[Necromancer] Minionmancer - Build / Stats


Advice


I'm designing a character based on the theme above.

Already settled on starting with a Cleric (looking to move into Agent of the Grave latter on), but now I'm having some doubts on how best to use my 20 points (the system we'll be using).

Should I focus on CHA from the start? »» 8/8/12/12/15/17
Or start with WIS and be crippled latter on? »» 8/8/12/12/17/15


Just to add that it will be a NE Cleric of Urgathoa.

Anyone that played a Necromancer would like to give some advice?

The race to use is also dependent on what to focus at character creation (Drow for CHA or Human for WIS).


If you're looking to optimize, Aasimar is a very good race for any cleric.

I've found that 14-16 Cha is plenty for this type of character, because you don't really need that many uses of your channel energy, and bloody skeletons (which is what you want to be making) won't resist it that much anyways.

You're really going to want a back up plan to having minions. It's not that feat-intensive of a path, so you can make a competent archer if you have the bow proficiency from another source. Or you could go with a STR backup plan and wade in with a scythe. In that case I'd prioritize STR > CON > WIS > CHA > DEX > INT. Or in other words, for an aasimar with a 20 pt buy :

STR 16 CON 14 WIS 16 DEX 10 CHA 14 INT 8

For a Dex build I might go Human and use an extra feat on MWP : longbow and go

STR 10 DEX 16 CON 12 WIS 16 CHA 14 INT 8


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Also, I'd like to direct your attention Here for a lot of good tips I used when I made my minionmancer. He's only level 4 at the moment and without an undead retinue thus far, but there are definitely two dead owlbears that will soon be joining the group..


Thanks for the tip about Aasimar I'm taking a closer look at that race and also added Dhampir to the list.

Had already looked at that guide as well as Tark's.

I wasn't really thinking on losing focus with my cleric and looking at other options besides casting/minions makes the class more MAD then it needs to be imho.

Regarding CHA notice that taking the AotG prestige class that would be my new ability for bonus HPs. Also nice synergy with a Dhampir for negative channeling.

My character path would be Cleric (1-5), Agent of the Grave (6-10), by this point I'll either go for Lich or Vampire template.

Taking the above into account my question still is:
a) Focus as caster (WIS): buffs, debuffs
b) Negative Channeling focus (CHA): Command Undead (feat), Negative Energy blasts (1d6 every other lvl + 2d6 with headband it's nothing to sneer at).

And race: Human, Drow, Dhampir or Aasimar?


It's not really that MAD. And there will definitely be times you're bored of just pointing at things going "maul that for me". Like I said before, this type of character really doesn't NEED a lot of CHA. Even the two Agent of the Grave CHA based abilities don't really justify pumping the crazy into your CHA score. The only two ways that score should be (optimized in my opinion at least) over 14 are if you're an Oracle, or if you're full on channeling focused (which isn't terrible even if it's not OPTIMAL per se).

I think the "better" path for a necromancer is focusing on buffs, and debuffs perhaps as well. Just remember that if you're dumping your physical stats landing the melee touch attacks required for some debuffs might be significantly more difficult. Also, this could expose a weak CON score if you wind up bad touching into a melee.

If you want to focus on Negative Channeling, that's definitely a thing as well.

As for races, I can see all of them being flavorful and interesting for this kind of character. Humans can be motivated by well, anything, a Dhampir could be yearning to be just like his or her vampiric sire, and playing an Aasimar anti-hero is always interesting.

Also, if you go with the channeling focus, Aasimar get access to the Channel Force line of feats which let you pull or push anything affected by your damaging channels. Something to think on at least.


I'd recommend you not focus on negative energy channeling. It might seem ok early on, but it doesn't scale well. Mid to high levels the dmg / healing output is very underwhelming and you'll regret the feats you spent. ymmv, of course.

Using your channels to "command undead" and to heal up your undead in between battles will be your best use for them. The good news is doing so frees up some feats to use for other purposes.

Because you'll need a decent CHA (14ish), you probably won't be able to have a high wis, too. That's what makes the cleric a bit challenging as a necromancer.

By the way, both the oracle (bones or juju) and the witch (gravewalker arch. or plague patron) offer you a class that is single attribute dependent for both "commanding undead" and casting spells. I'd say both of those classes have better optimization potential for a necromancer, but optimization isn't everything so make sure you go with the choice that you will enjoy playing the most.

Xykal


Xykal wrote:

I'd recommend you not focus on negative energy channeling. It might seem ok early on, but it doesn't scale well. Mid to high levels the dmg / healing output is very underwhelming and you'll regret the feats you spent. ymmv, of course.

Using your channels to "command undead" and to heal up your undead in between battles will be your best use for them. The good news is doing so frees up some feats to use for other purposes.

Because you'll need a decent CHA (14ish), you probably won't be able to have a high wis, too. That's what makes the cleric a bit challenging as a necromancer.

By the way, both the oracle (bones or juju) and the witch (gravewalker arch. or plague patron) offer you a class that is single attribute dependent for both "commanding undead" and casting spells. I'd say both of those classes have better optimization potential for a necromancer, but optimization isn't everything so make sure you go with the choice that you will enjoy playing the most.

Xykal

You can still have a decent WIS with a good CHA (along with other good scores) if you play an aasimar. And a 20 pt buy makes all kinds of things viable. My Aasimar for instance started with STR 11 DEX 14 CON 12

WIS 16 INT 12 CHA 16. If I could have it back though I'd go down to 14 CHA and up WIS to 17. So I'm pretty well set up for archery as a back up plan without sacrificing my skills for being party face or my caster progression.

Gravewalker witch and Bones Oracle are both very good minionmancers as well. But ultimately I think Cleric is the best, best spell progression with 3/4 BAB, but Oracles are far less MAD. And Witches have more skill points, so it all depends on what you want to play. The OP seemed pretty set on a Cleric though.

Watch out for the Juju Oracle though. It was reprinted in Faiths and Philosophies and there were zero undead related abilities printed in it, a change from a previous printing of that mystery.

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