Spaceships, spaceships and spaceships

[Giorgo]

David knott 242 wrote:

The lack of automation is a relic of the time when the original movies were made. The impact of future technology on our everyday lives was tremendously underestimated back then.

More recent SF properties like Mass Effect and Halo seem to employ a higher level of automization and AI use, even Babylon 5 and the revised Star Treck movies seems to do the same.

What other modern SF IP implies more computer/AI less meatbags for running starship functions?

[David knott 242]

Giorgo wrote:

David knott 242 wrote:

The lack of automation is a relic of the time when the original movies were made. The impact of future technology on our everyday lives was tremendously underestimated back then.

More recent SF properties like Mass Effect and Halo seem to employ a higher level of automization and AI use, even Babylon 5 and the revised Star Treck movies seems to do the same.

What other modern SF IP implies more computer/AI less meatbags for running starship functions?

I was definitely thinking of Sci-Fi shows prior to Babylon 5.

[JTDIV]

Who owns the ship?

I do understand that starships are not tied to Starfinder credits. But the concept of sharing the starship can become problematic for a number of reasons.

For example, who has final authority (or veto) of the use of the vehicle? Perhaps the Captain is an Ahab type and wants revenge, but the Engineer feels the ship cannot successfully win the next skirmish. Or perhaps a character has to barter with ship-stealing pirates for the lives of the crew in exchange for the ship; but maybe the other characters would rather fight to the death than give up their ship. So who decides? Or is this a democracy? Do they cast lots? Roshambo to respect the authoriti? In Pathfinder, the players do not typically share a horse so I'm trying to understand what happens next.

Another example, a character acquires their own personal ship during a campaign and exits their original ship role on the original ship (Perhaps they were the captain and of course someone else will fill the role as captain - that's not the issue). What happens to the original ship when all the characters acquire personal ships? <-- this scenario, of course, might explain the whole not tied to Starfinder credits mechanic so that the last surviving role of the original crew doesn't sell the ship and keep the money for themselves. But it does leave a fully functioning ship somewhere, which seems like a waste of resources. What to do next?

[Distant Scholar]

I think the answer is, "Players have to work that out amongst each other."

[Steelfiredragon]

I was going to ask why a pc would even want tehir own personal ship outside the party ship.... unless your pc is unhappy with the party and wants to leave....

[Seisho]

Or maybe in the case the big part of the party flies one bis ship while one or two got personal fighter crafts which can support the big one in combat

[Torbyne]

I for one would jump at a game where two players share ownership of a medium frieghter converted over to micro carrier and another 2-3 payers each have their hot rodded fighters kept in the converted bays.

[Seisho]

sounds pretty cool

[Imbicatus]

Torbyne wrote:

I for one would jump at a game where two players share ownership of a medium frieghter converted over to micro carrier and another 2-3 payers each have their hot rodded fighters kept in the converted bays.

Reminds me of Wraith Squadron.

[Torbyne]

Imbicatus wrote:

Torbyne wrote:

I for one would jump at a game where two players share ownership of a medium frieghter converted over to micro carrier and another 2-3 payers each have their hot rodded fighters kept in the converted bays.

Reminds me of Wraith Squadron.

From Star Wars? i have heard of the series but never read it. Was it a fun read?

I admit my thoughts about it come from star wars anyways, after seeing the Baleen class frieghter in episode VII swallow up the Falcon i got to thinking about how well that thing would work as a mobile base of operations for a small group of mercenary fighters. star wars fighters need next to no space for take off and landing and the force fields around their bays means you can land, maintain, arm and launch all from the same spot so housing fighters is really economical. i dont think that ship had any armament itself but that seems like the only real modifications it would need for the role. I thought the same thing seeing the C-ROC cruiser model for X Wing; a few of those side bays could easily convert over to a through and through bay for small craft and you still have space left over for munitions and loot.

[Imbicatus]

Torbyne wrote:

Imbicatus wrote:

Torbyne wrote:

I for one would jump at a game where two players share ownership of a medium frieghter converted over to micro carrier and another 2-3 payers each have their hot rodded fighters kept in the converted bays.

Reminds me of Wraith Squadron.

From Star Wars? i have heard of the series but never read it. Was it a fun read?

I admit my thoughts about it come from star wars anyways, after seeing the Baleen class frieghter in episode VII swallow up the Falcon i got to thinking about how well that thing would work as a mobile base of operations for a small group of mercenary fighters. star wars fighters need next to no space for take off and landing and the force fields around their bays means you can land, maintain, arm and launch all from the same spot so housing fighters is really economical. i dont think that ship had any armament itself but that seems like the only real modifications it would need for the role. I thought the same thing seeing the C-ROC cruiser model for X Wing; a few of those side bays could easily convert over to a through and through bay for small craft and you still have space left over for munitions and loot.

