
Faolán Maiali the Azure Abjurer |
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So, I've noticed that there is kind of a BS mechanic with how diseases work, which doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.
Example: Filth fever in the Core Rulebook is listed as DC 12. An Otyugh can inflict filth fever with its attacks, but the DC is 14 because it's based on the Otyugh's HD and Con modifier. Why?
Where is the logic that a disease is harder to overcome just because some powerful creature infected with it attacked you? Does the disease magically become more virulent and dangerous when held by a powerful carrier? What if it was an Otyugh with 20 HD and Con of 30? Why would the DC for a disease jump from DC 12 to DC 30 just because it was transmitted by an attack from a big monster instead of a paper-cut in the sewer?
Does the randomly inflated DC of the disease only apply toward contraction, and not toward healing it with remove disease, lay on hands with a disease mercy, or the Heal skill?
(Background, I'm a bit salty because diseases are nigh impossible to remove in Wrath of the Righteous [PC game] because of a DC 30 disease infecting a level 10 party, requiring a nat 20 to successfully save against a "cure 3 consecutive saves" disease, and requiring a nat 20 to remove with remove disease, and this is on a very easy difficulty, on normal, it would be more like DC 36 or even higher)

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Does the disease magically become more virulent and dangerous when held by a powerful carrier? What if it was an Otyugh with 20 HD and Con of 30?
Yes. It is magic. Most poisons and diseases are harder to save against coming directly from the monstrous source than as something you encounter in the environment. Various classes have abilities to increase potencies of diseases or poisons as they go up in level, it's not just monsters
Does the randomly inflated DC of the disease only apply toward contraction, and not toward healing it with remove disease, lay on hands with a disease mercy, or the Heal skill?
It applies to everything.
(Background, I'm a bit salty because diseases are nigh impossible to remove in Wrath of the Righteous [PC game] because of a DC 30 disease infecting a level 10 party, requiring a nat 20 to successfully save against a "cure 3 consecutive saves" disease,
I have not played the PC game, and your question is better suited for a PC game forum. For a tabletop game I would have a whole bunch of questions: A level 10 mythic party only has fort save bonuses of +10? Can't make a DC30 Heal check to grant a +4 bonus on the throw? Are you using any of the many spells, magic items, or alchemical items that grant saving throw bonuses? Are you using your surges?
and requiring a nat 20 to remove with remove disease, and this is on a very easy difficulty, on normal, it would be more like DC 36 or even higher)
The nat 20 on the spell is right. Remove disease is rarely effective, specifically because it's really hard to boost caster level anywhere near the same rate disease DCs scale.

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At level 10 you are 1 level away from Heal.
Heal "immediately ends any and all of the following adverse conditions affecting the target: ability damage, blinded, confused, dazed, dazzled, deafened, diseased, exhausted, fatigued, feebleminded, insanity, nauseated, poisoned, sickened, and stunned."
Getting a few scrolls of it shouldn't be so hard.
Needing a 20 to save against a DC 30 disease at level 10 with a mythical character is strange, checking a few old character sheets, my old magus (non mythical) had a Fort bonus of +11 and raising it by a few points for a time isn't so difficult.
The increased DC of diseases from a monster with more HDs and higher Constitution can be seen as an effect of quantity, not only quality.
We are continually exposed to small numbers of very dangerous viruses and bacteria with few consequences. The tetanus bacterium travel by air and is present almost everywhere, but in small quantity, so our organism generally resists it. But in some environments the concentration is way higher and the risk of infection is high.
To translate that in Pathfinder rules, a normal sword wound has no discernible chance of causing tetanus, a sword that was smeared with horse feces has the normal chance of causing it (Filth fewer, DC 12), a creature that injects in your bloodstream a concentrated dose can increase the DC by several points, a demonic creature related to disease that does that will make it even more powerful.
I see that as in-game consistent.

Mysterious Stranger |
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One reason could be that a disease that can survive in a creature with a heightened immune system (Higher Con) is more virulent than one from a creature with a lesser immune system. Diseases like all living things mutates over time. Any disease that manages to survive in a powerful creates has probably mutated to something stronger than normal.
I don’t know how the computer game is setup but in a normal mythic campaign at 10th level you should be around tier 5. That would mean your surge should be 1d8 and can be added to a saving throw. You can also use that on your caster level check for remove disease.

