How do people feel about the level 3 version of Haste? Is it a spell you would prepare on a daily basis or add to your spell repertoire? Or is the 2 action cost for this spell not really viable unless your in a long drawn out combat?
Well, most spells cost 2 actions, so that alone doesn't disqualify it. It's basically a question of "how effectively the person who gets the extra action is going to use it"? It probably helps more when putting it on Martials who have two action attacks they would have trouble fitting in a routine normally.
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Well, most spells cost 2 actions, so that alone doesn't disqualify it. It's basically a question of "how effectively the person who gets the extra action is going to use it"? It probably helps more when putting it on Martials who have two action attacks they would have trouble fitting in a routine normally.
I can certainly imagine a dragon instinct barbarian that would like to get an extra action so he do dragon breath and a set of move/attacks in the same turn- that way, he can AoE blast, and then begin to mop up before enemies can even react.
I dont like it, the impact that it causes in the field is not big enough, offensively an extra attack most likely under MAP is poor, while the extra stride is good defensively we have slow in the same spell level that gives a benefit to the entire party even if the monster makes the save.
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A martial/MC-Caster can often make good use of it themselves. Or casting it on a barbarian/monk/ranger who often needs a round of wind-up (rage,hunt,stance,etc) can make a big difference if you beat them in initiative. Its situationally good, just no longer one of the best 3rd level spells around.
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Casters want haste to move every turn. Having a sustained spell and a cast spell every turn is optimal, so you need haste to actually move for positioning.
Rangers are the other class that really want it; they can shoot an extra time at a non-ridiculous MAP.
Martial/Caster hybrids utilize it best with a move, strike, spell sequence. The cool thing with hybrids is that the move or the strike can be the haste action, so that gives them a bit more flexibility overall.
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Haste is no longer the must-have it was, but that's fine as there really shouldn't be must-have spells.
Is it useful? Yes, to most everybody most all of the time.
It's also often worth the two-actions, if you give them to somebody better able to make use of extra actions than you can.
But is it worth a 3rd level slot?
Not to begin with, assuming you're in a party of 5th level PCs.
Against a group, Fireball or Lightning Bolt should do more damage than the extra actions will, plus it's immediate. And Slow or Stinking Cloud work better tactically. Against a boss that's hard to hit, Magic Missile.
But as the damage of a 3rd level spell becomes secondary or tertiary and the damage your allies deal ramps up, then Haste moves toward the top. Add in that there you're also more likely to face treacherous environments or debuffs that steal actions so that you might be giving somebody in a bad spot a 1st Strike, not just ones with MAP. Eventually Haste does return to being a must-have due to amount of utility that now lowly slot gives you.
If you've dumped your casting stat and/or have low proficiency, then Haste moves up the chain much sooner, since it doesn't need to contend with the offensive spells so much.
And it's a good choice for a wand if hands aren't too much of an issue.
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A spot at which it's really good? A fighter/barb with Whirlwind Strike.
Turns out that giving them that extra Stride to get them in the right position is very powerful. My party's Fighter was lamenting every time an enemy moved to screw up his next turn's planned Whirlwind, and with a Haste that wouldn't have mattered.
I think a most of us can generally agree- the extra movement is nice since it lets us position for those harder to use, action heavy options.
The attack is usually nice, but rarely something to write home about. We would more appreciate the movement so we can get into attack range.
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Yeah I think it can really grease the wheels for martials that have a strong 2-action attack that they'd like to combine with another one-action followup, if only they could get a fourth action to make the movement work.
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Monks for example often feel like one action more could really help. At low level, you'd like to start combat by:
> enter stance
> stride towards an enemy
> flurry
> stride back so the enemy has to move to keep up
And later you get stuff like:
> stride
>> wolf drag
> flurry them while they're down
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Haste (like a lot of spells now) isn't a passive boost, it is a boost that shines with tactical use and through what it opens up.
I am not surprised that people look at the extra strike and think "eh, not impressive" but as others have said the movement is what really shines and is essentially giving you back one of your actions to use for something else.
I would also like to mention that while fireball/lightning may do more direct damage than haste will, neither can get a barbarian or champion behind a foe and in a doorway and then still provide turn after turn utility and option.
As for when those extra attacks are worth it, haste a ranger will flurry and watch them throw out five attacks, sure three are at -4 (until late levels when it gets even lower) but it is still worth it imo, especially when you consider that they can flank).
