Ok, here's my hypothetical situation:
The party is ambushing two hostile NPCs, both mounted. I'm not sure if this is relevant, but the two NPCs do not have a ride skill, and the mounts are both regular horses (not war horses).
They kill the first NPC's horse and capture that NPC. The second NPC retreats, galloping away never to be seen again.
Now, my question is which of those four targets grants the party experience points? Here's what I'm thinking, but please tell me if you disagree.
Obviously, I'd grant xp for the first NPC. I'd also grant xp for the second NPC, since he was a threat that the party defeated. I'd also grant xp for the first NPC's horse, since it did require the party's resources to kill it.
I would not grant xp for the 2nd NPC's horse, since it was never a threat to the party. Yes, it would have provided a challenge to the party if they wanted to catch it's rider, but if they were interested in that, they did not best that challenge.
So, thoughts? There's probably an established line of thinking for similar scenarios that I've never been exposed to. Any education would be appreciated.
I tried searching the forums to find similar topics, but no luck.
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meh, its things like this that helped convince me to ditch XP. When I did use it I made it about the encounter not killing things so my players wouldn't default to pyschos. I would probably just give them the XP for encountering the NPC and not worry about the horse. Other things can factor in as well though. Is this sandbox? What leveling track are you on?
I probably would not have awarded XP for the horses. The horses do not really add much, if any, challenge to the encounter. If, on the other hand, the NPCs were experienced riders, I would still probably only award XP for the NPCs, BUT I would increase their CR given the presence of the horses.
Really about the only reason I can see to add the horses in as extra XP (aside from the above experienced rider example)would be if there was a need to catch/capture the horse(s). If the second NPC for instance was carrying the diplomatic pouch that the party needed to intercept, then the presence of the horse (as the NPC flees) makes the challenge a bit more difficult.
XP is for overcoming challenges. They are not little ephemeral bits of sparkle that fall out of corpses but rather rewards for not being wiped out of existence in an encounter. For calculating the XP of an encounter, take the monsters that will be fighting, any traps, bonuses for environmental effects or objects, and any possible 'extra credit' for dealing with things in a unique way, uncovering interesting facts, etc.
So in your example, it is up to you to determine if the fight was really 4 creatures or 2. Were these trained warhorses or just transportation means with a bit of self defense? Then you decide is capturing the NPC alive worth more XP than killing him (or do you not care/don't want your PCs to think they get more out of kidnapping everything they fight)? Or is the information the guy provides the real bit of info?
In most cases, the 'fight with two NPCs and mounts' would be worth X experience points. Whether or not they kill everything, chase them away, bribe them to leave, lie to them and make them think the PCs are actually three towns over, or whatever... they should get X experience points for handling the encounter. If keeping one alive is good for the plot, give them an extra 5-10% for doing something right.
Treasure, however, should be considered a bit differently. Each rider probably had gear, so one getting away meant a loss of gear. Since gear and level have a relationship, you should provide a means to get a bit more money/gear later to compensate for the loss here. Otherwise a party that tries to overcome activities through nonviolence will be quite undergeared when violence comes up.
Did they encounter the NPCs and their horses? Yes? Then they should get XP for it.
The only time you wouldn't award XP is if there was no encounter at all (such as luckily bypassing a trap the PCs never knew was there).
If no one in the party had the opportunity to at least make an attempt at preventing the second rider from escaping, only then would I consider not giving them XP for him (since they apparently focused on the other rider).
Thanks, all. It doesn't seem like there's much consensus if I only factor in the responses from this thread alone. I can't imagine this topic has never come up before.
I remember seeing some of the encounters laid out in APs where they'd list the xp of any mounts. That seems to jive with Ravingdork's take on this.
What was the goal of the encounter? What did you want to encourage them to do? Most likely, the NPCs were the enemy, and the horses were involuntary participants in the fight and not threats -- and you did not want to encourage them to attack horses when they did not have to. The ideal solution that you would have envisioned would be for the party to kill or capture both NPCs without harming the horses, so that should be the maximum XP situation.
You should feel free to deny XPs for unnecessary fights. I once had an adventure partially derailed when one PC decided to get into a fight with the rest of the party. The party eventually defeated and captured him and then let him rot in jail for a month of game time (which we fast forwarded through). I estimated the XP value for the lone player character and awarded it to the rest of the party -- and I awarded the renegade player character nothing because I did not want to encourage any more such incidents.
As people have said. Screw calculating every horse and goblin to award XP. Use one of the various other systems. It helps avoid people being so focused on just killing stuff for XP.
That's a great option for some games, including some of mine. But it doesn't really help with my specific question.
What was the goal of the encounter?
Well, remember, I'm offering a hypothetical encounter. This isn't a situation that I've experienced recently, but it is a situation that I'd like to get a good handle on before it actually occurs in play.
What did you want to encourage them to do?
Hypothetically, let's say it's a random encounter, but I've ruled that the riders are recognizable as bandits known for terrorizing the area.
The ideal solution that you would have envisioned would be for the party to kill or capture both NPCs without harming the horses, so that should be the maximum XP situation.
So, it sounds like you're saying that xp should be guided by the GM's determination of what the players' goal should be? Is that correct?
