Demoralize vs Constructs

[Timber_Wolf]

Hi,
we and my gaming group just had a debate about Demoralize and Constructs.

It says Demoralize is sense-dependent
Reading sense dependent it says that it depends target can see/hear you

If succeed it is shaken.

So, consctructs (or undead), can see hear/me, so by rule writing, they could be demoralized, and so shaken.

Mind affecting inmunities, doesn't say Shaken counts as being something "mind-affecting"

TL;DR

Can constructs (and undead) be affected by demoralize and so be shaken?

Thanks

[The Artificer]

Ok, I'm not exactly pleased by my opinion, but, it looks to me that it's a valid target for demoralize. Especially since both types of immunities call out mind affecting but not sense dependent.

I'm really not sure if that was supposed to be the case though. It just seems kind of weird that you can affect them with a sense dependent effect that has a mental based debuff effect, but since its sense dependent it works...

Just Huh.. I guess that makes the intimidate skill a little bit more useful now?

[Nefreet]

Had this same discussion tonight about demoralizing a foe that was immune to fear effects.

[BigNorseWolf]

Nefreet wrote:

Had this same discussion tonight about demoralizing a foe that was immune to fear effects.

It didn't work in pathfinder, because shaken was a fear effect.

If shaken is still a fear effect it shouldn't work.

If shaken is not it shouldn't.

Sense dependent seems irrelevant. Robots have senses. Its an ocular processor and a microphone instead of eyes and ears, but they do have the same senses as biological beings.

[Nefreet]

That's the thing, it doesn't seem that Shaken has the Fear descriptor.

My GM ruled that it didn't work, and we were fighting the boss of the book, so it made sense.

But it's got me thinking about this more, now.

[The Ragi]

RAW, it does.

[Dracomicron]

From what I can gather, Demoralize works on anything that can see or hear you.

I don't know if it SHOULD work, but it does, and I have characters that are built around it, so pleased to not be getting that errata'd, k thx bye.

Sense-Dependent: A sense-dependent effect has either audible or visual elements, requiring sight or hearing to have any effect. For this kind of effect to affect that target, you must be able to either see or hear the target, and the target must be able to either see or hear you.

From what that reads, in order for Demoralize to not work, either you or they would have to be taking both blindness and deafness penalties.

[Xenocrat]

This has been brought up several times since launch, if they haven't errata'd by now I'm not sure they will.