But yeah, mobility is king imo, especially for caster positioning.
And later you get stuff like:
> stride
>> wolf drag
> flurry them while they're down
Wolf drag is really a style that shows its best effect when you are able to pull off a 3 action "full attack" mentality like that. Mostly because it plays nicer with MAP than a trip monk going Trip, flurry, strike.
If wolf drag is forced into a 2 action mentality due to the need for a move action, then it is usually worse than just Trip, flurry (mostly because of the debuff potential of a prone, stunned enemy).
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Don't view it as an extra strike or stride, that's not what haste is. If you were planning on striking or striding at any point during your turn (which for a martial means every turn) it's an extra action, period.
For action-hungry martials, haste is amazing. For casters, it's not quite as good but the movement is still helpful. I think a gish-style character would get the most use out of haste though.
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Haste is definitely a must for a Universalist Wizard who wants together the most out of Bond Conversion. Being able to burn those three actions to cast free spells and still have an action to move means you can wreak some havoc on the battlefield if you've used your spells intelligently throughout the day.
Also you can attack twice or do a 2-action attack or cast a spell, raise your shield or cast a shield spell and stride once all in one turn. Not too bad.
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I dont like it, the impact that it causes in the field is not big enough, offensively an extra attack most likely under MAP is poor, while the extra stride is good defensively we have slow in the same spell level that gives a benefit to the entire party even if the monster makes the save.
Tell that to any flurry ranger, whose third attacks and beyond are only a -4 or -6.
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Don't view it as an extra strike or stride, that's not what haste is. If you were planning on striking or striding at any point during your turn (which for a martial means every turn) it's an extra action, period.
This isn't exactly true. Many martials don't actually want to make generic strikes or strides, but use them as subordinate actions for their feats. A fighter might want to Sudden Charge and then use a Press attack, for example. Haste doesn't enable this. But it does enable things like stride>power attack>>press.
So it really just depends on your party.
I dont like it, the impact that it causes in the field is not big enough, offensively an extra attack most likely under MAP is poor, while the extra stride is good defensively we have slow in the same spell level that gives a benefit to the entire party even if the monster makes the save.Tell that to any flurry ranger, whose third attacks and beyond are only a -4 or -6.
And then at 17 they drop to -4(-2) it's gets pretty crazy in the high levels.
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Yeah Flurry Ranger would benefit of that, but to get that benefit someone had to use their 3rd lvl spell slot and two actions to cast that haste.
I am not saying that the Quickened condition is bad, I am saying that casting haste lvl 3 is, because of effect it have on field and what it cost is not worth it, especially when we have slow and fear lvl 3 that basically affect the entire party. Haste lvl 7 is amazing though because of the huge action economy boost that gives.
Yeah Flurry Ranger would benefit of that, but to get that benefit someone had to use their 3rd lvl spell slot and two actions to cast that haste.
I am not saying that the Quickened condition is bad, I am saying that casting haste lvl 3 is, because of effect it have on field and what it cost is not worth it, especially when we have slow and fear lvl 3 that basically affect the entire party. Haste lvl 7 is amazing though because of the huge action economy boost that gives.
Which lasts for a nunber of rounds, haste cannot be resisted like slow and fear can and again, is more flexible than either.
Haste isn't a huge benefit to characters standing in place, making 3 strikes at a full -5 per attack MAP, who use the haste benefit to make a 4th strike.
But every class has more options than that, and many encounters call for more variety of actions than that, so it isn't a very useful measure.
Haste can also pre-buff an ally if you know beforehand you're getting into a fight. I think a 3rd-level haste can be amazing on the right character.
Slow is also quite good (especially against a boss) but also gets resisted (especially against a boss).
3rd level Fear is just amazing. No argument there. It's only going to be useful against a group, but it's really devastating.
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The big benefit of single-targeting haste is that it allows for optimal positioning of 3-action abilities. That's a bonus it's hard to put a price on.
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The big benefit of single-targeting haste is that it allows for optimal positioning of 3-action abilities. That's a bonus it's hard to put a price on.
I can put a price on that bonus, a 3rd level spell slot.
Yeah Flurry Ranger would benefit of that, but to get that benefit someone had to use their 3rd lvl spell slot and two actions to cast that haste.