Faolán Maiali the Azure Abjurer |
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In the computer game, mythic tiers are nothing like they are in tabletop. There are no surges or daily uses of mythic power. The companions you get only get a mythic ability every odd-numbered tier, and a mythic feat every even-numbered tier (there are no mythic paths for companions, but the general mythic abilities are more expansive overall). The main character gets a bunch of additional powers from a more thematic mythic path (i.e. Angel, Demon, Azata, etc.), but overall, nothing that would really inflate save or skill bonuses to the degree that I needed. The enemies in the game have stat-bloat issues.
For the most part though, the PC game is an excellent, fairly accurate representation of the tabletop game, give or take a couple of mechanics that are difficult to replicate on a computer game.
That said, my rules question did pertain toward the tabletop rules, since both the PC and tabletop version both follow the same affliction rules it seems.
However, the heal spell is an excellent workaround to that problem when it inevitably crops up again (kinda wish remove disease wasn't so pitiful though. I definitely prefer 3.5e's remove disease where "It just works.")
The quantity and mutation explanations help a fair bit, like how being exposed to multiple doses of a poison just ups the DC to resist instead of requiring you to keep track of multiple instances of the same poison, or having a poison distilled and concentrated. Though I'm guessing that means if an adventurer walks into town suffering from a high DC airborne disease contracted from a tough monster, the town is hosed, making the bubonic plague look like allergies.

AwesomenessDog |
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Keep in mind the Owlcat devs were notorious for playing fast and loose with the rules in a "abusive gm" way in Kingmaker. It's the same case here, except now they can mythic buff their guys too.
That said, you should just be able to lesser restoration spam your sick people and wait it out during travel. An inability to pass a DC30 disease and a DC30 disease that attacks your Con are two vastly different hurdles, but being able to just restoration away the Con damage makes the latter just as easy as the former.

Pizza Lord |
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I also haven't played the PC game, so I will just add that, while it sucks to get a disease, in most cases they only cause damage 1/day. Granted, there are numerous differing diseases (just like poisons) and some could be really atrocious, but overall and in general, you're just losing ability points (which sucks, granted), but you're also technically getting 1 back each day (per ability). So even in the absence of lesser restoration or the ability to consistently make the save and clear the disease rather than avoid damage that day, it's not a game-breaker effect.
Sure... I guess it can be a bit strange in some cases... but these (the disease abilities you're discussing) are typically creature abilities, not just typical disease vectors, and as such, they will be stronger. They're usually carriers but not victims.
I highly doubt that a diseased creature with a communicable disease (but not a creature that normally has it) would have their disease DC affected by their Con when transmitting it. For instance, [STD of choice] will likely have a set DC whether you catch it from a 1st-level commoner or an 18th-level barbarian or a person with a Con of 27. Again, unless that's a Special Ability granted by their race or class (but I ain't going there).

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I also haven't played the PC game, so I will just add that, while it sucks to get a disease, in most cases they only cause damage 1/day. Granted, there are numerous differing diseases (just like poisons) and some could be really atrocious, but overall and in general, you're just losing ability points (which sucks, granted), but you're also technically getting 1 back each day (per ability). So even in the absence of lesser restoration or the ability to consistently make the save and clear the disease rather than avoid damage that day, it's not a game-breaker effect.
Sure... I guess it can be a bit strange in some cases... but these (the disease abilities you're discussing) are typically creature abilities, not just typical disease vectors, and as such, they will be stronger. They're usually carriers but not victims.
I highly doubt that a diseased creature with a communicable disease (but not a creature that normally has it) would have their disease DC affected by their Con when transmitting it. For instance, [STD of choice] will likely have a set DC whether you catch it from a 1st-level commoner or an 18th-level barbarian or a person with a Con of 27. Again, unless that's a Special Ability granted by their race or class (but I ain't going there).
While you suffer from a disease you don't recover the ability damage.
Hit point and ability score damage caused by an affliction cannot be healed naturally while the affliction persists.

Pizza Lord |
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While you suffer from a disease you don't recover the ability damage.
CRB wrote:Hit point and ability score damage caused by an affliction cannot be healed naturally while the affliction persists.
Hmm, I was unaware of that. I must have been thinking of 3.5. That's certainly something to keep in mind.

Mudfoot |
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You might want to use the Unchained Diseases and Poisons rules which are somewhat more complex, but a lot more realistic.