Skinsaw Murders setup, alternative target for Aldern.


Rise of the Runelords


So my current group is pretty much all male characters, and I'm really not a huge fan of the suggestions for changing Aldern's obsession for a PC from lust and jealousy to like, envy of strength and stuff. I may be alone here, but I think the mod works best when it's playing up the creepy aspect of some stalker's obsession with a female character.

So, not having anyone in my current group to focus on, it was suggested to me to use Ameiko, which I certainly don't mind because I actually have two players who are basically fighting for her attention, so she'll likely end up getting a lot of screen time.

The problem is, we're kinda late into Book 1. Specifically, they just defeated Erylium, so by this point Aldern has come and gone from town (it's never actually mentioned when he leaves, so I usually just make him slip out unnoticed after the boar hunt).

So I'm looking for some input here, what do you guys think I can do to play up this obsession, keeping in mind a lot of it will have already happened? I'm thinking of having her, now that the PCs are closer to her, come out with stories about Aldern's unwanted attention and stuff, so I'm looking for some interesting ways to play it out over the coming story. Maybe some letters delivered to her, or presents scoured from his house or something?


Maybe she could mention that some personal item from her room is now missing?


I also had an all male party when I ran this, and instead I chose Aldern to lust over one of the male PC's anyway.

But using Ameiko would be great too, I mean maybe she shys away from touch from people, so if one of your characters seems to for-coming she pushes away. And then have her explain in so many words "I have a crazy ex boyfriend".


Cassius Blackmore wrote:
I also had an all male party when I ran this, and instead I chose Aldern to lust over one of the male PC's anyway.

While I have nothing against it, it's just not the effect I want to achieve with this group. Last time I ran it, it was simple, because I had 2 females (a Ranger who hated him, and a Calistrian Oracle who tried to tempt him. He chose the Ranger), and it got the creepy vibe across well enough. Doing the same setup for an all-male group, especially this one, I know it won't really accomplish what I want it to.

Quote:


But using Ameiko would be great too, I mean maybe she shys away from touch from people, so if one of your characters seems to for-coming she pushes away. And then have her explain in so many words "I have a crazy ex boyfriend".

I don't want to go with the boyfriend thing, it's too easy, I think.

My current thinking is this: The PCs emerge from the Catacombs and get to meet Ameiko (for the first time since they rescued her from the Glassworks), and have their fun. Somewhere between Ameiko pointing the Fighter to the mini-monastery to learn foreign fighting styles, and them quibbling over who gets to talk to her, I'll have her ask if they have seen Aldern recently, so she can make sure he's gone. She had basically kicked him out of the tavern because while they were off protecting the town, he had been getting a bit too creepy for her, dogging her footsteps around the bar and town and not leaving her alone. She knows he took being thrown out pretty hard (I want to play up the concept of Aldern really finding Ameiko to be like, the only woman as beautiful to him as his late wife), and quietly left town without telling anyone. This all happened before the Glassworks. Everything was fine, and she never mentioned it because it's sort of a regular thing for her, but recently she got letters that could only be from him, and that's why she wants the PCs to know what happened.

Now here's the important part: I really need to make sure that no matter what, the PCs don't decide to hunt him down between Book 1 and Book 2. We all know that them checking his house in Magnimar or his family manor before they should is the easiest way to bring the entire narrative crashing in on itself, so if they do head that way, I'll need to rope them back in with the murders.

I'll have to flesh out details, but that's my off-the-cuff idea for this situation.


Askren wrote:
Now here's the important part: I really need to make sure that no matter what, the PCs don't decide to hunt him down between Book 1 and Book 2. We all know that them checking his house in Magnimar or his family manor before they should is the easiest way to bring the entire narrative crashing in on itself, so if they do head that way, I'll need to rope them back in with the murders.

You'll want to make him seem a bit off right now, but not dangerous. Not yet. Definitely a bit creepy. But if you play it off as him just being a bit strange since his wife died, you'll make it sound like you're setting him up to do something crazy to try to bring his dead wife back.

Alternatively, set him up as an obvious red herring. Aldern was too forward, maybe even a bit grabby or something. She kicked him out. A few days later, she noticed that someone was following her and whatnot, but never got a look at who it was. At the same time, from a different source, mention that Tsuto(or his body) has escaped(gone missing). Make it sound ominous, but don't give them anything more than that.

If done right, they should dismiss Aldern for now, figuring he's just a red herring. They should spend the between books 1/2 looking for Tsuto, who is conveniently hard to find. And later, when the letters start appearing, let each of them contain a single symbol from the Minkaian script. Symbols for words like "Love", "Eternity", "Family" and such.

Then, when the time is right, they find Tsuto's body. With another note attached. "Now, no one will stand between us, my love." or something like that. And the Minkaian symbol on that one? Regardless of what it means, someone remembers..."Wait. Didn't Aldern Foxglove have that symbol tattooed on his arm?"