I am not saying that the Quickened condition is bad, I am saying that casting haste lvl 3 is, because of effect it have on field and what it cost is not worth it, especially when we have slow and fear lvl 3 that basically affect the entire party. Haste lvl 7 is amazing though because of the huge action economy boost that gives.
So the caster trades 2 actions to give somebody else 1 each round.
After the 2nd round it's a net positive amount of actions added to combat and only grows from there.
If the single action enabled the other character to do something they otherwise couldn't it's even more value. Say for instance it gives the Barb another action to move into place for whirlwind, or it enables another caster to move before they cast a needed wall spell so they're on the correct side.
Unless the fight ends the round you cast haste it was likely a net gain for the party.
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Unless the fight ends the round you cast haste it was likely a net gain for the party.
Round 1 actions are far more important than subsequent round actions. Very quickly downing a foe is the best way to win a fight. Round 3 actions are nearly useless as, by the time you get to round 3, the combat outcome is in general clear.
Also, Haste action is a 4th action, and as such is far less important than the actions you used the round you cast it, that were in general your caster's first and second actions.So, unless you can forecast a very long and tense fight, casting Haste at round 1 for the "action" gain is a bad idea.
PS: Flurry Rangers are overrated.
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Unless the fight ends the round you cast haste it was likely a net gain for the party.Round 1 actions are far more important than subsequent round actions. Very quickly downing a foe is the best way to win a fight. Round 3 actions are nearly useless as, by the time you get to round 3, the combat outcome is in general clear.
Also, Haste action is a 4th action, and as such is far less important than the actions you used the round you cast it, that were in general your caster's first and second actions.
So, unless you can forecast a very long and tense fight, casting Haste at round 1 for the "action" gain is a bad idea.PS: Flurry Rangers are overrated.
You make a lot if assumptions about how fights play out that I disagree with. Your first round actions are not inherently better than later rounds.
Not sure what you mean by haste being a 4th action? Or how that devalues it somehow.
And Flurry rangers are great.
Have you played with somebody using haste and found it isn't good or is this more white room theorizing?
The fact that it might be clear that a fight is won or lost on round 3 (hard disagree from personal experience but we will roll with it) doesn't mean the extra action from haste isn't important.
It's true I haven't spoken about resource consumption. Actually, using your first round(s) to buff is the best way to increase resource consumption, as it increase the duration of fights.
The shorter the fight, the lower the resource consumption, the lower the impact of Haste. Haste plays against you :)
Longer fight does not equal more resource consumption. Longer fight that's giving the party trouble throughout does mean more resource consumption, but haste (and all buffs) lower trouble.
In a fight that's going to be long regardless of what the first spell you cast is, haste is good value.
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Well that is a simply absurd arguement. The quickest way for a level 20 wizard to win a fight probably involves burning as many lvl 9 spells as possible. That is also obviously a very resource intensive fight.
Can we avoid hyperboles?
My arguments are:- An action in the first round is more important than an action in the third round by a certain margin.
- A first and second action are more important than 4th actions.
So, to get an action benefit out of Haste, you have to wait far more than 2 rounds. And if you consider these arguments "absurd", then, I think we will stop the debate here, as we will hardly agree.
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That margin shifts with circumstance. Like when fighting a pack of dinosaurs (perfectly fine mid to mid high fight) you first round of actions probably arent good for much, afterall it's better to let the enemy come to you.
How important actions are is utterly circumstantial. If I have to stride three times to get to the enemy wizard to shut them down, that fourth action is vital.
Haste does get better the longer the fight goes on, efficiency wise, but it also enables tactics that otherwise couldn't exist.
Haste also becomes better as you level up. What else you can achieve with a 3rd level slot begins to get worse and worse in comparison to what a martial can achieve with an extra action.
I didnt resort to hyperbole at all.
I don't say that you have to ignore circumstances. If you have a round to prebuff, then Haste is obviously a good idea. If you have a Whirlwind Barbarian who needs Haste for a combo, it's good, too.
I was speaking purely of action benefit in general situations. In a completely average fight, casting Haste is losing actions. If there are multiple enemies, you'll get better output by killing them, making the action difference by reducing their number. Even against a single opponent, Haste will even out around round 3-4, which means that the fight has to last at least 5 rounds for Haste to just be beneficial (I don't even mean good). And people tend to forget that a hastened character is also a good primary target for intelligent enemies. Being hasted while down is useless. And when I see how PF2 is swingy, I would avoid to put all my eggs in the same basket with a big red ribbon on it for everyone to know it's a big basket.
