Arcane Anthology's Sword Binder: Any Good?


Advice

Radiant Oath

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I'm looking to make me an Eldritch Knight by combining wizard with the Trapper Ranger to qualify for the prestige class. I was looking at the new Sword Binder archetype in Arcane Anthology and thought it might be quite flavorful for the character (Sword Binders follow a tradition Aroden laid down, and the character has a deep interest in Azlanti history and magic).

The question is, is it any good? I know that strictly speaking picking a school is technically a stronger choice then being a Universalist, which is what Sword Binder seems to lock the character into, but other than that, it looks like it only costs a feat, and that doesn't seem so bad, though I'll likely miss out on the 10th level benefit if I plan on taking all 10 levels of Eldritch Knight when the time comes.

So...will being a Sword Binder hamper me much? It seems that it doesn't affect the core of the wizard class so much, which has always been the spells.


You give up bonus spells and school powers for an ability to do touch spells at range. Unless you want and plan to do that a lot I wouldn't make the trade.


As both of you have pointed out, it's not the most powerful option, but I think it's fine for an Eldritch Knight. As you say it is very flavorful, and I think flavor can be worth some loss in optimization.

You can kind of make up for the feat loss if you choose an Exotic Weapon for your sword. The archetype doesn't specify what qualifies as a sword, but here are some possibilities.

  • The following are definitely swords because they are identified as such in the wording of their descriptions: butterfly sword, cutlass, double chicken saber, double walking stick katana, estoc, falchion, gladius, greatsword, katana, longsword, pata, rhoka sword, scimitar, seven-branched sword, shortsword, shotel.

  • There is also a group of weapons that are not specifically called out as swords in their descriptions, but which have "sword" in their names: bastard sword, nine-ring broadsword, sword cane, temple sword, tri-point double-edged sword, two-bladed sword. Some, like the bastard sword, are clearly swords, but I'm not sure about others like the tri-point double-edged sword.

  • There is a third group that I think would be considered swords in the real world, but aren't labelled as such in game: elven curve blade, falcata, rapier, sawtooth sabre, urumi.

There are some really nice options like the estoc, katana, or even the bastard sword.

Radiant Oath

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Oh, I'm going for greatsword with this one. That's why I'm not just making the character a magus, as that class depends on using one-handed weapons. As far as power goes, my understanding is the wizard is so powerful just from its basics alone, that losing things like arcane school and its extra spells doesn't prevent it from doing its job well, just from being THE VERY BEST LIKE NO ONE EVER WAS...and I'm always willing to do that for a flavorful character.


Archpaladin Zousha wrote:
Oh, I'm going for greatsword with this one. That's why I'm not just making the character a magus, as that class depends on using one-handed weapons. As far as power goes, my understanding is the wizard is so powerful just from its basics alone, that losing things like arcane school and its extra spells doesn't prevent it from doing its job well, just from being THE VERY BEST LIKE NO ONE EVER WAS...and I'm always willing to do that for a flavorful character.

One thing worth pointing out is that all of the sword binders skills scale on level. So if you are multiclassing and prestige clasting, you'll largely be trading away for powers that won't go very far. I'm not saying don't do it, you might just want to weigh what you're actually getting based on how many wizard levels you are picking up.


Maybe it will work better if your GM allow you to cast Named Bullet on your sword?


So you know all those touch range spells you wish you could reliabily get off with Wizard? Well, this is how you do that. Get your fattest touch range damage spell and toss your sword at your enemy. You have Int to Hit, and you have lots of Int. You are good. This also lets you deliver touch spells to your allies and touch range save based spells from safety and reliably.

As Gisher pointed out, this is great with Eldritch Knight but I think it is also really good for Arcane Trickster.

Not sure how useful the 8th and 10th feature is given your BAB problems but just the 5th feature is fantastic.


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Garbage-Tier Waifu wrote:

So you know all those touch range spells you wish you could reliabily get off with Wizard? Well, this is how you do that. Get your fattest touch range damage spell and toss your sword at your enemy. You have Int to Hit, and you have lots of Int. You are good. This also lets you deliver touch spells to your allies and touch range save based spells from safety and reliably.

As Gisher pointed out, this is great with Eldritch Knight but I think it is also really good for Arcane Trickster.

Not sure how useful the 8th and 10th feature is given your BAB problems but just the 5th feature is fantastic.

I'm getting a humorous mental picture of a wizard casting Infernal Healing by throwing a Greatsword at his allies.

"It's not what it looks like! I'm trying to help you!"


If you can spare the feat for entry, and one more wizard caster level, you can take levels of Evangelist to up your BAB but still progress as a wizard with the archetype features.


I realize that this thread is about a Eldritch Knight, Wizard Ranger build, but you say the reason your not going Magus is for the restriction on 1h weapons, and the desire to use a Greatsword. A Magus with a 2 lvl dip into Titan Mauler Barbarian is able to 1h a greatsword, with a -2. Add in Throwing Magus Arcana, and eventually Reach Spellstrike for your vanilla magus and your doing the same thing without 3 classes. Magical Knack keeps your spell caster level on par with your HD, and Wayang Spellhunter to keep your shocking grasps high.

All of this meets are your requirements, without so much multi-classing, and this is without a Magus Archetype, so if your feeling it, you could still add a archetype there as well.


*raise dead*

One more questions on the topic!

Quote:
At 5th level, whenever the sword binder casts a spell with a range of touch from the wizard spell list, he can use his bonded sword to deliver the touch attack, including expending a daily use of hand of the apprentice to make the touch attack at range. This occurs as part of the same action as casting the spell. He gains all the attack bonuses that apply to his sword (including enhancement bonuses and relevant feats), but does not add his sword’s damage or effects to the touch spell.

The text does not say directly what kind of modifier should I use for my attack. On the one hand, the text mentions to use the Hand of the Apprentice to count the number of times per day for this ability. On the other - there is no saying that it works "exactly as the Hand of the Apprentice". It just says "touch attack at range". So the question is what ability should I use for this attack? Intelligence or str/dex?


Normally you wouldn't be able to deliver a touch attack at range with a sword. The Hand of the Apprentice ability enables it, and that uses Int. The 8th level upgrade uses a non-touch attack and specifies that it does the damage of HotA (i.e. +Int) plus the touch spell.

IMO it uses Int to attack like the HotA ability that it uses.

I think that using Reach Spell would be a lesser cost than losing both arcane bond and arcane school if you're only going to take 5 levels for eldritch knight. Your Mileage May Vary.

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