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Over the past week or two, I've run repeatedly into comments indicating that they are taking the realms in some wild new direction with 4th ed. However, I've not been able to determine what this is based on, or what this new direction might be. I have, of course, heard about the Succubi, and understand the change there, but will any patient altruist help me understand the rumoured fate of the realms? Thanks in advance,
The fool
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Over the past week or two, I've run repeatedly into comments indicating that they are taking the realms in some wild new direction with 4th ed. However, I've not been able to determine what this is based on, or what this new direction might be. I have, of course, heard about the Succubi, and understand the change there, but will any patient altruist help me understand the rumoured fate of the realms? Thanks in advance,
The fool
This is in part from the prolouge and epilouge of the Orc King by RA Salvatore .... and various quoted tidbits on the net by WotC staff.
. . . and now from the 1384-1385 DR entries in the Grand History of the Realms sourcebook that has come out today.
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The new Grand History of the Realms pretty much tells what happened, but not the aftermath..
Shar and Cyric kill Mystra. As a result the weave goes crazy, Dweomerheart is destroyed. Azuth and Velsharoon go MIA in the Astral Plane as a result, leave no one to restore magic.
Helm and Tyr fight over Tymora. Tyr kills Helm. It's beleived Cyric manipulated it. The House of the Triad is broken and Ilmater removes his domain from it to join Sune in Brightwater.
Tyr, Lanthander, and Sune move against Cyric, imprisioning for a 1,000 years.
Lolth & Eilistraee seem to kill all the Drow gods in their little chest game.
The Orcs establish a permanant Kingdom in the North.
Myth Drannor's mythal is restored. Srinshee returns of Myth Drannor and give Ilsevele Miritar the Rule's Blade to become coronal. Queen Amlaruil returns to Myth Drannor, planting the Treee of Souls there.
Cormyr goes to war with Shade after Alusair executes a spy. Avoun V comes of age and becomes the King. He's having problems with his nobles.
Moradin leads an attack on Hammergrim and destroys it.
Halaster is dead.
Blackstaff is dead.
Selune has been laid to rest, she's really dead now, no longer a ghost.
Elminster is in hiding.
Basically it's all on the last 2 pages of Grand History of the Realms. The last entry is about Mystra dying and Spell Plague, her domain, Cyric, and Azuth and Velsharoon.
The books ends with...
"Sages in centuries to come mark the Weave's destruction in the Year of Blue Fire as the end of the old world, and the terrible beginning of the new."
For a campaign that's NOT going to be a point of light setting, it sure does.
So we don't know the fate of the Chosen of Mystra or the Sever Sisters, we don't really know what happen to the surface Drow, and we don't know how magic is restored to the Realms. Leading speculation; a new Mystra or Ao promotes Elminster, removing him from the land but not from Forgotten Realms.
... And here I'd been saying for years that FR needed a shot in the arm.
And here they go and blow that arm right off.
Damn. Damn. A reason to follow 4e? Maybe? Maybe.
I will be damned. I WILL be damned...
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The new Grand History of the Realms pretty much tells what happened, but not the aftermath..
** spoiler omitted **
Thanks for the spoiler. I wasn't planning on buying the Grand History, but was interested in seeing whether it had anything in it about the coming insanity WotC is going to inflict.
Incidently, over on the WotC boards there was a statement by Ed Greenwood essentially saying that he's content with what they are doing to his world and that he will be happy to see where it goes from there. Alot of the comments that followed were from people saying Ed was setting a great example and being very diplomatic, and he was. I couldn't help but think that - of course he had to be diplomatic, since WotC signs the checks. I would provide a link, but I feel that would be an insult to Paizo's boards.
Blow it up so you can rebuild it seems to be a common theme in RPGs...
Goodbye Realms, it was moderately pleasant knowing ye.
Way to fire that "canon"....
;)
The new Grand History of the Realms pretty much tells what happened, but not the aftermath..
** spoiler omitted **
Thanks for the spoiler. I wasn't planning on buying the Grand History, but was interested in seeing whether it had anything in it about the coming insanity WotC is going to inflict.
Incidently, over on the WotC boards there was a statement by Ed Greenwood essentially saying that he's content with what they are doing to his world and that he will be happy to see where it goes from there. Alot of the comments that followed were from people saying Ed was setting a great example and being very diplomatic, and he was. I couldn't help but think that - of course he had to be diplomatic, since WotC signs the checks. I would provide a link, but I feel that would be an insult to Paizo's boards.
