I'm highly confused by this. What are they trying to say.
An eldritch scion gains a bloodrager bloodline. The bloodline is selected at 1st level, and this choice cannot be changed. An eldritch scion’s effective bloodrager level for his bloodline abilities is equal to his eldritch scion level. He does not gain any bonus feats, and he gains bonus spells from his bloodline at different levels (see the bonus spell class feature below).
At 7th level, an eldritch scion gains the bonus spell from his bloodrager bloodline that is normally gained at 10th level. He gains the next three bonus spells from his bloodline at 9th, 11th, and 13th levels, respectively.
But if I look at a bloodrager's bonus spell progression
Bonus Spells: 7th, 10th, 13th, 16th.
So... How is this supposed to work? Is there a typo should this start at 4th and you get the 7th level, then wait until 9 for 10th, then 11 for 13th and 13 for 16th?
But then your spell progression is really messy, you get a 2nd level spell when you are already ending 3rd. Shouldn't this be at character level 4th, 7th, 10th and 13th? (Bloodrager progression where you gain your n-1 bonus spell when you start the next spell level)
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I believe there is a typo in there, but going the other way. It looks like you are supposed to get the first bonus spell at 7th level, but it's supposed to be the 7th level bloodrager spell, not the 10th. Otherwise you run out of bloodrager spells at magus level 11.
It makes sense for you to receive this ability at 7th level as it replaces knowledge pool (a 7th level magus ability).
Example: Arcane Bloodline
Magus level 7 = add magic missile as a spell known
Magus level 9 = add invisibility as a spell known
Magus level 11 = add lightning bolt as a spell known
Magus level 13 = add dimension door as a spell known
Yes, this means that for most bloodlines you are not adding spells of the highest spell level you can cast. But that is true for the bloodrager as well.
I think it makes more sense to add the spells at character level 4th, 7th, 10th and 13th
Especially since every other bloodline gains are close to the level.
If we keep Magus level as your example we gain spells like this
Level 7: Max Spell Level 3
Level 9: Max Spell Level 3
Level 11: Max Spell Level 4
Level 13: Max Spell Level 5
With mine
Level 4: Max Spell Level 2
Level 7: Max Spell Level 3
Level 10: Max Spell Level 4
Level 13: Max Spell Level 5
also level 11 is the middle of 4th level spells same with 9th. instead of the start.
I think it makes more sense to add the spells at character level 4th, 7th, 10th and 13th
While that makes sense it would be a LOT of typos.
If I were to guess (and I guess I am) I'd say Belafon hit the nail on the head. If you're a player I'd go with Belafon's examples, but if you're the GM and don't think it's broken then going with your examples isn't likely to break anything.
(Obviously you can ask the GM, but it's a tough line to ask for upgrades without being cheat-y)
I think it makes more sense to add the spells at character level 4th, 7th, 10th and 13thWhile that makes sense it would be a LOT of typos.
If I were to guess (and I guess I am) I'd say Belafon hit the nail on the head. If you're a player I'd go with Belafon's examples, but if you're the GM and don't think it's broken then going with your examples isn't likely to break anything.
(Obviously you can ask the GM, but it's a tough line to ask for upgrades without being cheat-y)
I don't really see it as cheating or over powered. After all you gain a level 1 spell after you gain access to level 2 spells instead of getting a level 1 spell when you'd be in level 3 spells, and a level 2 bonus spell in the middle of level 3 spells. If this were to be a sorcerer I'd be getting each a level earlier, getting the level 1 bonus spell the level before going to level 2 spells.
Also Pazio has been known to have a lot of weird errors. For example in Eldritch Scion it alters spell recall but not improved spell recall without calling out the improved spell recall being modified anywhere.
I don't really see it as cheating or over powered. After all you gain a level 1 spell after you gain access to level 2 spells instead of getting a level 1 spell when you'd be in level 3 spells, and a level 2 bonus spell in the middle of level 3 spells. If this were to be a sorcerer I'd be getting each a level earlier, getting the level 1 bonus spell the level before going to level 2 spells.I think it makes more sense to add the spells at character level 4th, 7th, 10th and 13thWhile that makes sense it would be a LOT of typos.
If I were to guess (and I guess I am) I'd say Belafon hit the nail on the head. If you're a player I'd go with Belafon's examples, but if you're the GM and don't think it's broken then going with your examples isn't likely to break anything.
(Obviously you can ask the GM, but it's a tough line to ask for upgrades without being cheat-y)
Well I don't think it'd really be overpowered either, but it's 100% cheating - or "house rules" if you prefer - you're asking for class features earlier than you're supposed to get them. You can ask your GM, but if you don't show them all the evidence (eg. This thread) then you're pulling a fast-one.
There is obviously a typo, but I think Belefon's post covers what should have been there. If you follow his logic you get your first bonus spell at the same level you lose the class feature being replaced - which is consistent with other archetype designs.
Also Pazio has been known to have a lot of weird errors. For example in Eldritch Scion it alters spell recall but not improved spell recall without calling out the improved spell recall being modified anywhere.
This means at the level you're supposed to get Improved Spell Recall (11 if I remember correctly) you instead get Spell Recall. So you should feel lucky they don't call that out, because it means you still get Spell Recall, just later.
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In complete agreement with Mr. Charisma here. While it definitely isn’t overpowered to get these spells starting at 4th level, the guidelines for archetype design are that you don’t get an ability from the archetype until you reach the level of the base class feature it replaces.
Also Pazio has been known to have a lot of weird errors. For example in Eldritch Scion it alters spell recall but not improved spell recall without calling out the improved spell recall being modified anywhere.
If an archetype replaces a class ability that is part of a series of improvements or additions to a base ability (such as a barbarian’s uncanny dodge or a ranger’s favored enemy), the next time the character would gain that ability, it counts as the lower-level ability that was replaced by the archetype
An eldritch scion gets spell recall at 11th level (and never gets improved spell recall). However. . . it probably won’t do him any good. An eldritch scion does not prepare magus spells (he’s a spontaneous caster). There’s a few feats and abilities that allow him to prepare a spell (Versatile Spontaneity comes to mind) but most eldritch scions aren’t ever going to use spell recall at all.