The rules make it clear that armor can be easily and drastically modified to fit a variety of creature shapes or sizes, or to allow augmentations and other abilities to function despite the armor, such as is the case with climbing suckers or touch spells. How this is done, precisely, is a bit more vague and appears to be left up to the GM and players to explain away, however. And that makes sense; in a fantasy world full of indescribable technology, the designers likely wished to preserve player creativity by not definitively saying "this is the way this magic/technology works." It's enough for us to know that it does. We can fill in the blanks with our creativity and imagination however we like.
From my experience, most GMs treat it as fitting armor, which requires a successful Engineering check (DC = 10 + 2 × the armor’s level) or the expendenture of 10% of the armor’s purchase price to have it adjusted by a professional.
A lot of people also debate whether or not you can use light armor upgrades underneath other armor, such as powered armor. After all, it makes sense to many that the jump jets on your light armor can't lift the added bulk of your powered armor.
However, I was thinking that if ysoki armor can be modified to accommodate a large, four-armed shobhad with minimal fuss, then I don't see why armor couldn't be modified to allow its armor upgrades to function through other armor.
For example, say I had a second skin with jump jets, and a battle harness. It's easy enough to say that the jump jets are on the calves and lower back of the second skin, and that the battle harness has been modified to "slot" the exhaust ports or whatever so that they continue to function despite the sheath of powered armor. Even with much larger armor, we can describe the joined systems as funneling more power to the jets, allowing for enough thrust to lift even large powered suits.
This isn't a question of whether one CAN do it (we already have a thread for that), but rather a discussion on whether one should allow it, and what the possible ramifications of doing so may be. If you wouldn't allow it, then I ask why not? What do you stand to gain by limiting player options? If you do allow it, then do you worry about violating the armor upgrade slot limit rules? Or do you think that, at least in the case of light armors and powered armors, this was the intended function?
However, I was thinking that if ysoki armor can be modified to accommodate a large, four-armed shobhad with minimal fuss, then I don't see why armor couldn't be modified to allow its armor upgrades to function through other armor.
Because game mechanics and balance. Because this is a game first and foremost not a what if simulator in magical engineering.
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I wouldn't allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with Power Armor to function through power armor when attached to Light Armor. I would allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with PA to effect the wearer (internally directed) when worn on LA under PA.
But looking at a list of armor upgrades, that distinction doesn't matter to any of them except maybe the Spell Reflector. All the others that are LA or HA only look like they interface or effect the exterior world enough that I wouldn't allow them to function through PA.
However, I was thinking that if ysoki armor can be modified to accommodate a large, four-armed shobhad with minimal fuss, then I don't see why armor couldn't be modified to allow its armor upgrades to function through other armor.Because game mechanics and balance. Because this is a game first and foremost not a what if simulator in magical engineering.
So you won't allow armor slots from two sets of worn armor at your table due to perceived problems with balance. Do I have that right? Would you care to elaborate on that a bit further? I can definitely understand the concern, but could a player really throw off the balance when there are so many other balancing factors in play, such as item levels and credits by level limitations?
I for one seem to have a hard time filling all of the slots of one suit of armor with near-level appropriate upgrades (much less two!), unless I'm willing to suffer a significant hit to AC and/or weapon damage by getting cheaper gear elsewhere.
Sure it might be nice (and relatively cheap)to have 5 quick-release sheaths for my 5 weapons, but is that really going to have a meaningful enough impact on game balance or gameplay that it would warrant restricting it as an option?
If you could provide some examples in which being able to equip and use upgrade slots on both light armor and powered armor would clearly be broken, then perhaps some of us could understand your position better.
I wouldn't allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with Power Armor to function through power armor when attached to Light Armor. I would allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with PA to effect the wearer (internally directed) when worn on LA under PA.
That's a good point! I hadn't considered armor type restrictions. I too likely would have similar restrictions.
So you won't allow armor slots from two sets of worn armor at your table due to perceived problems with balance.
I wouldn't allow a house rule allowing armor slots from two sets of armor worn because it would absolutely be unbalancing.
could a player really throw off the balance when there are so many other balancing factors in play, such as item levels and credits by level limitations?
Yes. A large part of the higher expense for armor is the additional armor upgrades.
I for one seem to have a hard time filling all of the slots of one suit of armor with near-level appropriate upgrades (much less two!), unless I'm willing to suffer a significant hit to AC and/or weapon damage by getting cheaper gear elsewhere.
Then don't buy level appropriate armor. Buy adamantine second skin and a second skin sandwhich . use the money saved on armor to fill out on upgrades.
Sure it might be nice (and relatively cheap)to have 5 quick-release sheaths for my 5 weapons, but is that really going to have a meaningful enough impact on game balance or gameplay that it would warrant restricting it as an option?
You get a filtered rebreather, ablative armor, electrostatic field, sonic dampeners, thermal capacitors and jump jets and a jet pack.
A character normally has to pick and choose between options and or pay out the nose for armor that has more slots.
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Honestly, I agree with BNW. Letting players start applying any number of low level armor upgrades gets ridiculous fast.
Haste circuits, deflective reinforcement, radiation buffers, targeting computers, slickskin, stabilizers, leapers, multiple teleportation units...
The list goes on, at a certain level, all these upgrades are basically free.
If it's ridiculous to use multiple second skins to grab a dozen useful low level armor upgrades in addition to those in your primary armor, it's ridiculous to use a single second skin to install an addition armor upgrade.
As much as it makes sense, I would hesitate to allow even wearing a single second skin as a backup set of environmental protections. You're going to have to buy and install a quicksuit upgrade for that.
However, for light armor and power armor - I'd probably do exactly what xenocrat has written.
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To be clear, I'm not talking about wearing multiple second skins, layering more than two legal sets of armor, or anything of the sort. I'm talking only about where it is explicitly allowed in the rules (ie, light armor and powered armor).
And since this isn't a Rules thread, this discussion is meant to be as much about describing the ingame fluff of how this could be done (or why it can't be done) as much as it is about the rules mechanics themselves.
In short, a sharing of table variation and ideas that might conceivably help players and GMs better determine whether or not to permit it at their tables, and how best to run or describe it if they do.
Ah, then this:
I wouldn't allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with Power Armor to function through power armor when attached to Light Armor. I would allow an armor upgrade that isn't compatible with PA to effect the wearer (internally directed) when worn on LA under PA.
But looking at a list of armor upgrades, that distinction doesn't matter to any of them except maybe the Spell Reflector. All the others that are LA or HA only look like they interface or effect the exterior world enough that I wouldn't allow them to function through PA.
Is probably the best way to run things.
You basically get your protective upgrades (it is your hit points getting hit after all), and not your fly/teleport/etc. upgrades.
Power armor doesn't have a whole lot going for it, may as well create some incentive.