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Trying to build a summoning cleric and was considering the Sacred Summon feat.
Sarenrae is NG, my cleric is NG, my aura is therefore in the middle on the Chaos/Law axis and Good on the Good/Evil axis.
Sacred summon states: "When using summon monster to summon creatures whose alignment subtype or subtypes exactly match your aura, you may cast the spell as a standard action instead of with a casting time of 1 round."
Alignments subtypes exactly matching my aura says the feat... when looking at the summon monster list we have monsters with the following alignment subtypes [Good][Evil][Chaotic][Lawful].
Can a NG cleric cast as a standard action creatures having only the [Good] subtype using Sacred Summons?
As a NG cleric you do not qualify for Summon Neutral Monster as you are not considered neutral... you're therefore only considered good and able to cast [Good]-only subtypes summons as a standard... right?
You have a Good Aura, that's what you need.
Aura (Ex): A cleric of a chaotic, evil, good, or lawful deity has a particularly powerful aura corresponding to the deity’s alignment (see the detect evil spell for details).
There is no neutral aura. If you are a cleric of sarenrae you simply have a good aura.
Aura (Ex): A cleric of a chaotic, evil, good, or lawful deity has a particularly powerful aura corresponding to the deity’s alignment (see the detect evil spell for details).Sarenrae is Neutral Good. If you worship her your aura is Neutral Good.
Limbo is correct: there is no Neutral aura; hence, there is no 'detect neutral' spell (see Inquisitors, etc.). (Related to this are special weapon and spell properties (anarchic/axiomatic/holy/unholy)).
If you worship a CG deity, for instance, you will possess BOTH Chaotic and Good auras.
As Sacred Summons specifies that the "alignment subtype or subtypes exactly match your aura", you can only use this feat with creatures that ONLY possess the 'good' alignment subtype, i.e. creatues with both 'good' and 'chaotic' do not 'exactly match your aura', and therefore are not eligible.
Sacred Summons is a feat that is meant to be useful to any character of any alignment with the Aura class feature. Since certain alignments have fewer useful summons (NG, for example), Summon Good Monster presents an alternative Feat for Good-aligned characters, and removes the Aura class ability prerequisite. It augments the list available, but does not decrease casting time.
Summon monster is a very feat-intensive path. Without Augment Summoning, your critters are far below effective. You can't really precast due to short durations, and considering the three round combat, a one round casting time is far too long. With Sacred Summons, Summon Good Monster and Superior Summoning, however, you can contribute well. A tip is making your character human, you really need those feats. As an Evil character, of course, things are far easier, not least considering Std action casting with Summon Evil Monster.
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The idea I had was to build a Herald Caller, Sarenrae as a NG God would give me access to all those "Neutral" summons (i.e. animals) while being able to cast (as a full round action) good summons like the lantern archon.
Correct me if I'm wrong here, text for the herald caller states the following: "A herald caller can use summon monster spells only to summon creatures particularly appropriate to her deity. This includes all creatures listed as summon monster options for priests of her deity (see Expanded Summoning for Priests on page 30), creatures whose alignment matches at least one aspect of her deity’s alignment, and creatures of an elemental subtype that matches a domain granted by the deity (if any)."
I was considering the idea of taking Sacred Summons, but as a NG Deity in PFS the list is poor to say the least, which leaves me no choice but to take Summon Good Monsters as well, process is feat intensive, but by level 9 you're summoning 2 poucing beasts Foo Lions as a standard action while giving them heroism as a swift action (with the heroism domain that I intended to take)
TL;DR: Cleric of Sarenrae has a [Good] aura thanks to the class feature, and can Sacred Summons outsiders with the [Good] subtype, but not ([Lawful], [Good]) or ([Chaotic], [Good]).
TL;DR: Cleric of Sarenrae has a [Good] aura thanks to the class feature, and can Sacred Summons outsiders with the [Good] subtype, but not ([Lawful], [Good]) or ([Chaotic], [Good]).
I read the feat as being able to summon creatures with an aura type that matches... so any Good Monster. What you can't summon is anything that does have an opposition aura, so a Lawful Good cleric can summon Lawful Good and Neutral Good beings but not Chaotic Good.
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TL;DR: Cleric of Sarenrae has a [Good] aura thanks to the class feature, and can Sacred Summons outsiders with the [Good] subtype, but not ([Lawful], [Good]) or ([Chaotic], [Good]).I read the feat as being able to summon creatures with an aura type that matches... so any Good Monster. What you can't summon is anything that does have an opposition aura, so a Lawful Good cleric can summon Lawful Good and Neutral Good beings but not Chaotic Good.
You need to read closer:
The minions of your divine patrons stand ready to answer your call.
Prerequisites: Aura class feature, ability to cast summon monster.
Benefit: When using summon monster to summon creatures whose alignment subtype or subtypes exactly match your aura, you may cast the spell as a standard action instead of with a casting time of 1 round.
