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And now we've seen the Alchemist being released, and there are a number of interesting reveals here.
First of all is the revelation that anyone can now learn to create alchemical items like the Alchemist can, by taking the Alchemical Crafter feat, although the Alchemist will still be better at it, as he gets more formulas. Nonetheless, it provides a level of flexibility for other characters.
The bombs also start as being actual alchemical items (a change that I really enjoy the look of), so that instead of "random bomb X", the Alchemist will now be throwing recognizable equipment like alchemist's fire and thunderstones. (Should be interesting to see a damaging tangleweb bag too. Well, one can hope). - Of course, the alchemist's versions will do more damage, but it is a neat little change that makes the items far more useful and recognizable.
Of course, the Alchemist still retains their mutagens, making them more capable in various ways, though the details of the mutagens are still unknown. Presumably, they'll remain pretty close to the current ones.
The Alchemist feats allow the bombs and alchemical items to become more powerful, higher DCs, more accurate, and do more damage. Pretty much what is expected, but Debilitating Bomb looks particularly interesting as it lets you apply different conditions to the target of a bomb. I could easily see someone making an alchemist's fire bomb that also caused the primary target to be sickened or something similar. It would make for some great storytelling, with the target retching as he burns alive. (Gruesome yes, but interesting).
Finally, the mutagen feats allow the Alchemist to warp their mutagens in various ways, like gaining natural weapons, bonuses to Intimidate check or even making him stealthier.
All interesting stuff, but I would have liked to have seen a bit more of the mutagens PRIMARY effects, but hopefully that'll come eventually. That, and I hope it gets possible to make a PROPER Jekyll/Hyde style character, but it looks like the Mutagen feats should make that possible.
See you next time,
Edit: I forgot to mention one thing. They teased the Oracle here. Could that be joining the Core classes as well? THAT would be an interesting choice, and one I'd be happy to see.
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(Oracle is not joining the core classes or appearing in the CRB. Jason Bulmahn confirmed that in a livestream.)
Ah, bugger. I must have missed that. Just had my hopes up. :(
boooo hisss booo I say. BOO!!!!
I don't like the alchemist
I liked the class as it had the potential to fit SO many concepts. The only thing I didn't enjoy was 'not-spells but totally acts like spells'. the new class seems like a step back in versatility so I'll have to see how it shakes out before I say good or bad.
(Oracle is not joining the core classes or appearing in the CRB. Jason Bulmahn confirmed that in a livestream.)
What Steelfiredragon said about the alchemist, but instead about the oracle! That makes me a sad panda. :(
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One thing I'd like to point out, for all the people complaining about things like "You have to take +Int. to bomb damage as a feat" and stuff: this is a good thing.
It's a good thing IF you only look at it in a vacuum. Depending on number of 1st level feats, it could be a overall reduction in 1st level competence as you may only get one of the multiple abilities you started off with by default so it might take you until 5th or 7th JUST to collect everything you now normally start with. So a more open framework is only 'better' if it's not held back by a much slow power up curve.
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Depending on number of 1st level feats, it could be a overall reduction in 1st level competence as you may only get one of the multiple abilities you started off with by default so it might take you until 5th or 7th JUST to collect everything you now normally start with. So a more open framework is only 'better' if it's not held back by a much slow power up curve.
This seems like an across the board design feature of classes at this point. They will certainly all be less front loaded with abilities. Personally, I am fine with this as long as it is consistent, but it does seem like a lot of folks are disappointed that first level characters will have less intrinsic class and ancestry abilities than in the current system.
A possible solution would be for the developers to make it clear that the game is designed to be less bloated at higher levels and that starting campaigns at 3-5 level is fine for players and gamers that are looking for starting characters that more closely resemble lower level first edition characters.
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This isn't "You no longer get +Int. to bomb damage." this is "If you're playing an Alchemist that doesn't care about bombs, you aren't forced to have +Int. to bomb damage... but you can still keep it if you want."
"We felt it rude to only feat tax Alchemists that wanted to play a support role. As such, we are looking into ways to feat tax every build now. Thank you for understanding" - Paizo.
