Everywhere I look online, everyone keeps saying it isn’t, yet the only examples I’ve found where force is called out as energy or physical, it is called an energy type.
Draconic Bloodline wrote: Expanded Bloodlines
Source Dragons of Legacy pg. 4
Energy Types: Several of these new draconic bloodline options include nonstandard damage types. For the sake of game balance, many of the damage types available to the bloodlines below somewhat differ from those produced by the parent dragon. Specifically, force energy, negative energy, and sonic energy have been altered to different types of energy.
Energy Siege Shot wrote: When casting the spell, the caster picks a one of the following energy types: acid, cold, electricity, fire, sonic, or force.
Force Blast wrote: Blast Type energy; Damage force
So which is it? Normally, I would just say it is energy and move on, but I’ve seen absolutely no examples of people saying it is energy damage, even on this very rules forum, and instead, everyone claims it is physical or strangely, somehow neither.
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Force is certainly an energy type. Maybe the question should be “Is Force always an energy type?” I’m not sure if it always is, but I’d say it is the vast majority of the time.
Note that Force effects are almost always vulnerable to spell resistance, like other energy types.
Force is most definitely energy damage. People who rule otherwise need to read the rules once again.
Also, to add to your list of sources.
Energy Spells and Effects: Crowds tend to respond to flashy spells and effects. If a combatant casts a spell or produces an effect that deals acid, cold, fire, electricity, force, or sonic damage in a visible way (including weapons with special abilities like flaming burst or shocking burst that deal bursts of energy damage on critical hits), she can make a performance combat check as a swift action.
it is, however why do you ask?
I guess it's sometimes not considered energy damage because the CRB spells protection from energy and resist energy don't protect against it. They don't protect against positive or negative energy either, but, well, you could put those two into the same oddball basket as force.
Often the terms "energy type" and "energy damage" are accompanied by a list of relevant energy types - so the question doesn't apply there. In CRB I found only a single application of "force is an energy type": An elemental sorcerer can turn force damage spells into spells dealing their favourite elemental damage. Can be nice if the target has a fitting vulnerability, though.
SheepishEidolon wrote: I guess it's sometimes not considered energy damage because the CRB spells protection from energy and resist energy don't protect against it. They don't protect against positive or negative energy either, but, well, you could put those two into the same oddball basket as force.
Often the terms "energy type" and "energy damage" are accompanied by a list of relevant energy types - so the question doesn't apply there. In CRB I found only a single application of "force is an energy type": An elemental sorcerer can turn force damage spells into spells dealing their favourite elemental damage. Can be nice if the target has a fitting vulnerability, though.
elemental damage =/= energy damage. elemental sorcerer's can't make it force
Force is semi-elemental, it belongs to aether like acid belongs to earth and lightning belongs to air.
There’s two reasons protection from energy doesn’t mention it. First, the type is mostly newer than that spell. Second, force’s gimmick is that it deals less damage, but is almost never resisted. The only force immune thing I can think of is an aether elemental, though I’m sure there are others.
Force is absolutely an energy type. However, most of the time when you get to choose an energy type, you can't select it.
The common energy types are elemental: Air, Earth, Fire and Water represented by the damage types: Electricity, Acid, Fire and Cold respectively. Sometimes elemental damage gets mixed between types and you need resistance against two types or the damage is split by a percentage between each of the constitute types. When talking about Energy the elemental types is always applicable.
Less applicable are the odd types. Force, Sonic, Positive and Negative energy come to mind. There aren't that many ways to do that damage. Spells that involve these energy types generally do less damage than elemental spells of the same level. Lots of these spells have significant special effects, conditions, and various limitations placed on them. Trying to treat them as 'just energy spells' is bad. Careful consideration should be given to any effects dealing in non-elemental energy damage. Both dealing the damage, and defenses against them are more constrained than Elemental damage to create a balance in rarity.
force is both a defined game term(effect[Force]) and a common english word, noun or verb. That means it can be bandied about in the rules so it takes some reading and consideration of the context to figure it out sometimes. Game publishers aren't known for their technical proofreading.
General meanderings:
As others have stated, in PF Force is generally a type of (energy) damage. It can be undefined(just Force effect), energy or physical (which are there to add to the descriptive nature of the effect). The term is used to categorize how rule interactions will occur (dispel magic, spell resistance, anti-magic, protection spells, incorporeal, interdimensional, etc).
vhok wrote: elemental damage =/= energy damage. elemental sorcerer's can't make it force I don't object - but actually I wrote about the opposite direction.
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SheepishEidolon wrote: vhok wrote: elemental damage =/= energy damage. elemental sorcerer's can't make it force I don't object - but actually I wrote about the opposite direction. ah i misread it as the other way. apologies.
They're all energy.
It's just that fire, acid, electric, and cold are all elemental energies, whereas force, positive, negative, and sonic are not elemental. The elemental energies have more options in how you can interact and interplay with them.
Yes force is an energy type, the standard convention outside a few spells is that it drops a die type, or in some way goes down one "stage" like the kinetic composite damaging like a simple blast.
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