Lass |
So I've just finished up the second book in the series and am considering tossing the epic AD&D 1E module Steading of the Hill Giant Chief into the campaign. It seems like a perfect fit somewhere in the 3rd book of the series but my question is, what is a good average party level in a Pathfinder Conversion to use this with my players?
Also how would you handle...
the room with Cheif Nosnra and Wife, the Sub-Chief, Cloud Giant, 3 stone giants, 22 hill giants, 8 ogres and 1 cave bear?
Tangaroa |
Well, if you could provide the number of players in your party, but lets assume 4 and you slot it in when they are level 8 minimum (9 might be better)
CR 8 4800 XP
CR 9 6400 XP
CR 10 9600 XP
CR 11 12800 XP
CR 12 19200 XP
CR 13 25600 Xp
And recall the scaling rule of thumbs:
1 Creature CR
2 Creatures CR +2
3 Creatures CR +3
4 Creatures CR +4
6 Creatures CR +5
8 Creatures CR +6
12 Creatures CR +7
16 Creatures CR +8
Cloud Giant CR 11, 12800
Stone Giant CR 8 4800 - with 3, CR 11 for 12800
Hill Giant CR 7 3200 - with 22, CR ~15.5 70400
Dire Bear CR 7 3200
Ogre CR 3 800 - with 8 6400
Wife & Sub Chief, say CR 8 - with 2, CR 10 for 9600
Chief Nosnra is called out as "fighting as a Frost Giant", so CR9 - 9600
This makes it (does math) about midway between a CR 17 and CR 18; unwinnable in a head on. So the challenge is to allow the PCs to divide them up into bite-sized (CR 10-CR 12) chunks. I think this was the spirit of the original adventure - a head on confrontation is suicidal, so hit and run tactics combine with a clever strategy is needed.
Tangaroa |
Just for fun, a build for the Chief.
XP 6400
Male Hill Giant barbarian 2
CE Large humanoid (giant)
Init -2, Senses Perception +14
=================================================
DEFENSE
=================================================
AC 19, touch 5, flat-footed 19 (+5 armor, -2 Dex, +9 natural, -2 rage, -1 size )
hp 154 (10d8+2d12+96)
Fort +19, Ref +2, Will +7; +2 vs. spells and spell-like and supernatural abilities
Defensive Abilities rock catching, uncanny dodge
=================================================
OFFENSE
=================================================
Speed 35 ft.
Melee +1 greatclub +20/+15 (2d8+16) or slam +18/+18 (1d8+10)
Ranged mwk. heavy crossbow +7 (2d8/19-20) or rock +7 (1d8+15)
Space 10 ft. Reach 10 ft.
Special Attacks rage (20 rounds/day), rage powers (intimidating glare, superstition +2), rock throwing (120 ft.)
=================================================
TACTICS
=================================================
During Combat Chief Nonsra, although quite brilliant for a hill giant, is a giant of action. Unless clearly outmatched, he will charge into the fray to smash puny humans, half-orcs and dwarves.
Base Statistics When not raging, Chief Nonsra has AC19, touch 7, flat-footed 19; hp 130; Fort +17, Will +5; Melee +1 greatclub +18/+13 (2d8+13) or slam +16/+16 (1d8+8); Ranged mwk. heavy crossbow +7 (2d8/19-20) or rock +7 (1d8+12); CMB +18; Skills Climb +12, Intimidate +21
=================================================
STATISTICS
=================================================
Str 31, Dex 6, Con 27, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 7
Base Atk +9; CMB +20; CMD 26
Feats Cleave, Extra Rage, Intimidating Prowess, Power Attack, Weapon Focus (greatclub)
Skills Climb +14, Handle Animal +5, Intimidate +23, Linguistics +1, Perception +14
Languages Common, Giant
SQ fast movement
Combat Gear potion of protection from good, acid (3), alchemist's fire (2)
Other Gear hide +1, +1 greatclub, masterwork heavy crossbow with 10 bolts, cloak of resistance +1, helm of fearsome mien, backpack, rock, 36.0 gp
=================================================
SPECIAL ABILITIES
=================================================
Fast Movement (Ex) Your land speed is faster than the norm for your race by +10 feet. This benefit applies only when you are wearing no armor, light armor, or medium armor, and not carrying a heavy load.