Yeah, in the book the wraiths set an ambush for a modified corvette, which they capture. They converted most of the cargo space to hangars, and carried six ties and five xwings and went and played imperials to take down Zsinj.

You really should read the x wing series, best Star Wars books I've read. Too bad they're not canon anymore.

[Torbyne]

Imbicatus wrote:

Torbyne wrote:

Imbicatus wrote:

Torbyne wrote:

I for one would jump at a game where two players share ownership of a medium frieghter converted over to micro carrier and another 2-3 payers each have their hot rodded fighters kept in the converted bays.

Reminds me of Wraith Squadron.

From Star Wars? i have heard of the series but never read it. Was it a fun read?

I admit my thoughts about it come from star wars anyways, after seeing the Baleen class frieghter in episode VII swallow up the Falcon i got to thinking about how well that thing would work as a mobile base of operations for a small group of mercenary fighters. star wars fighters need next to no space for take off and landing and the force fields around their bays means you can land, maintain, arm and launch all from the same spot so housing fighters is really economical. i dont think that ship had any armament itself but that seems like the only real modifications it would need for the role. I thought the same thing seeing the C-ROC cruiser model for X Wing; a few of those side bays could easily convert over to a through and through bay for small craft and you still have space left over for munitions and loot.

Yeah, in the book the wraiths set an ambush for a modified corvette, which they capture. They converted most of the cargo space to hangars, and carried six ties and five xwings and went and played imperials to take down Zsinj.

You really should read the x wing series, best Star Wars books I've read. Too bad they're not canon anymore.

I should have known my idea was too obvious to be new. i will be on the look out for those books though. I could do with some jedi-less star wars stories.

[Steelfiredragon]

Baleen is an example of a heavy freighter and as I've said before, the y-1300 is a light freighter.

but yeah... ,moving on

thing is though, you can even modify a heavy freighter so that it can compete with a frigate.....( but at that point, might be cheaper to get a frigate)

[Fardragon]

Steelfiredragon wrote:

I was going to ask why a pc would even want tehir own personal ship outside the party ship.... unless your pc is unhappy with the party and wants to leave....

That's no different from a character wanting to leave the party in Pathfinder. Generally, they are written out of the story.

As for fighters, we have discussed elsewhere why they are likely to be sub-optimal with the Starfinder starship combat rules, an why they are limiting on viable PC builds.

[Torbyne]

Fardragon wrote:

Steelfiredragon wrote:

I was going to ask why a pc would even want tehir own personal ship outside the party ship.... unless your pc is unhappy with the party and wants to leave....

That's no different from a character wanting to leave the party in Pathfinder. Generally, they are written out of the story.

As for fighters, we have discussed elsewhere why they are likely to be sub-optimal with the Starfinder starship combat rules, an why they are limiting on viable PC builds.

Oh, i think i missed that thread, where is it?

[Torbyne]

Just to revisit the thought, in D20 games i am used to action economy being king so the thought of three fighters that are level scaled to the PCs sounds like a better deal than one ship that is APL+2. I suppose there are ways to make a single ship better but have we really seen enough to know which way the system is biased? Can a gunner on a larger ship split fire between targets, do PC ships even have multiple weapon systems and attacks with them or do they work like PCs where you only get 1-2 shots per round or special template weapons?

[Fardragon]

Torbyne wrote:

Fardragon wrote:

Steelfiredragon wrote:

I was going to ask why a pc would even want tehir own personal ship outside the party ship.... unless your pc is unhappy with the party and wants to leave....

That's no different from a character wanting to leave the party in Pathfinder. Generally, they are written out of the story.

As for fighters, we have discussed elsewhere why they are likely to be sub-optimal with the Starfinder starship combat rules, an why they are limiting on viable PC builds.

Oh, i think i missed that thread, where is it?

This thread: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2uczk&page=last?Adventuring-Party-Starships

CKent83 makes a particularly insightful post on the drawbacks of a fighter campaign.

Action economy does seem to be a major factor in starship combat, but it's tied to the number of players, not the number of ships.

[Imbicatus]

Fighters can still fly and shoot. The combat demo I've sen the fighters were outclassed, but they were goblin ships. Yes having a captain and engineer is great, and a separate gunner means you aren't limited to a forward arc weapon. But I still think that with Fighter that aren't held together with tape and string, the number of weapons that multiple single fighters can bring to bear might be better than having everyone on a single ship. Especially if you have multiple characters with good piloting skills.

[Torbyne]

i actually just read through and posted some thoughts into the other thread... now i am unsure where to continue talking about the subject :(

[Fardragon]

I would merge both threads, they are on the same topic.