Well actually I can provide a link to Candlekeep, which is where he actually had THO post the response.
Wise Words From Ed About 4th Edition Thread at Candlekeep
Its easier to see the actual post in the above thread, but so that everyone can see what the original post was, it was in this thread initially:
Ask Ed Greenwood 2007 Thread at Candlekeep
I'll let everyone get what they will from the original posts, but I didn't get that Ed was content so much as he doesn't want to abandon his baby quite yet until he knows how much "damage control" 4th edition with require.
Essentially, this really sucks.
I hate all this stuff. It doesn't make sense, it assumes these beings are stupid, and bothers me immensely.
Ok I haven't played in the Realms in probably 15 years so the end results means very little to me. What does seem interesting is that it almost feels that the magic gone aspect fits very well with the complete change to the 4e magic system.
In the words of Sheila Broflowski: "What what what?"
.. I'm switching to Golarion..
Yeah, if Paizo chooses not to switch, I might too, and I have a 20 year game.
Someone just tell me the Symbul bites the big one...I'll be a happy girl.
What about Bane? Where does he fit into all of this?
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Someone just tell me the Symbul bites the big one...I'll be a happy girl.
What about Bane? Where does he fit into all of this?
Funny, I like the Simbul of all the Seven, all the Chosen for that matter. She reflects, to me, what would happen if you were the immortal chosen daughter of a dead goddess. Have you read Silverfall? Or the 2E product Seven Sisters? Both of those, with Ed's fingerprints on them, really entail the level of her insanity. I mean, Terraforming (Torilforming?) Thay into a new land? Changing into something just to grab more wands to kill Red Wizards faster? Threatening to kill powerful forces of order and good (Shandril, Elminster, Mordenkainen, Dalamar to name a few) because she feels their power may be unbalancing?She's insane, and I love her as a character.
EDIT: I'm still miffed we've no idea how Bane got better from 2e-3e I mean they haven't even explained all the cosmology changes and they foist more on us.
Huh. Looks like that rule prohibiting direct deity conflict went right out the window. I knew it was a bad sign when I saw it in that abomination of a series about Lloth's transformation.
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EDIT: I'm still miffed we've no idea how Bane got better from 2e-3e I mean they haven't even explained all the cosmology changes and they foist more on us.What about Bane? Where does he fit into all of this?
Actually, I think they kind of, sort of did explain it. If I remember correctly, they said that Xvim, his son and would-be successor, was basically something akin to an egg. Inside, Bane's essence gestated for a while before completely consuming Xvim and emerging reborn.
If I remember correctly, they said that Xvim, his son and would-be successor, was basically something akin to an egg. Inside, Bane's essence gestated for a while before completely consuming Xvim and emerging reborn.
Yeah, I actually used that for my FR Age of Worms: Xvim's husk, Bhaal's blood, Myrkyl's spirit. My version of the Ebon Triad.
Actually, I think they kind of, sort of did explain it. If I remember correctly, they said that Xvim, his son and would-be successor, was basically something akin to an egg. Inside, Bane's essence gestated for a while before completely consuming Xvim and emerging reborn.EDIT: I'm still miffed we've no idea how Bane got better from 2e-3e I mean they haven't even explained all the cosmology changes and they foist more on us.What about Bane? Where does he fit into all of this?
Yep, that's how it went down. Xvim was Bane's "back-up plan". Brilliant, really, when you think about it.
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I'm a little more than half-way through Salvatore's new novel, The Orc King. From reading the book, and knowing that they like to keep the books and the game pretty closely in sync, I get the impression that they are moving towards making orcs a core PC race - at least for FR.
I guess that would make sense. They've had elves and half-elves as PC races for long time. might as well do both half-orcs nad orcs.
Hsa anyone else who read the book gotten the same feeling?
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I'm a little more than half-way through Salvatore's new novel, The Orc King. From reading the book, and knowing that they like to keep the books and the game pretty closely in sync, I get the impression that they are moving towards making orcs a core PC race - at least for FR.
I guess that would make sense. They've had elves and half-elves as PC races for long time. might as well do both half-orcs nad orcs.