Exactly matching requires it to be precisely the same. The creature can't have any subtypes not in your aura (like when a Sarenite cleric summons a [good][lawful] hound archon) or less (earth elemental).
The cleric can still summon those creatures, but Sacred Summons won't apply to that casting.
Unfortunately the feat states the summoned creature must match the exact aura of the person summoning it. That leaves creatures with good only.
And of course, it is a good thing to study the aligned spells ability of the deity in question. IIRC, you can only cast spells that are not a) opposed to your alignment, AND not b) opposed to your deity alignment. Meaning, a CG cleric of Sarenrae would have a NG aura, and be unable to cast Lawful spells, letting them summon NG (std action with Sacred Summons), CG, N, and CN... But CN contains no monsters.
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The idea I had was to build a Herald Caller, Sarenrae as a NG God would give me access to all those "Neutral" summons (i.e. animals) while being able to cast (as a full round action) good summons like the lantern archon.Unless there is something special about the Herald Caller celestial animals do not gain an alignment subtype and are never eligible to use with Sacred Summons. Really the list of options to use with Sacred Summons is pretty short.
The animals don't gain an alignment subtype so you can't accelerate the summoning. But any herald caller can summon animals, because:
When you use a summoning spell to summon a creature with an alignment or elemental subtype, it is a spell of that type. Creatures on Table 10–1 marked with an “*” are summoned with the celestial template, if you are good, and the fiendish template, if you are evil. If you are neutral, you may choose which template to apply to the creature. Creatures marked with an “*” always have an alignment that matches yours, regardless of their usual alignment. Summoning these creatures makes the summoning spell's type match your alignment.
For the records, the * is used for the celestial/fiendish animals.
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The idea I had was to build a Herald Caller, Sarenrae as a NG God would give me access to all those "Neutral" summons (i.e. animals) while being able to cast (as a full round action) good summons like the lantern archon.Unless there is something special about the Herald Caller celestial animals do not gain an alignment subtype and are never eligible to use with Sacred Summons. Really the list of options to use with Sacred Summons is pretty short.
Yeap, basically I have to choose between Lantern Archon and Hound Archon with a LG deity and Foo Dog/Lion with a NG deity... (using the Summon Good Monster list)
True.
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For the record, it's the SPELL that gets the alignment descriptor when summoning a celestial/fiendish creature. The summoned creature does not.The idea I had was to build a Herald Caller, Sarenrae as a NG God would give me access to all those "Neutral" summons (i.e. animals) while being able to cast (as a full round action) good summons like the lantern archon.Unless there is something special about the Herald Caller celestial animals do not gain an alignment subtype and are never eligible to use with Sacred Summons. Really the list of options to use with Sacred Summons is pretty short.The animals don't gain an alignment subtype so you can't accelerate the summoning. But any herald caller can summon animals, because:
When you use a summoning spell to summon a creature with an alignment or elemental subtype, it is a spell of that type. Creatures on Table 10–1 marked with an “*” are summoned with the celestial template, if you are good, and the fiendish template, if you are evil. If you are neutral, you may choose which template to apply to the creature. Creatures marked with an “*” always have an alignment that matches yours, regardless of their usual alignment. Summoning these creatures makes the summoning spell's type match your alignment.For the records, the * is used for the celestial/fiendish animals.
A bit of a thread res but need to check this.
It says
"Creatures marked with an “*” always have an alignment that matches yours, regardless of their usual alignment."
then
"Summoning these creatures makes the summoning spell’s type match your alignment."
Two separate statements and I took both to be true.
The poster here seems to claim that this sentence is not part of the rules?
"Creatures marked with an “*” always have an alignment that matches yours, regardless of their usual alignment."
Is that right?
I doubt Sarenrae condones (thread) necromancy, but maybe it's a case of better (7 years) late than never?
That's a fitting trait, ngl.
Since the thread has been raised, I might as well add to it.
Empyreal Pantheon would still not allow Sacred Summon to decrease the time needed to summon a LG, or CG creature. A NG cleric of Sarenrae can already use summon monster to summon a LG or CG creature. It would allow the CG worshiper of Sarenrae to summon a LG creature. The feat only works when your aura exactly matches that of the summoned creature. The trait does not alter either your aura or the subtype of the summoned creature.
As to the original argument a character can have a multi alignment aura, and a creature can have more than one alignment subtype. An Archon has booth a Lawful, and Good subtype. A cleric of a lawful good deity has both a lawful and good aura. Sacred summons states “creatures whose alignment subtype or subtypes exactly match your aura. So, when he summons an Archon, he does not gain the benefit of the decreased casting time. The cleric of Sarenrae has a good aura but lacks the lawful portion. Good does not exactly match lawful and good.
A good feat to mix this with is summon guardian spirit. The cassisian’s breath weapon scales nicely with that one and gives your cleric a decent standard action summon that lasts minutes per level.
The herald caller gets enough bonus feats that taking both sacred summons and summon guardian spirit are pretty easy to fit in your build.