Askren wrote:


While I have nothing against it, it's just not the effect I want to achieve with this group. Last time I ran it, it was simple, because I had 2 females (a Ranger who hated him, and a Calistrian Oracle who tried to tempt him. He chose the Ranger), and it got the creepy vibe across well enough. Doing the same setup for an all-male group, especially this one, I know it won't really accomplish what I want it to.

I suppose it depends on the players, but in my group I had the party alchemist (and his player) pretty creeped out by Aldern's jealousy obsession with him.


I'll confess I did not like the Aldern obsession angle. I didn't think I could make it convincing or entertaining. My group was all male - both player and character. I also didn't like the stealing of so-called trash or trivial items from a pc - if I had presented even a hint of it while it was going on my players would have relentlessly pursued it and providing no clue about it would have come across as contrived when revealed.

So I changed his obsession to a hatred of Sandpoint and its citizens - his notes were addressed to various people who refused to help him rebuild his house or failed to force others to provide such help. He addressed notes to the Mayor and to the head of the Carpenter's Guild, etc. (This also solved another problem I had with the AP structure - what kind of dunderhead does Hemlock have to ask the pc's to lead the investigation when the first piece of evidence he gives them explicitly names them as suspects?)

I made this decision very early on and did not have to play Aldern as anything more than a somewhat hapless noble during the goblin raid and subsequent boar hunt. I also had Madame Mvashti invite the group (which included a Varisian cleric of Saranrae) to visit her home so she could check them out and let them know that Aldern's wife had been missing for some time. By then Aldern had left town and other events from Book 1 would consume their attention but it planted a seed. It seemed to me that within the Varisian community Iesha's fate would have higher visibility than among the general populace.

By the way the secret to keeping them from looking Aldern up in Magnimar between Book 1 and Book 2 is to not give them a reason to go to Magnimar in the first place. And they don't really need to know anything about the Manor until they're into Book 2. If you intend to use Ameiko as his obsession target, I would also suggest she not mention his strange behavior or notes until after you get them started on Book 2. Keep in mind that unless you are filling your game sessions with a lot of "role-playing chaff" your players have to assume something you tell them either directly or via NPC is important. So if their new friend, who gives them free rent is being stalked by the weirdo they met a few days ago, they are going to assume that's a situation they are supposed to deal with. "Aldern is sending you harassing notes? Well, we'll go straighten him out right now. Where does he live?"


I agree somewhat with your sentiments, though I don't know if I'm gonna go the route of him sending notes to all of Sandpoint, that's a bit too scattershot for me, because of how many of those they haven't met/interacted with much or at all, and probably won't, and in my mind just having a creepy note come to only the people they have met is a bit too convenient.

But I agree with the point about PC's focusing on details you give them, I've always told people that if the players walk into a new town and one of the things you mention in the description is a tree they pass by, they're always going to assume that said tree is a crucial plot detail.

I am, in fact, doing things to pad out sessions with the roleplaying "fluff" as my players request, so obviously the details wouldn't be immediate and all at once. Something like, next session (after Catacombs), Ameiko casually asks if they have seen Aldern. They say no and she just moves on to other topics. Then sometime later, like, sometime before or when they get back from Thistletop, she'll start talking about some stuff that has her unnerved. Not in the sense like "Guys s#~@ is going down, please beat up this guy for me", but enough to put them on edge while not dominating their focus.

And I see the only way to keep them from needing to go to Magnimar is to let them sell off all their loot, including the dagger and the giant helmet, in Sandpoint, which I'm not a fan of. Though, of course, this party I have isn't really as friendly or interested in Aldern as my last was, so there's not much risk of them going to visit him when they have free time.


Just for clarification...

Spoiler:
...the notes I referred to were the notes Aldern pins to the corpses of his victims. So instead of blood-soaked notes addressed to a pc, there were notes for the Mayor and Head of the Carpenters Guild (who was connected with one of the pc's by character background), etc. The purpose was to give the pc's a diverse set of clues that had to be puzzled out/fit together. As they discovered the various victims of the Sihedron ritual, they had to determine who would be mad at these different people, which in turn led them to social interactions with various NPC's to try to figure it out.

Regarding the loot and Magnimar, I ignored the purchase limit for Sandpoint to some extent. There's a weekly bazaar in Sandpoint and it's only two days from Magnimar so I let the players conduct sales, etc. via proxy of one of the local merchants in Sandpoint with the only limitation that they have to wait a few days for the product/transaction to complete. Savah may not have a +1 dwarven waraxe for sale but she can get one from Magnimar in 5 or 6 days.

As for the the giant helmet, I had Ameiko buy that from them. It makes a great story piece for the Rusty Dragon and celebrates the local heroes (to whom she owes much gratitude and profits from affiliation with.)