Rage You can call upon inner reserves of strength and ferocity, granting you additional combat prowess. You can rage for 20 rounds per day. You can enter rage as a free action. The total number of rounds of rage per day is renewed after resting for 8 hours, although these hours do not need to be consecutive. While in rage, you gain a +4 morale bonus to your Strength and a +4 morale bonus to Constitution, as well as a +2 morale bonus on Will saves. In addition, you take a -2 penalty to Armor Class. The increase to Constitution grants you 24 hit points, but these disappear when the rage ends and are not lost first like temporary hit points. While in rage, you cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate, and Ride) or any ability that requires patience or concentration. You can end your rage as a free action and are fatigued after rage for a number of rounds equal to 2 times the number of rounds spent in the rage. You cannot enter a new rage while fatigued or exhausted but can otherwise enter rage multiple times during a single encounter or combat. If you fall unconscious, your rage immediately ends, placing you in peril of death.
Rock Catching (Ex) You can catch Small, Medium, or Large rocks (or projectiles of similar shape). Once per round, if you would normally be hit by a rock, you can make a Reflex save to catch it as a free action. The DC is 15 for a Small rock, 20 for a Medium one, and 25 for a Large one. (If the projectile provides a magical bonus on attack rolls, the DC increases by that amount.) You must be aware of the attack in order to make a rock catching attempt.
Rock Throwing (Ex) You are an accomplished rock thrower and have a +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown rocks. A creature can hurl rocks up to two categories smaller than its size. A "rock" is any large, bulky, and relatively regularly shaped object made of any material with a hardness of at least 5. The creature can hurl the rock up to five range increments. Damage from a thrown rock is generally twice your base slam damage plus 1-1/2 your Strength bonus.
Superstition (Ex) You gain a +2 morale bonus on saving throws made to resist spells, supernatural abilities, and spell-like abilities. While raging, you cannot be a willing target of any spell and must make saving throws to resist all spells, even those cast by allies.
Uncanny Dodge (Ex) You can react to danger before your senses would normally allow you to do so. You cannot be caught flat-footed, nor do you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if the attacker is invisible. You still lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. You can still lose your Dexterity bonus to AC if an opponent successfully uses the feint action against you.
bk007dragon |
So I've just finished up the second book in the series and am considering tossing the epic AD&D 1E module Steading of the Hill Giant Chief into the campaign. It seems like a perfect fit somewhere in the 3rd book of the series but my question is, what is a good average party level in a Pathfinder Conversion to use this with my players?
Also how would you handle... ** spoiler omitted **
I know this is late but ... You need to keep a few things in mind when playing 1st edition modules.
1)In first edition they expected a party to be objective focused. Some encounters were not meant to be fought. They expected a party to know to bypass encounters like that or if necessary run away and fight again another day. This is something many modern groups tend to lack.
Bypassing encounters you did not need to fight conserved resources and in first edition the game was all about resource management. This is part of what it is to be Old School Gaming.
2)The adventures at that time were written for a 6 - 9 person party when it was first written for the RPGA. Or about 2 x the size of a modern pathfinder party.
3)Giants were weaker in first edition AD&D than in pathfinder.
4)In the original story you did not need to fight that fight to find clues pointing you to the glacial rift of the frost giant jarl. They expected you to bypass that room.
5)They also have a Hammer of Thunderbolts hidden behind a shield in the steading. It can 1 shot kill a giant in 1st edition.
If you want to actually fight it, they should wait till the giants pass out and are to drunk to stay awake. Take that time to search the rest of the steading and eliminate any available reinforcements. Get any loot you can to help in that fight.
Lass |
As an update, we had some interesting games using this module with heavy modifications.
-They engaged in a few hit and run attacks lowering their numbers here and there.
-The freed and gained allies with many of the orcs who helped with info and sabotage.
-They managed to poison a great number of the Giants.
-I used a bit of foreshadowing of the Cloud Giant politics in book 6 to position the Cloud Giant in that room as a potential ally.
The final fight was certainly close but all together fun.
My only regret is that now that we are entering book 4 its going to be more sabotage which I am fearful will feel samey to my players.