[Gamemastering] Player Management Question, Kind of Meta


Advice


I've got a player running an archery based fighter. The whole inspiration for this character was the buckler, which he firmly and staunchly believes gives him a +1 to AC even when using his bow. I, the DM, believe he is wrong in his interpretation of the (admittedly poorly worded) buckler rules and has to give up his AC bonus on the turn he fires the bow.

Now, I don't want this thread to be a rules debate. We've played about 5 sessions. I brought up that we've been doing this wrong. He has basically said this ruins the character and the fun for him. I see a few ways to possibly deal with this.

Let him have it - You didn't catch it when he made the character. Let him know I won't rule this any other time, but I'm keeping it for consistency. It won't get too gamebreaking until it becomes magical.

Hard, firm "No" - I'm the DM, so I win. Feels like a jerk move after he's been playing with the character a while, but those are the rules and whether or not to keep playing it is his choice.

Improved Buckler Defense - An old feat from 3.5 that isn't technically in Pathfinder, but it can be shoehorned in, makes the character work. It's a bit of a win-win compromise.

Any thoughts on these or something else I haven't considered?


Unhindering Shield from Armor Master's Handbook allows one to "still gain a buckler's bonus to AC even if [using the] shield hand for some other purpose". That's two feats (requires Shield Focus) on a feat intense playstyle, though.


Tough call.

My first impression is that I think the player is being a touch dramatic about the whole thing, but then again, I have a hard time imagining an archery fighter whose "whole inspiration" was somehow the buckler.

Accepting that, however, I think you're probably being very reasonable to look for an alternative that preserves your rule interpretation, but doesn't entirely nerf his character.

Candidly -- is this player an optimizer? If so, he'll very likely be turning the archery fighter into a massive damage dealing threat by mid-levels, and imposing an extra feat might actually help introduce a little balance (particularly if his optimiuzation level exceeds the party average).

That could either be the 3.5 feat you mentioned, or perhaps the Shield Focus > Unhindering Shield feats that Derklord mentioned. I mean, if the buckler truly is the whole inspiration for the character, it seems fitting that he'd want to take Shield Focus and other shield-related feats.


I really appreciate the replies, thanks.

Yes, I think that the buckler being the inspiring buckler is odd, but he's been really consistent claiming that from the beginning. He's a weird dude and, yeah, an optimizer.

I'll pitch the two feats. He may already have Shield Focus, which should make it appealing.


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If he's a heavy optimizer, I expect he may push back, as it will throw off his whole planned feat progression, but from my perspective, I think you're being reasonable in enforcing your interpretation of the rules.

Also, given you are only 5 sessions in, you could also allow him a one time free/instant retraining to fix things up. Seems like a reasonable compromise to clear up the confusion about the way things work.

Best of luck, and happy gaming!


There are some new people playing, so a retraining was already in the works. Thanks, Steel. I'll offer that compromise or he can introduce a new character. Happy games to you as well.


If it were me, I'd enforce the rules without apology or regret. If someone doesn't like the rules, they can send a complaint to paizo.com (Attn: development team).

Optimizer + inspiration is buckler + archer = highly dubious and likely extreme stinky cheese. IMO, the player is just trying to get one over and came to the game prepared (the inspiration was always the buckler, seriously?!?). I've played with people like this before. Expect a full meltdown if you enforce RAW or pick an option that costs the player feats to keep the buckler's bonus. Sadly, you may have to watch the player like a hawk and regularly audit their character sheet. Sucks, I know.

The notion of "didn't catch it" and/or "I'm the DM, so I win" is a slippery slope that leads to rampant cheating, PC vs GM, and PC vs PC behavior. Been there, done that. I recommend avoiding it.

However, I would recommend that when you discover situations like this, you allow the player to make an adjustment without penalty. In this case, I'd let the player sell the buckler for full value (as if they never purchased it).

Good luck.

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