Yeah, I got all that about the notes being on the bodies not directed to the PCs. Which actually made me stop to think, did you like, write specific reasons for Aldern to be mad at said NPCs? Because as-written, I can't actually find a reason for him to have beef with anyone in Sandpoint like, at all. So it seems like it would have to be a complex bit of writing to provide hooks for each murder and NPC named in a note that could lead back to Aldern in a way that doesn't get convoluted.


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Askren wrote:

So my current group is pretty much all male characters, and I'm really not a huge fan of the suggestions for changing Aldern's obsession for a PC from lust and jealousy to like, envy of strength and stuff. I may be alone here, but I think the mod works best when it's playing up the creepy aspect of some stalker's obsession with a female character.

So, not having anyone in my current group to focus on, it was suggested to me to use Ameiko, which I certainly don't mind because I actually have two players who are basically fighting for her attention, so she'll likely end up getting a lot of screen time.

The problem is, we're kinda late into Book 1. Specifically, they just defeated Erylium, so by this point Aldern has come and gone from town (it's never actually mentioned when he leaves, so I usually just make him slip out unnoticed after the boar hunt).

So I'm looking for some input here, what do you guys think I can do to play up this obsession, keeping in mind a lot of it will have already happened? I'm thinking of having her, now that the PCs are closer to her, come out with stories about Aldern's unwanted attention and stuff, so I'm looking for some interesting ways to play it out over the coming story. Maybe some letters delivered to her, or presents scoured from his house or something?

Let me tell you what we did and maybe it'll give you some ideas.

In the early going Shayliss tried to seduce our group Bard - and almost succeeded. After Ven chased him out of the house he decided the drama wasn't worth it, but Shayliss, being the petulant flipskirt she is, tried to make him jealous/win him back/punish him for his rejection by flirting with the visiting pretty boy Aldern in front of him at every opportunity. The result was an eyeroll from the Bard and an infatuation by Aldern, allowing Shayliss to become the target of his obsession later on.

Here's the thing though - the Bard eventually got romantically involved with Ameiko. At the time the whole Shayliss/Aldern thing was a very minor subplot and basically a source of minor amusement for my players. Aldern on the other hand secretly viewed the group's Bard as a rival for Shayliss' affections and wasn't around to witness his romance with Ameiko develop... so, when he left threatening notes for the Bard, he constantly referred to 'her', making insinuations that she would never be his, that his love for her would be eternal, that should he decide to come to the Misgivings to try and reclaim her he would find only his doom, etc.

The PC's of course assumed that Ameiko was the target which really served to throw off their investigations as to the identity of the Skinsaw Man (Aldern had never expressed any interest in her) and it wasn't until very late in the game when they returned from the Ghoul Farm, rushing to see if Ameiko was alright did Hemlock approach them with the note that had been left at the Vinder residence and the news of the disappearance of Shayliss.

It was actually a really cool moment, watching the tumblers click in their minds as they realized not just the real target but the real perpetrator as well. Obviously it required that I write my own notes, with the Bard being the target of 'Wrath' while Shayliss was the target of 'Lust'. Added a nice dimension later at the Misgivings since it was a rescue mission as much as anything else.


Askren wrote:
Yeah, I got all that about the notes being on the bodies not directed to the PCs. Which actually made me stop to think, did you like, write specific reasons for Aldern to be mad at said NPCs? Because as-written, I can't actually find a reason for him to have beef with anyone in Sandpoint like, at all. So it seems like it would have to be a complex bit of writing to provide hooks for each murder and NPC named in a note that could lead back to Aldern in a way that doesn't get convoluted.

Nope.

Spoiler:
I used the handouts as written for the wrath option. I perhaps extrapolated a bit based on what's in the AP. None of the local craftsmen would work at the Manor because they thought it was haunted. I assumed he would go to the head of the Carpenter's guild and ask/demand someone do the work. When Aesrick refused to force anyone - because he can't - Aldern went to Mayor Deverin and asked her to order the work done. She too refused "This isn't Korvosa, we don't compel freemen to do work here. You want the work done, raise your pay to overcome their superstition." Then when he did get craftsmen at his home they seduced his wife (his perception.) All the while the work was driving him bankrupt and further and further into the arms of the Brothers and Xanesha. Even the guards at the gate didn't help him with the goblins. My conclusion - he blamed the people of Sandpoint for abandoning and betraying him. The only people that helped him were the pc's, ergo he avoids them and at the last His Lordship tries in desperation to surrender to them.


The object of Aldern's infatuation died to Nualia's Yeth Hound in my game. Now I have to think of a way to link his murders to the party. They kinda bungled their way through his rescue at the festival, and the one remaining female party member just came across as a bit mentally I'll to Aldern due to some odd roleplay by the player.

I'm not entirely sure where to go with it now, as I didn't have him interact with any NPCs much, and no party member left alive had much of a rapport with him.


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Easy enough. Aldern wants revenge on the PCs for letting the object of his infatuation die...


tonyz wrote:
Easy enough. Aldern wants revenge on the PCs for letting the object of his infatuation die...

That's a great idea! Thanks!

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