Here's a thing! I don't like Familiars! Or at least I don't 'use' them. I have them as a fluffy animal that gives a bonus but that's basically it. I do not, however, feel that having a familiar is a bad thing to my character. Sure I can take an archetype to get rid of it, but why should I?
So why is "you get bonus damage to bombs if you use them" suddenly "You have to use bombs and nothing else"? Oh no it's maybe because all the other builds are feat tax based(Infusion for Support, and some Discovery taxes for Mutagen. Or get Martial Weapons somehow).
Could have gotten rid of the taxes, nope. Just threw bombs into the same hole.
it does seem like a lot of folks are disappointed that first level characters will have less intrinsic class and ancestry abilities than in the current system.
I'm in that group. It'll seem like a huge downgrade when moving to the new system if you only start with one or 2 of the dozen abilities you're used to: IMO, it'll seem like you're starting at less than 1st level. Then add to that the boost in hp and it seems like combats will be longer but with less to do. Then too, it seems like you get less from your race too...
I just can't see how getting less isn't going to FEEL like less even if it's a matter of everyone being less.
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"We felt it rude to only feat tax Alchemists that wanted to play a support role. As such, we are looking into ways to feat tax every build now. Thank you for understanding" - Paizo.It's not a feat tax if they're also giving you a lot of feats with which to take the abilities.
Yeah, no that doesn't excuse removing it. Let's remove weapon mastery and familairs. Animal companion too, who cares, they'll get feats for it right?
10 feats AT best and about 5 of those are going into your actual own supposed to be given abilities. And that's if you aren't level locked out of them.
I'm sorry who wants to play nerfed versions of the classes? When the heck do actual builds come online? What else can I spend these feats on and what will be expected to SPEND on?
I get this is a whole "Player choice" thing. But I see it as taking away the candy to put back into the vending machine and then expecting us to PAY for said candy that we HAD already.
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Off on a tangent for a bit, I once had an Alchemist who had an intradasting fluff for his Poison Bomb's Cloudkill effect. He threw jars of brine that transmuted upon impact. The salt would convert to form a shell of alchemically enhanced chlorine gas, and the sodium would become pure metal shaped for maximum surface contact with the former brine's water.
Boom! An explosive that disperses clouds of unnaturally potent killer gasses.
Anyways, he was an Internal Alchemist, and the brine was actually drawn from body. He ate a lot of pickles.
So, to draw this unasked for tangent back to the PF2 Alchemist, I can say that this kind of fluff action was fun for generic bombs, but I'm not exactly salty about using premade alchemical items. I'm pretty excited to get my hands on the full list of alchemical goods, see what I can mix and match, and see what kind of pseudo-science I can literally throw at all who dare to not only oppose ME, but would have enough of a brass set of savings throws to oppose PROGRESS IT'S SELF!
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PROGRESS IT'S SELF!
Nothing against you but this brings up a question for me.
So lemme get this right; we have to draw bombs from X number of Alchemical items(As of right now, say 5-6) for effects and or damage right/.
As opposed to the "I have X bombs. And I spend them normally or what discoveries I have for them".
This is better? This makes the paperwork easier to make sure I need X items to actually use my bombs? Or make sure I have X to toss as my bombs?
"Huh today I'll prepare X fire bombs, Y ice bombs, and maybe Z Entangle bombs". Is this how it works and if so, how is this easier?
I'm not going crazy am I, how is this progress?
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I was referring to myself as progress. The joke is megalomania.
I don't know I feel like the alchemist using alchemical items is a massive improvement. Especially since it seems that he can improve those alchemical items. If he just copied spells You could just make it a weird archetype for the wizard.
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In fact, the Alchemist is a lot like an alchemy-based Wizard now: preparing your alchemical items from a formulary at the start of each day, buying backup items for when you need them, and so on. And you have the ability to prepare for a variety of different situations based on what you think you'll need that day, instead of being locked into a few specific choices that can't be changed.
