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At level 14 the Geokineticist gets the really cool impulse "Assume Earth's Mantle" which essentially gives you a mech suit made of rocks, which is comparable to heavy armor with a dex cap of 1 (half-plate with lower penalties), and it gives an item bonus to Str like an Apex item does. Your ranged blasts have propulsive and you can take Flexible Blasts to make them Brutal so you can attack with Strength at Range.
So you can eventually have a Geokineticist who doesn't really use Dex for anything except normal dex things.
But:
- You can't turn your mech suit on in the first turn without haste before the 19th level (you need to gather first)
- Your proficiencies for your first 13 levels are all in light armor and unarmored defense, for which you will want at least 16 Dex to max AC on.
Since you can't have as big numbers as you want in every attribute, how do you make a Kineticist that lives with 12 Dex and wants to stay close to people? I'm going to try to do it, but this seems challenging. There's the Sentinel Archetype and getting medium armor from a general feat, but is there a better way?
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Grabbing medium armor should be adequate until you get that Impulse.
Earth also has a couple shield-based impulses until then.
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You don't need to Gather in combat so you should be able to turn it on round one.
So is the basic assumption that Kineticists are going to walk around with their element gathered 100% of the time unless there's a good reason they wanted two hands for something (like to climb a ladder)?
Yeah it's basically like having a weapon drawn. Though I do agree with this post, should have medium armor proficiency from the get go.
I also think that assume Earth's mantle doesn't stack with armor runes, so it's actually a big decrease in armor (probably in exchange for being large)
I also think that assume Earth's mantle doesn't stack with armor runes, so it's actually a big decrease in armor (probably in exchange for being large)
This seems like a thing that ought to get patched with the final pass since the idea should be "you have comparable AC to someone in heavy armor, also Large, and the Apex strength effect."
Yeah that is one of those things about various you gain this armored form things. Most probably count for Unarmored or allow one to use runes that an Unarmored character would use to improve them. But I am not sure all of them give the right wording for that, and that includes this.
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Easy enough yeah?
Human 1 general training to get medium armor prof
Class feat at 2 to take sentinel
And then just ride the plate train all the way to the end.
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I think "the Kineticist is very tanky" is a thing you should be able to do in the class without an archetype. But "the kineticist is strong and not dextrous" is a thing that used to require an archetype (like the Kinetic Knight). But the Kineticist can right out of the box be strong and not dextrous (take Flexible Kineticist as a geokineticist at level 1) but you're so "not-tanky" that "how do you survive" is a real concern.
So the Kineticist is going to start with 16 in Dex or Str, because you want to hit things.
A dex-kineticist spends 5 GP on a chain shirt and gets +5 AC from their armor.
A str-kineticist with a dex of 12 (pretty much as high as you can get it if you want high Str and Con) buys a chain shirt and gets +3 to AC from their armor.
Any kineticist can just buy a shield and spend an action to raise it (you just can't block with it without the shield block feat.) The Geokineticist gets an impulse to raise a shield with their gathered element so they can block with it at zero monetary cost. But if you're relying on shield blocking with rocks to stay alive, that's really going to hurt your action economy (1 action to re-gather, 1 action to raise, so you've got one action left.)
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You don't need to Gather in combat so you should be able to turn it on round one.So is the basic assumption that Kineticists are going to walk around with their element gathered 100% of the time unless there's a good reason they wanted two hands for something (like to climb a ladder)?
Inside of a dungeon, probably, at the ball hosted by the king probably not, pretty much like having a weapon out.
Inside of a dungeon, probably, at the ball hosted by the king probably not, pretty much like having a weapon out.You don't need to Gather in combat so you should be able to turn it on round one.So is the basic assumption that Kineticists are going to walk around with their element gathered 100% of the time unless there's a good reason they wanted two hands for something (like to climb a ladder)?
It feels like "I'm just sitting there juggling candle flames" is a thing you could excuse in any social situation where, for example, someone could justify wearing armor.
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I don't think a Strength kineticist can afford to max Con. They'll be starting with 16 Str and 14 Dex and only be a point behind a Dex build unless they go human.
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One thing I will note is that the "Alternative Ability Scores" variant on page 183 of the GMG is a truly incredible power boost to the Kineticist as you can start with a Str of 18 then spend a single feat to also get that to ranged attacks. So you don't need Dex and you can get Agility high enough to max out light armor.
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This is why I'd love a 12 (or even 10) HP class. Getting hit a lot wouldn't feel so bad if I had more HP similar to a Barbarian. The CON 18 is great, but with an 8 HP class that will have bad AC, it feels wasted.
Alternatively, building in a mechanic that gave recycling temp HP (perhaps whenever I gather an element) would go a long way for survivability and make the class feel like a robust PC.
You don't need to Gather in combat so you should be able to turn it on round one.So is the basic assumption that Kineticists are going to walk around with their element gathered 100% of the time unless there's a good reason they wanted two hands for something (like to climb a ladder)?
There is a skill feat for that: Combat Climber and why wouldn't you have Trained in Athletics? Play a Cliffscale Lizardfolk and you get the feat and trained in the skill for free or a Pine Leshy/Deep Orc for just the feat and all three have stats that fit. Rigger, Ruby Phoenix Enthusiast and Shoanti Name-Bearer backgrounds get you the skill and feat too.
You don't need to Gather in combat so you should be able to turn it on round one.So is the basic assumption that Kineticists are going to walk around with their element gathered 100% of the time unless there's a good reason they wanted two hands for something (like to climb a ladder)?
There is a skill feat for that: Combat Climber and why wouldn't you have Trained in Athletics? Play a Cliffscale Lizardfolk and you get the feat and trained in the skill for free or a Pine Leshy/Deep Orc for just the feat and all three have stats that fit. Rigger, Ruby Phoenix Enthusiast and Shoanti Name-Bearer backgrounds get you the skill and feat too.
The earth kineticist doesn’t need sentinel. You don’t get expert in armor until 13. A human could have heavy armor at level 1. A non human is in a rougher spot, but you have your shield power to survive until level 3.
Having ranged attacks that key off strength and a powerful shield is a unique tank in PF2. I think you can go 16 Str, 12 Dex and 18 con without too much trouble. A 12 wisdom is a fine starting place.
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That's a really good point. So I think the basic sketch is:
Level 1: Con 18, Str 16, Dex 12. Take the earth shield impulse and hope to survive to level 3.
Level 3: Spend a General Feat on Armor Proficiency so you can wear a breastplate and have max AC.
Level 5: Dex 14, so you can trade the breastplate for some scale mail and still have max AC for your class.
Level 10: Dex 16, you can now retrain out of Armor Proficiency and wear Studded Leather for max AC.
Level 13: Expert Proficiency in Light Armor.
Now we just need to figure out how to make the Rock Suit not lower your defenses. Since outside of it, you will now have a +4 Item Bonus to AC with +3 from Dex with +2 to Fort/Reflex/Will from your +2 Greater Resilient Studded Leather. When you put your Rock Suit on you will have a +5 Item bonus to AC with +1 to Dex and +2 to Fort with a circumstantial +2 to Fort/Reflex vs. Trip/Shove.
So when you cover yourself with Rocks:
- Your AC goes down by 1
- Your Will and Reflex saves go down by 2
- You're Large
- You have a Climb Speed
- You get the Apex item effect for Strength.
Other than the last two things, this feels like not a very good feat now. Since "Large" doesn't get you much without Attack of Opportunity and you can already attack with Str at range with a level 1 feat. Humans can take the Versatile heritage and get medium armor at level 1 to have maxed AC their entire careers, but maybe I don't want to be human.