Hsa anyone else who read the book gotten the same feeling?
Fact is, with Monster Manual and Races of Faerun, I've had orcs as player characters and NPCs for some time.
Another impression I've gotten from the Salvatore's Orc King...
** spoiler omitted **
First off, yeah, I get the feeling that orcs are going to be a playable race, and what kind of bugs me is that they are retconning the whole concept of orcs from CE barbaric raider to a misunderstood, oppressed race of beings that humans, elves, and dwarves have just never given a chance to. It sounds to me like someone has been reading too much Warcraft and decided it would be "cool" to import into D&D.
Nevermind that the grey orcs came from a world ruled by orcs, worshiping the (fully evil) orc pantheon, and when the gate opened during the Orcgate Wars, the orcs came out swinging, slaughtering everything they could get their hands on.
Nevermind that when the orcs have had kingdoms in the Realms before, such as Vastar or the vassal state that was ruled by the orc mercenaries that were allied to the Tharkul of Thar, were pretty much evil, cruel, oppressive and nasty.
And as far as the other Realms retconning going on:
I get the feeling that orcs are going to be a playable race...
They've been available as a PC race in all of my 3.x games. It will please me if 4e embraces the concept.
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First off, yeah, I get the feeling that orcs are going to be a playable race, and what kind of bugs me is that they are retconning the whole concept of orcs from CE barbaric raider to a misunderstood, oppressed race of beings that humans, elves, and dwarves have just never given a chance to. It sounds to me like someone has been reading too much Warcraft and decided it would be "cool" to import into D&D.
Orc's as a PC race don't bother me as much as the retconnning they are doing. I could see them saying "Hey, here are some orcs who are tired of the evil, and violence of their typical lives and want to better themselves." Instead we get, "Orcs and Dwarves used to live together in peace, so they can once more." It just seems like a poor way to force the issue.
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Oh well, so much for my "Operation Impending Doom III" theory. :)
10 years, even 100 is not really enough time to change the sprawling, densly populated areas of the Realms into a "points of light" wilderness. That kind of extreme change really requires centuries of decline, war and plague to allow for mighty empires to crumble and gradually be replaced by wilderness and monsters. How long did it take for the Roman Empire to crumble and leave the power vacuum of the so called Dark Ages?
I could see post-apocalyptic/spell plague wasteland and ruins covering much of the Realms in that time, but not trackless wilderness. Nature, even one so heavily influenced by magic, requires time to heal. Besides, Dragons can only breed so quickly. :)
Ptolus or Pathfinder are looking better and better and better every day.
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Anything not produced by WotC is looking better every day.
See, for me that is not necessarily the case. I've always been more into the FR novels, and lately I've focused more on certain authors that I like (such as Paul Kemp and Richard Lee Byers). As long as those authors keep writing FR works I'll consider buying them, even if they are set in a 4E world that is FR In Name Only.
Of note, Rich Baker has stated on the WotC forums that they aren't yet allowed to say when exactly the 4th Edition FRCS will be set, so we don't know specifically if it will be 10 years (i.e., 1385 DR) in the future, 100 years, or some other date. All we do know is that it will be at least a jump to 1385 DR or later.
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Of note, Rich Baker has stated on the WotC forums that they aren't yet allowed to say when exactly the 4th Edition FRCS will be set, so we don't know specifically if it will be 10 years (i.e., 1385 DR) in the future, 100 years, or some other date. All we do know is that it will be at least a jump to 1385 DR or later.
The operative words being "allowed to say when exactly the 4 ed FRCS will be set".
I'm sure they already have this predetermined, they are just waiting for all the deparments within the FR brand to fall in line.
That was my take as well - that either they have it determined already, or they're still undecided, but have narrowed it down to a certain date range.
Overall, my primary concern with all the changes that have been previewed is the growing sense that much of what made the Realms special for myself and others is going to get radically altered, or killed outright. That is to say, the characters, deities, settings, and so forth are going to go away or become warped in a way that they become unfamiliar. Worse yet, it's all going to happen in a very short period, in terms of real-world time, and that a lot of it will feel forced or contrived. I need only look to the recent deaths of two major Realms NPCs in the prologue setup text of recent adventures (not even in the actual adventure, but "X is dead, and...").
Hopefully it won't wind up being that bad. I intend to try and make my views known as best I can, on the official boards.