This is something that I like. The whole mixing up bombs on the spot and then hurling them always seemed weird to me, especially when due to levels, feats, etc. an alchemist was getting multiple bomb attacks in a round. I've seen alchemists throw four or more bombs per round, the implication being that he was mixing and accurately tossing one bomb every 1.5 seconds or less. To my mind, that was silly as similar rates of fire with the muzzle-loading black powder weapons of gunslingers.
Carefully making a selection of bombs and other alchemical items at the start of the day, similar to how prepared casters work, makes much more sense to me.
In fact, the Alchemist is a lot like an alchemy-based Wizard now: preparing your alchemical items from a formulary at the start of each day, buying backup items for when you need them, and so on. And you have the ability to prepare for a variety of different situations based on what you think you'll need that day, instead of being locked into a few specific choices that can't be changed.This is something that I like. The whole mixing up bombs on the spot and then hurling them always seemed weird to me, especially when due to levels, feats, etc. an alchemist was getting multiple bomb attacks in a round. I've seen alchemists throw four or more bombs per round, the implication being that he was mixing and accurately tossing one bomb every 1.5 seconds or less. To my mind, that was silly as similar rates of fire with the muzzle-loading black powder weapons of gunslingers.
Carefully making a selection of bombs and other alchemical items at the start of the day, similar to how prepared casters work, makes much more sense to me.
Now I'm down with that as along as it has the physical presence. The idea that your carrying all those potions what not around. I don't want it to just be a wizard with a different description of how they memorize their spells.
it does seem like a lot of folks are disappointed that first level characters will have less intrinsic class and ancestry abilities than in the current system.I'm in that group. It'll seem like a huge downgrade when moving to the new system if you only start with one or 2 of the dozen abilities you're used to: IMO, it'll seem like you're starting at less than 1st level. Then add to that the boost in hp and it seems like combats will be longer but with less to do. Then too, it seems like you get less from your race too...
I just can't see how getting less isn't going to FEEL like less even if it's a matter of everyone being less.
Graystone, I am curious if you would feel this way if the designers came out and said, "consider PF2 characters x levels (2 or 3 is my guess) behind PF1 characters, but far more of our adventure materials are going to be designed to go all the way to level 20, and levels 15+ are far more playable."
If you knew that a 3rd or 4th level PF2 character was designed to be the equivalent of a PF1 character, would it feel as much like "losing?"
For me, levels 15+ in PF1 look cool, but have proven to be all but unplayable when put in to practice. I'd rather get those levels back at the cost of some upfront.
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Hmm I see so the idea would be say by level 3 you have what a level 1 pf1 charcter would have then say by 15 you might have more but with the new design your easier able to play to 20 so really you end up with more in the long run.
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Ok! Now that I'm sober, let's try to string together a few coherent thoughts while I reassemble my microwave.
So alchemist, yeah? The problem I have with forming an opinion on the class as a whole is that Paizo's playing things close to the vest until august. Well, hopefully august, I can't see the future. Which is fine, just how they're doing it. Oh, yeah, alchemy.
They've revamped the alchemy system! What does that mean?
What kind of items are we working with? How do we make them, outside of the daily free stuff and whatever you do with resonance? Are there periphery items like focusing flasks and hybridization funnels? What are elixirs? How does resonance play into this?
Just the alchemy system on it's own can make or break this class, which makes sense, considering that it's an alchemist. That's not even getting into feats, skills, mutagens, the potential soft cap on designing alchemical bombs if only one class gets to multiply their damage, and archetypes. What the heck even are archetypes?
In conclusion, I don't know what's going on.
I hunger. Hunger for knowledge! And breakfast.
I guess I should put that microwave back together.
EDIT:
If you knew that a 3rd or 4th level PF2 character was designed to be the equivalent of a 1st level PF1 character, would it feel as much like "losing?"
