shackle are the most likely, but don't really have reason why.
I'm running CotCT using a conversion kindly provided by a Reddit forum member and it's been working well for the most part. Haven't really had to do more than I'd do for most AP's I've run.This is a branch off of my previous thread.
But, what APs would work well in Pathfinder 2nd Edition?
Following on, despite the Lost Omens World Guide presuming outcomes for the PF1E APs, which ones would still work in the new timeline?
I don't dispute that the stories of most APs would convert quite well - but the setting has also changed to be less "Eurocentric."
I've also kind of ignored the PF2 changes to the world of Golarion, and instead use my preferred 'frozen in amber' campaign as of start of Runelords. I notice this is a trend for me across pretty much all settings - I always preferred Grey Box Forgotten Realms to later versions, Dark Sun 1st-edition boxed set to post Prism Pentad etc. Must be something wrong with me...
I also prefer many of the "older" settings and stories. Sometimes it seems that the desire to be more progressive results in more bland materials.
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Jade Regent actually <_<
Like book four has dungeon that in 1e is silly out of place high level content wise, but in 2e where its not guaranteed every single high level player character teleports or flies at super speeds, having lot of weak enemies use basic siege defenses actually works decently. So things like "this is the tall wall, this is the room with balancing beams, this is the water encounters on step stones room", that actually works in 2e where players in 1e ignore them.
Thing is 1e loved to use "spam lot of weak mooks" encounters. Lot of them work decently in 2e even if it requires you to add up to level of mooks to -4 or convert them to troops instead.
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I’d sooner see an Iron Gods sequel than a port, but I definitely wouldn’t say no to the latter - getting 2e versions of all those aliens, monsters, and tech would be lovely.
Jade Regent actually <_<
Like book four has dungeon that in 1e is silly out of place high level content wise, but in 2e where its not guaranteed every single high level player character teleports or flies at super speeds, having lot of weak enemies use basic siege defenses actually works decently. So things like "this is the tall wall, this is the room with balancing beams, this is the water encounters on step stones room", that actually works in 2e where players in 1e ignore them.
Thing is 1e loved to use "spam lot of weak mooks" encounters. Lot of them work decently in 2e even if it requires you to add up to level of mooks to -4 or convert them to troops instead.
I have been using troops to make suitable military units in my PF2e-conversion of the Ironfang Invasion adventure part.
Amusingly, I had commented in Lord Fyre's previous thread because I was making that conversion.
I have run Rise of the Runelords, Jade Regent, and Iron Gods under PF1e. Ironically, that was the D&D 3.5 version of Rise of the Runelords that I converted to PF1e using fan-created materials available at d20fpsrd.com. I could convert any of them to PF2e.
For Iron Gods I would rely on another Lord Fyre thread, [Technology] The Wires behind the Magic, for converting the technological items, but I would change the laser pistols to act more like the PF2e firearms and adjust the prices to the PF2e economy. I did convert a zero pistol at PF1 Bloodrager Val Baine Converted to PF2, because I currently have an Ironfang Invasion and Iron Gods crossover.
CorvusMask brought up an important difference between PF1e and PF2e dungeon design. Often a PF1e adventure will run the party through a gauntlet of minions to wear them out before they reach the big boss. Then the module can use a weaker and more predictable boss rather than a stronger boss who would match a full-rested party but might kill them if the dice unfairly favored the boss. Such gauntlets are unnecessary in PF2e. Instead, give the party a chance for a ten-minute break to Treat Wounds and Refocus and they will be almost back to full strength.
For converting the PF1e gauntlets to PF2e, simply make the minions stronger and more flavorful. These encounters will have to be interesting on their own merits.
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Ye say that, but I think severe encounters composed of level -4 to -1 mooks ARE interesting and so are things like dungeon composed of mostly low level mook encounters in close by areas so they can combine into big encounter (note: lot of 1e dungeons work better when run as big single encounter)
Thing is that its fun for players to get breather encounters they are strong at and when there are lot of encounters it really creates that good feel of "players mowing through a fortress"
The main thing that makes it beautiful to me is that low level mooks in 2e can actually be dangerous when they have good tactics. Things like "golem is fighting pcs while small mooks shoot bows from above the bridge" works surprisingly well
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Ye say that, but I think severe encounters composed of level -4 to -1 mooks ARE interesting and so are things like dungeon composed of mostly low level mook encounters in close by areas so they can combine into big encounter (note: lot of 1e dungeons work better when run as big single encounter)
A Severe-threat encounter with level -4 mooks would require 12 of them. Except that my party has seven members, so I would need 21 mooks. That is more opponents than I like to run.
What typically happened in my Ironfang Invasion campaign is that when the party leveled up so that the typical Ironfang units get to level -4, I group four of them together into a troop unit. As troops they become equal level to the party and I have only one quarter as many dice rolls. Over the next four levels, they drop to level -1, level -2, level -3, and level -4. My players like feeling that they are fighting units from the same army but getting better at it.
Thing is that its fun for players to get breather encounters they are strong at and when there are lot of encounters it really creates that good feel of "players mowing through a fortress"
Breather encounters also signal to the party that the location is good for a ten-minute rest, because an enemy that is not defending an area well is probably not patrolling it well either.
I like more flavor on my low-threat encounters, weird and colorful enemies rather than the routine enemies. The Ironfang Invasion module Siege of Stone was part travelogue of going through the underground darklands to a secret ruin below the dwarven city Kraggodan. I left the travelogue part easy because its excitement was about seeing new places and new creatures rather than about challenging combat.
The main thing that makes it beautiful to me is that low level mooks in 2e can actually be dangerous when they have good tactics. Things like "golem is fighting pcs while small mooks shoot bows from above the bridge" works surprisingly well
The math in the PF2e Encounter Budget system becomes less reliable the further the hostile creatures are from the party's level. Level -4 has some uncertainty to its challenge, and level -5 is probably wrong. Thus, I limit myself to creatures from level -4 up to level +3. Due to my oversized party, in theory they could handle a single level +4 monster, but since their weapons might bounce off its high AC too much, I don't really know how tough the combat will be, so I avoid them.
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I do think everyone needs to try out 12 mook melee at least once(though admittedly seven players is such rare situation that I have hard time imagining whether encounter guidelines work even with adjustments) xD But yeah -4, -3, -2, -1 and 0 level difference mooks in any combination is such useful option to have.
Just for additional context, back when I run 1e crimson throne's scarwall? I didn't run it as dungeon crawl, I run it as undead filled siege castle where enemies kept coming after pcs without chance to rest if they stuck to the same area xD
Having run 2e jade regent from levels 1-15 and now having done homebrew for while in book 5, I think people underestimate how fun mook fights are, though I also run things in roll20 which makes it easier to track them all.
But yeah, I don't actually disagree with last point. Thing is that higher level the PCs, better tactics low level mooks need to be effective. It actually goes vice versa, higher level enemies need better tactics from PCs, or PCs are screwed. So PCs with bad tactics can defeat mooks on even playing field, but mooks can really punish the PCs doing that with good tactics. At high levels all enemies in general need better tactics unless they are severe or extreme solo foes, though honestly even extreme solo foe is manageable on high levels due to all amount of "debuffs on save success" spells.