Doing things besides fighting and looting

[Mark Hoover 330]

You all know my challenges with this game and a DM in it. In a session a couple weeks ago our characters, now level 3, had some downtime and nearly a thousand GP worth of coins and goods on us.

It occurred to us pretty quickly that our DM was sticking firm to the setting he'd made, where even consumable magic items like scrolls can't be purchased. As a last ditch Hail Mary to get engaged with the setting I asked what it would take for my own character, who has carpentry tools, to just make interesting things or bows/crossbows or whatever, with his skills, using money and downtime. The answer that came back from the DM was that it would take several weeks to even make a bow.

What's more, there are no "masterwork" items. So magic items aren't for sale, according to the DM they can't easily be made and we don't have enough gold to make them anyway, and even crafting mundane items is time consuming.

What does 5e expect characters to do when not defeating enemies and taking their treasure?

I know, 5e is the mechanics-slightly-lighter alternative to PF1 and more of these kinds of decisions are supposed to be between the DM and players. However the mechanics that DO exist as default to power scaling, creation of mundane items and the creation of magic items seem to suggest that there isn't much for PCs to spend money on or make for themselves.

I mean, PCs don't really NEED magic items as much as they have in prior editions or in PF games. Add in that monsters typically maintain low defenses but high HP and basically the objective seems to be "as you level, do as much damage as you can." So again, you don't NEED all those magic swords, belts, and defensive items that you do in say, PF1, but if you have the most damaging weapon or spell you can find for your level, you're pretty much done.

So... were we supposed to buy land or something? Hire hirelings? Pay to start construction on our stronghold we get at name level like back in 1e/2e? What is the expectation put out by 5e on what characters do when they're not defeating and looting?

[Quark Blast]

Mark Hoover 330 wrote:

You all know my challenges with this game and a DM in it. In a session a couple weeks ago our characters, now level 3, had some downtime and nearly a thousand GP worth of coins and goods on us.

....What does 5e expect characters to do when not defeating enemies and taking their treasure?

....So... were we supposed to buy land or something? Hire hirelings? Pay to start construction on our stronghold we get at name level like back in 1e/2e? What is the expectation put out by 5e on what characters do when they're not defeating and looting?

For all that is ####### and ######-####! Can't you tell by now it quite literally doesn't matter what you do?

Whatever you take the initiative on will either blow up in your face or painfully grind your hope to a fine black paste.

Not trying to harsh your cool here but for your health you need to stop ####### in the wind.

[TOZ]

The answer is Magical Tea Party, Mark.

[Haladir]

Given all the complaints you've had about this GM and how frustrating his games are to you, my best advice would be to resign from this game and do something else. Or maybe offer to GM this group yourself?

You've said in other threads that you've tried talking to this GM about he things you're finding frustrating about the game, and he basically dismisses your concerns out-of-hand and refuses to make any changes in how he's running this game. To me, that's a HUGE red flag that he cares not one whit about player consent in his game. Speaking strictly for myself, I would refuse to play RPGs with this person at all, regardless of which side of the GM screen he was on: He sounds like a real a$$h0l3.

It sounds like you've decided to stick in a game that you find frustrating out of some sense of obligation to this GM and/or the other friends also in this group. If that is indeed the case...

Fight fire with fire? If he refuses to change how he runs his game to accommodate the requested play style of his players... have your PCs decline to take his adventure hooks? You have a bunch of gold... maybe all of your PCs decide that the potential rewards of this whole adventuring gig isn't worth the risk, and that you're going to use the funds you've raised to settle down in this town, start a business, and make your living in a mundane way. "What? Raiders are coming? Well-- maybe we should hire some NPC adventurers to take care of them so we can get back to work at our blacksmith shop."

[Jester David]

Mark Hoover 330 wrote:

What does 5e expect characters to do when not defeating enemies and taking their treasure?

The exact same thing you'd do with your money when you're not spending it on your job.

This is actually something I adore about 5e. I got tired of the loot cycle of 3e/4e/PF where 99% of your money went to just making yourself a better adventurer.
You could never give the players a castle or a boat or a cool random artifact (like the wand of wonder) because they would just flip it and add a few more plusses to their sword and belt.
So the heroes adventured and adventured and adventured but never actually made any money because it all became gear.

I really struggled with this while running Skull & Shackles as you plundered ships for booty, which wasn't money. And while you could turn gold into booty you couldn't turn booty into gold because balance.
There were these two weird parallel economic systems to justify the players looting ships carrying hundreds of gp in spice and seizing vessels worth thousands but not being able to ever profit from that extra work.

So, what to spend that money on?
Food. Fine clothing with your crest on them. Gems and blig. A house. Setting your parents up for life. Rebuilding your hometown. A business for when you retire. A noble title. Hookers and blow. Whatever.

[Jester David]

I advise you to sit back for a bit and think of this from the character's perspective.
Specifically: why are they an adventurer?

Itinerant adventurer (read: murder-hobo) is probably one of the most dangerous careers you can choose. You don't typically become one if you can have a safe life tending after your family's goat farm.
It's not so much "joining the army" so much as "joining a private military contract firm that operates out South American warzones and hellholes.

Why did your character choose to do so?
What is their end goal? Their dream?

If you have an idea of their aspirations and plans for the future, then you probably have an idea of what they would spent a thousand gold pieces on.

[Jester David]

I've Got A Dream