Haste is a circumstancial spell. Casting it on the Flurry Ranger is no "good tactic" at all, it's quite bad on average. You'll get more juice from a Fireball, Searing Light, Fear or whatever in classical circumstances.
That margin shifts with circumstance. Like when fighting a pack of dinosaurs (perfectly fine mid to mid high fight) you first round of actions probably arent good for much, afterall it's better to let the enemy come to you.
How important actions are is utterly circumstantial. If I have to stride three times to get to the enemy wizard to shut them down, that fourth action is vital.
Haste does get better the longer the fight goes on, efficiency wise, but it also enables tactics that otherwise couldn't exist.
Haste also becomes better as you level up. What else you can achieve with a 3rd level slot begins to get worse and worse in comparison to what a martial can achieve with an extra action.
I didnt resort to hyperbole at all.
I don't say that you have to ignore circumstances. If you have a round to prebuff, then Haste is obviously a good idea. If you have a Whirlwind Barbarian who needs Haste for a combo, it's good, too.
I was speaking purely of action benefit in general situations. In a completely average fight, casting Haste is losing actions. If there are multiple enemies, you'll get better output by killing them, making the action difference by reducing their number. Even against a single opponent, Haste will even out around round 3-4, which means that the fight has to last at least 5 rounds for Haste to just be beneficial (I don't even mean good). And people tend to forget that a hastened character is also a good primary target for intelligent enemies. Being hasted while down is useless. And when I see how PF2 is swingy, I would avoid to put all my eggs in the same basket with a big red ribbon on it for everyone to know it's a big basket.
Haste is a circumstancial spell. Casting it on the Flurry Ranger is no "good tactic" at all, it's quite bad on average. You'll get more juice from a Fireball, Searing Light, Fear or whatever in classical circumstances.
Again, have you actually played with somebody using haste and noticed the issues you claim or are you just theorizing?
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Haste has been absolutely clutch for my AoA party. In particular, the Rogue loves it because he can Hide, Strike, Hide, Strike when sniping which is much better than Hide, Strike, Strike. Also, the Warpriest loves it because he can Stride, True Strike, Weapon Surge, Strike - letting him get his full "big attack" without having to start next to an opponent.
And the bard likes being able to Stride for positioning while doing her usual Inspire + Cast Spell routine.
Overall it's something the bard usually casts whenever a fight looks serious or like it might drag on, and so far hasn't regretted it. One particularly large fight she burned every single 3rd level spell slot and one 4th on Haste.
A dragon barbarian being able to Strike, Strike, Breath Weapon or Strike, Stride to line up best AoE, Breath Weapon is also nice.
If the caster is high on initiative, the extra action also has more chance of being a high bonus attack for martial who have round 1 or 2 preparatory actions they like to take, like raging or entering stances. Even more so, if the combat starts from a situation where weapons aren't drawn, yet.
While each of those is a single round benefit, not a 4 action routine, there are a lot of ways for that kind of benefit to come up on subsequent rounds.
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I personally like the idea of Stride, Trip, Strike, Stride on a fast martial for a blend of offense, debuffing, and damage mitigation against melee heavy opponents. Or maybe Stride, Improved Knockdown, Stride for a mid-level fighter with reach weapon. Stride (and thus Haste) has both offensive and defensive applications.
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Rangers with animal companions to command will fall into the "could really use an extra stride or strike" category a lot, too.
Haste is a circumstancial spell. Casting it on the Flurry Ranger is no "good tactic" at all, it's quite bad on average. You'll get more juice from a Fireball, Searing Light, Fear or whatever in classical circumstances.
You are surrounded by a large group foes at a distance, all with ranged weapons and behind small rocky formations creating a Greater dififcult terrain to climb the slate hillsides to get to them. No one of them is more than 15 foot next to another. .
Fireball or fear the right tool for this job vs the flurry ranger who is getting off 5 attacks a round?.
Haste will ALWAYS have a beneficial effect, the other spells... who knows.
My point is whiterooms tend to ignore environmental issues because there are too many variables to consider, haste doesn't require specific variables to be a benefit. It doesn't need the enemy to not have resistances/immunities, it doesn't need the enemy to fail a saving throw, it doesn't need to worry about targeting allies/friendlies.