In fact, the Alchemist is a lot like an alchemy-based Wizard now: preparing your alchemical items from a formulary at the start of each day, buying backup items for when you need them, and so on. And you have the ability to prepare for a variety of different situations based on what you think you'll need that day, instead of being locked into a few specific choices that can't be changed.This is something that I like. The whole mixing up bombs on the spot and then hurling them always seemed weird to me, especially when due to levels, feats, etc. an alchemist was getting multiple bomb attacks in a round. I've seen alchemists throw four or more bombs per round, the implication being that he was mixing and accurately tossing one bomb every 1.5 seconds or less. To my mind, that was silly as similar rates of fire with the muzzle-loading black powder weapons of gunslingers.
Carefully making a selection of bombs and other alchemical items at the start of the day, similar to how prepared casters work, makes much more sense to me.
It's kind of irrelevant with the new action economy, but fast bombs could easily be seen as pre-mixed catalyst/reagent packages that are transmuted into active bombs by the alchemist's proto-resonance as they throw them. By the time they can toss a boatload of them, any two weapon throwing rogue could do the same with similar objects. But hey, you might not like that flavor. I don't like fish.
But as I said, irrelevant. The new version just lets you draw two as an action, so you aren't trapped in the hell of draw-throw-draw throw-draw-throw draw-throw-draw. You know, if something prevents you from moving. Like a spell, or being comfortably behind a fighter, or maybe brain damage. Well, that's what the level one feat does for now. There might be more later, or they could change it before or during the playtest. I'm not psychic. Yet.
I'm more interested in the Delay Bombs getting ported over to a class feat as teased by Don Parsons over at Techraptor. I wonder what it's going to take to get something to be standing on the X just as the pile of acme brand dynamite goes off?
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6 x damage and about 19 x hit points when this ability reaches its peak. It's going to feel like your damage dropped threefold from low levels, unless some feats or expensive items help (which they probably do). It's likely a fault of relying on previews rather than the syetem as a whole.
If you knew that a 3rd or 4th level PF2 character was designed to be the equivalent of a PF1 character, would it feel as much like "losing?"
Yes. A LOT.
For me, levels 15+ in PF1 look cool, but have proven to be all but unplayable when put in to practice. I'd rather get those levels back at the cost of some upfront.
For me, I KNOW it's unlikely I'll EVER see those levels. Not because it's 'unplayable' but online gaming groups tend to end before then as real life inevitably intrudes. So slowing down the starting levels that's I'll actually see in play to expect the play into level I most likely am not going to see is a net loss for me. From my experience, games break down around 8-12 at best: this means I'm going to spend 2-3 of my playable levels as an 'apprentice' while never seeing the 'benefits' of starting 'less front loaded'.
If you knew that a 3rd or 4th level PF2 character was designed to be the equivalent of a PF1 character, would it feel as much like "losing?"Yes. A LOT.
I started a new thread to continue this conversation since this topic felt a little off topic of discussing the alchemist specifically.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2v28g?Character-level-progression-and-less#1
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Sure... but then they give us all the money we need. They took a chocolate bar from us, put it in the machine with all the other types of candy, and then gave us the money to choose which candy we like best, instead of being forced to have chocolate whether we like it or not. Again, you're not losing the ability, you can just choose it with the extra feat you get (remember, class feats are entirely separate from other feat lines, you're gonna end up with dozens of total feats from various sources by level 20).
I get this is a whole "Player choice" thing. But I see it as taking away the candy to put back into the vending machine and then expecting us to PAY for said candy that we HAD already.
Not losing the ability just making it a feat tax. Also not "Dozens". 10. From the leveling blog, you get a Class feat, something you SHOULD have anyway, every 2 levels. So 10. Now 9 because if you WANT to be bomber, you need this feat. And because most games don't go to 20 anyway let's knock that number down to 7 or 8. Which is now 6-7 after the feat tax. Thanks Paizo for that.
Where are you getting this Dozens from? Heck it's less if Normal Feats and Class Feats share the same pool. Why do you think you're getting more money?
I don't like Familiars(Bitter candy) but that doesn't mean I just give it back and say "Gimme Chocolate!"