Does it make it the best spell for all scenarios, heck no. But it is hardly a niche spell or not worth casting.
I dunno, maybe your games are different but I frequently throw 6-10 round combats at my players. And haste shines when it can stretch its legs.
Haste is a circumstancial spell. Casting it on the Flurry Ranger is no "good tactic" at all, it's quite bad on average. You'll get more juice from a Fireball, Searing Light, Fear or whatever in classical circumstances.You are surrounded by a large group foes at a distance, all with ranged weapons and behind small rocky formations creating a Greater dififcult terrain to climb the slate hillsides to get to them. No one of them is more than 15 foot next to another. .
Fireball or fear the right tool for this job vs the flurry ranger who is getting off 5 attacks a round?.
Haste will ALWAYS have a beneficial effect, the other spells... who knows.
My point is whiterooms tend to ignore environmental issues because there are too many variables to consider, haste doesn't require specific variables to be a benefit. It doesn't need the enemy to not have resistances/immunities, it doesn't need the enemy to fail a saving throw, it doesn't need to worry about targeting allies/friendlies.
Does it make it the best spell for all scenarios, heck no. But it is hardly a niche spell or not worth casting.
I dunno, maybe your games are different but I frequently throw 6-10 round combats at my players. And haste shines when it can stretch its legs.
And then you see that in your scenario the Ranger have to Hunt the Target a lot of times to have the bonus of Flurry and that the hasted bow attack will be at -6 and the enemies will have cover.
2d8 +4 at -6 MAP each turn.
Unless the fight ends the round you cast haste it was likely a net gain for the party.Round 1 actions are far more important than subsequent round actions. Very quickly downing a foe is the best way to win a fight. Round 3 actions are nearly useless as, by the time you get to round 3, the combat outcome is in general clear.
Also, Haste action is a 4th action, and as such is far less important than the actions you used the round you cast it, that were in general your caster's first and second actions.
So, unless you can forecast a very long and tense fight, casting Haste at round 1 for the "action" gain is a bad idea.PS: Flurry Rangers are overrated.
But by the same token, if you give the other character enough actions to pull off a first round set of actions it could not do otherwise.... Then it can be a benefit.
You are still setting up a nice big action at the start of the match. The difference is that normally, the other character would be piddling around while you cast a big spell. Here, your "spell" is the actions that the other character is now able to pull off.
Going back to the dragon barbarian- With haste, in turn 1, it can Rage, stride, and then fire off an AoE blast with its 1d6 per level worth of damage to everything in range. It also places itself into the fray among enemies... and it is one of the classes that get Attacks of Opportunity.
Because it has to rage first, it can't necessarily pull this off in round 1 normally (or it doesn't get to have great positioning for the blast and the subsequent AoO blockade). And for the rest of the fight, it could more easily pull off things like swipe and whirlwind strike (for melee AoE).
I get that directly using spells to cripple enemies is powerful. But let us not ignore that there is value in buffing powerful teammates. You have might be able to use that argument against the self buffing gish, but not when you are enabling others who still have their full turn ahead of them.
Haste is a circumstancial spell. Casting it on the Flurry Ranger is no "good tactic" at all, it's quite bad on average. You'll get more juice from a Fireball, Searing Light, Fear or whatever in classical circumstances.You are surrounded by a large group foes at a distance, all with ranged weapons and behind small rocky formations creating a Greater dififcult terrain to climb the slate hillsides to get to them. No one of them is more than 15 foot next to another. .
Fireball or fear the right tool for this job vs the flurry ranger who is getting off 5 attacks a round?.
Haste will ALWAYS have a beneficial effect, the other spells... who knows.
My point is whiterooms tend to ignore environmental issues because there are too many variables to consider, haste doesn't require specific variables to be a benefit. It doesn't need the enemy to not have resistances/immunities, it doesn't need the enemy to fail a saving throw, it doesn't need to worry about targeting allies/friendlies.
Does it make it the best spell for all scenarios, heck no. But it is hardly a niche spell or not worth casting.
I dunno, maybe your games are different but I frequently throw 6-10 round combats at my players. And haste shines when it can stretch its legs.
And then you see that in your scenario the Ranger have to Hunt the Target a lot of times to have the bonus of Flurry and that the hasted bow attack will be at -6 and the enemies will have cover.
2d8 +4 at -6 MAP each turn.
Are you saying -6 is all that bad? Because that's slightly worse than the 2nd attack of every martial character, as their final attack, that's pretty good.
The Extra attack is easily worth it. It also neglects the scenario where the Ranger would like to reposition or command their companion.
Can do Hunt->Command->Hunted Shot->Stride all in one turn.
And Rangers having to Hunt Target when moving to a new target is a prime example of why Haste is great for them, they essentially can Hunt for free and still have 3 actions so long as they planned on Striding or Striking during the round.
Haste will ALWAYS have a beneficial effect, the other spells... who knows.
Let's compare Haste to Fireball on one single enemy (I think we can call that the "non-circumstancial use of Fireball").
Fireball does the equivalent of a first and second attack damage according to Citricking's charts.If Haste is cast on a "random" character, it will give it a third attack most of the time. It means that you need 7 rounds of extra third attacks to get to the damage of the Fireball. Considering that Haste does delayed damage, it is straight up worse even if you can use it during 10 rounds.
Haste sometimes gives a second attack. Examples are given above, things like Rage, Sudden Charge, (hasted) Strike are quite common. If we consider an extra second attack every round, you need 3 rounds for Haste to deal as much damage than a one-target Fireball, and because it's delayed damage, we can consider they're equivalent (fights often last a bit more than 3 rounds). But giving a second attack every round is not a "normal" situation for Haste, it's already a circumstancial one. So, even in circumstancial situations, Haste is equivalent to a single-target Fireball.
That's what I want to point. Haste is not ALWAYS beneficial. It's mostly bad. Fireball is way stronger in non circumstancial situations.
Haste is a circumstancial spell.
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At character level 5 or 6, a big boom spell will probably have a bigger impact on the fight in most circumstances. But as Malk_Content said, a level 3 Fireball stops being a meaningful source of damage later in the game, while a level 3 Haste is always relevant - just like other buff spells.
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I think Haste should also be evaluated for the case when it allows another party member to execute their preferred combat routine a turn earlier.
For example, you get into combat by surprise so folks don't have their weapons drawn. You Haste the Barbarian, allowing him to draw, rage, stride and strike.
Or a sneaky monk: he has a Rogue Dedication and uses Avoid Notice, so he starts out treating enemies as flat-footed. You Haste him, and he activates Wolf Stance, strides, and uses Wolf Drag to toss an enemy on the ground and deal sneak attack and backstab damage. When the enemy stands up, he uses Stand Still to make an AoO. Because of your Haste, he was able to get in there and start controlling the battlefield on round one, which he otherwise couldn't do until round two.
Spending a spell to buy someone else a round is a trade that is sometimes - but not always - worth it. Haste is no longer a no-brainer spell, it's not always the best spell to cast. But it can be in some cases. It's almost like you have to be clever to play a powerful wizard :P
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Let's actually examine that. On a Flurry Ranger, since that's the only circumstance people said it was good just for the extra attack in.
We'll assume 5th level, for simplicity.
Assuming a Fireball with a Save DC of 21 and a monster with a Moderate Reflex Save is +12. That's a DPR of 14.175. That's per target, mind you.
Haste, meanwhile, on a Flurry Ranger (who attacks at +8 on their third attack for 2d6+4 vs. Moderate AC of 21) will average 4.95. So...49.5 over ten rounds. But even three rounds exceed Fireball vs. a single target, and enemies often last three rounds in PF2.
That's not a clear win for fireball. It's certainly not a clear win for Haste either (fireball is great vs. groups and the damage is immediate), but it's not bad.
And very notably, Haste gets better as you level without taking up a higher spell slot, while fireball does not. I'd probably pick Fireball over Haste almost always at 5th level...but by 9th, that calculus may well have changed quite a bit in regards to my 3rd level slots.
Now, if we're talking people with a full -10 third attack then no, Haste is not a great choice on those people (barring two action attacks or other things to make it good), but Flurry Rangers were the point under contention and it looks pretty good on them to me.
The big benefit of single-targeting haste is that it allows for optimal positioning of 3-action abilities. That's a bonus it's hard to put a price on.I can put a price on that bonus, a 3rd level spell slot.
Which is a steep price at level 5. At level 15, a 3rd level spell slot probably won't be useful for blasts or incapacitation spells. But Haste remains just as good as ever.