I'm not going crazy am I, how is this progress?There are two main things I like about this. The first is that you can have an alchemist with various different types of energy bombs without having to spend Discoveries to get them. If you're a base Alchemist bomber, and you're going up against a red dragon but you didn't take the ice-based bomb Discovery? Well, you're [apparently this forum auto-censors] out of luck. Now, though, you can just prepare ice bombs that day.
And two, tying the bombs into items that you get for free each day means that you can back that up with money. You can buy a set of bombs (or other alchemical items) as backups, and have those ready if you need them, while still being able to apply your class-specific alchemy enhancements and whatnot to them. Kind of like a Wizard and scrolls, except that you'll also be able to apply feats and abilities to them when you use them, which Wizards can't generally do with scrolls.
In fact, the Alchemist is a lot like an alchemy-based Wizard now: preparing your alchemical items from a formulary at the start of each day, buying backup items for when you need them, and so on. And you have the ability to prepare for a variety of different situations based on what you think you'll need that day, instead of being locked into a few specific choices that can't be changed.
Yeah you get your ice bombs. IF you made them that day. Did you know you were fighting something with Fire Res? You didn't? Well you're [apparently this forum auto-censors] out of luck. With Discoveries, I make, 8 bombs. Oh no Dragon, my Fire bombs are useless! Wait I took Elemental Discovery, I'll use my bombs for that. Because I didn't need to make them ahead of time I just made BOMBS. Also, if you hate being a bomber, WHY are you complaining that you can't do anything with your bombs against a Dragon? You should be handing out extracts to your friends or Mutagen.
And this is balanced? Hey what's the workaround if your Alchemist just makes 8 firebombs a day and you're running an Undead heavy game? "Alchemist can't use them all at once" NO but his party CAN! "Oh but they're weaker" Elemental Damage up or just getting around AC in general. Scrolls are harder for other team mates to use, Bombs just throw them. Espically with a DEX build such as an archer or Rogue. Also, Thanks Paizo for making the class have a bloody price tag to it. Did I want this nice magic item? Too bad, my team wants Exlirs and bombs, that's where my cash is going into.
See the issue was Alchemist was closer to a Spontanous caster. Or at least a very QUICK Prepared caster. Extracts took a minute, Bombs could be used on any Discovery as you tossed them, Heck Mutagen took an hour to brew up again. Alchemists could very easily cover a broad range.
Now? Well I hope your cleric uses scry a lot because you are going to need to know what's coming and brew accordingly. Or have a massive hole in your pocket. We are not alchemical geniuses or madmen. We're the supply officer now.
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Minor factual error in the above: Non-casters get a Class Feat at 1st level as well as the even numbered ones, and thus have 11 Class Feats, not 10.
Now, I suspect a dedicated bomber is probably gonna invest several of those in bombs, but that's no different from PF1 where several Bomb discoveries were basically required if they wanted to be a really good bomber. Heck, at least changing elemental damage type doesn't require a Discovery/Class Feat any more.
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[...] Yeah you get your ice bombs. IF you made them that day. Did you know you were fighting something with Fire Res? You didn't? Well you're [apparently this forum auto-censors] out of luck. With Discoveries, I make, 8 bombs. Oh no Dragon, my Fire bombs are useless! Wait I took Elemental Discovery, I'll use my bombs for that. Because I didn't need to make them ahead of time I just made BOMBS. [...]
In PF2 you can still make more on the fly:
[...] he can also spend resonance to create alchemical objects on the fly, [...]
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Did you know you were fighting something with Fire Res? You didn't? Well you're out of luck.
How is this different than any prepared caster in the game?
Prepare a good variety of things. Keep some alternative things (scrolls for wizards or pay-for alchemy items for an alchemist) in case your prepared spells don't work well for the day.
I'm not sure what the big issue is with needing to prepare most of your items ahead of time.
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Minor factual error in the above: Non-casters get a Class Feat at 1st level as well as the even numbered ones, and thus have 11 Class Feats, not 10.
Now, I suspect a dedicated bomber is probably gonna invest several of those in bombs, but that's no different from PF1 where several Bomb discoveries were basically required if they wanted to be a really good bomber. Heck, at least changing elemental damage type doesn't require a Discovery/Class Feat any more.
Oh good, 10 feats because of tax, and 8-9 because of game length.
No just requires either more bookkeeping to make sure you have filled out your item slots or gold to skip the problem.
[...] Yeah you get your ice bombs. IF you made them that day. Did you know you were fighting something with Fire Res? You didn't? Well you're [apparently this forum auto-censors] out of luck. With Discoveries, I make, 8 bombs. Oh no Dragon, my Fire bombs are useless! Wait I took Elemental Discovery, I'll use my bombs for that. Because I didn't need to make them ahead of time I just made BOMBS. [...]In PF2 you can still make more on the fly:
[...] he can also spend resonance to create alchemical objects on the fly, [...]
[...] at the cost of Resonance [...]
Which they had to give Alchemists a buff to the number of Resonance they have to make sure said class isn't completely gimped. But that goes on to break the reason Resonance was put into the game in the first place. Step forward, step back, step to the side and then diagonally somewhere.
Did you know you were fighting something with Fire Res? You didn't? Well you're out of luck.How is this different than any prepared caster in the game?
Prepare a good variety of things. Keep some alternative things (scrolls for wizards or pay-for alchemy items for an alchemist) in case your prepared spells don't work well for the day.
I'm not sure what the big issue is with needing to prepare most of your items ahead of time.
The fact we weren't fully prepared casters before, are not casters of any kind now, but are still being forced into a prepared role anyway?
Also a 'big issue' is balance. If all the items are improved, Alchemist can just crank them out every day before sleeping and thus the team now has a slew of good items to back them up. People complain about Wand spam, wow I can see the Alchemist spam just causing issues.
OH and all you people that like playing in PFS? Well jokes on you, most Crafting is banned. Prepare to be bombers anyway.
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Oh good, 10 feats because of tax, and 8-9 because of game length.
No just requires either more bookkeeping to make sure you have filled out your item slots or gold to skip the problem.
Yes? And? Those are both much preferable to having to invest actual character resources into having multiple elements.
Which they had to give Alchemists a buff to the number of Resonance they have to make sure said class isn't completely gimped. But that goes on to break the reason Resonance was put into the game in the first place. Step forward, step back, step to the side and then diagonally somewhere.
I'm not sure what you even mean by 'breaks the reason Resonance was put in the game'.
The fact we weren't fully prepared casters before, are not casters of any kind now, but are still being forced into a prepared role anyway?
Alchemists have always been 'prepared casters' without actually being casters. This hasn't changed at all.
Also a 'big issue' is balance. If all the items are improved, Alchemist can just crank them out every day before sleeping and thus the team now has a slew of good items to back them up. People complain about Wand spam, wow I can see the Alchemist spam just causing issues.
Based on demo games, this is false. alchemists get free items every day, sure, but they don't accumulate (exact mechanics aren't clear but they don't accumulate).
So this is not a thing that will be happening.
OH and all you people that like playing in PFS? Well jokes on you, most Crafting is banned. Prepare to be bombers anyway.
If crafting alchemical items is banned, the 'bombs' would be banned too since they're alchemical items. As that would make alchemist utterly useless, it seems unlikely. I'm pretty sure PFS will solve this a different way.
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Yes? And? Those are both much preferable to having to invest actual character resources into having multiple elements.
Ah so, Feat taxes are just fine if it doesn't actually make you consider what you actually want. No no, it's fine if we can just completely invalidate some choices with items now.
I'm not sure what you even mean by 'breaks the reason Resonance was put in the game'.
Limiter to magic items as a whole. And Alchemist has a higher pool natually. Wait why?
Alchemists have always been 'prepared casters' without actually being casters. This hasn't changed at all.
Prepared, with the option to quickly brew up some things if you didn't use all the slots. And to recover Mutagen. And to not have to worry about what bombs you made, but what bombs you used.
Based on demo games, this is false. alchemists get free items every day, sure, but they don't accumulate (exact mechanics aren't clear but they don't accumulate).So this is not a thing that will be happening.
Wait wait wait, are you telling me the GOLD based items we make are temporary? HOLY ZEN talk about a worthless class feature!
If crafting alchemical items is banned, the 'bombs' would be banned too since they're alchemical items. As that would make alchemist utterly useless, it seems unlikely. I'm pretty sure PFS will solve this a different way.
"You can craft bombs but that's it." - PFS. That's what I expect if I'm honest. If so, what's the difference to now?
I don't have a problem with Alchemists having a higher resonance, if you want to call it that, for their own items. The abilities just need to be balanced such that the Alchemist being able to throw 100 alchemist fires per day doesn't outshine every other class (or force every other class to partake in alchemist fire throwing to remain relevant, which would be boring). Maybe the uses over 8 (or whatever daily use is appropriate) are no better than anyone would have for buying and throwing alchemist fire, but the Alchemist only has to pay for the ingredients, not the whole cost.
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Based on demo games, this is false. alchemists get free items every day, sure, but they don't accumulate (exact mechanics aren't clear but they don't accumulate).
So this is not a thing that will be happening.
Wait wait wait, are you telling me the GOLD based items we make are temporary? HOLY ZEN talk about a worthless class feature!
Again, how is this system different from the extracts alchemists currently make?
When an alchemist mixes an extract, he infuses the chemicals and reagents in the extract with magic siphoned from his own magical aura. An extract immediately becomes inert if it leaves the alchemist's possession, reactivating as soon as it returns to his keeping—an alchemist cannot normally pass out his extracts for allies to use (but see the “infusion” discovery below). An extract, once created, remains potent for 1 day before losing its magic, so an alchemist must re-prepare his extracts every day. Mixing an extract takes 1 minute of work—most alchemists prepare many extracts at the start of the day or just before going on an adventure, but it's not uncommon for an alchemist to keep some (or even all) of his daily extract slots open so that he can prepare extracts in the field as needed.
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Again, how is this system different from the extracts alchemists currently make?Based on demo games, this is false. alchemists get free items every day, sure, but they don't accumulate (exact mechanics aren't clear but they don't accumulate).
So this is not a thing that will be happening.
Wait wait wait, are you telling me the GOLD based items we make are temporary? HOLY ZEN talk about a worthless class feature!
The fact that you actually can spend gold to make them accumulate? That alchemists can be expected to and could be expected too if the math favors it, to spend part of their gold to make them?
I'm going to have to comb the thread but didn't a dev say you could craft with gold to make them permanent? Or is that just a leading idea?
You get Formula per day. You get some extra with Resoance. And you can actually craft the Formula/Bombs/Alchemical Items anyway with gold. I'm sorry I highly doubt they're giong to make things like Alchemist Fire into a full class feature.
Never mind that they also have to bloody fix the crafting rules anyway as it takes about a week to make anything.
PF1 alchemists make items for their groups, already. So that hasn’t changed.
Downtime rules in Core should make crafting easier.
Yes but now we're talking about quite possible more useful items. Espically if the Exiliars that aren't Potions but are totally Potions can be made.
This all depends on the numbers they release yes but if Alchemist Bombs are competitive in damage, without an alchemist throwing them, well there's a few bombs made up daily, weekly. If only to get around Elemental defense and AC. To say nothing about other Alchemical effects that they might cook up.
"How's that different now?" I'm sure someone will say. Difference? They are trying to make the items Better. I for one want better alchemical items but if the whole slow(Bombs, Exiliars that aren't potions or extracts but totally are, and others) Then well get to crafting. Because unlike Mages, you have no daily limit. Unless the rules get changed.
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But you will have a daily limit, because those potions and things will likely end up using Resonance. So, if you spend a ton of gold stockpiling alchemical items in your bag of holding IV that you've got strapped to your back you will likely eventually run out of resonance.
You can make a number of them for free. I imagine the freebie daily items will let you bypass Resonance when you use them.
This would make alchemists and mages similar in both their ability to use spell-ish things in addition to what happens when they use items outside of their daily allotment.