Which feats work with the Halfling Sling Staff?

[Rory]

Krodjin wrote:

Except even the Warslinger trait doesn't remove the AoO for reloading - and I'm not aware of any feats that would do so for a Sling. So, while you can eventually lose the AoO for firing the sling (Point blank master) you'll always eat one for re-loading.

Point Blank Master is a corner case of the straight fighter (the ranged ranger will be picking Manyshot over Point Blank Master). Manyshot is the far bigger feat in the bow's favor.

However, the optimized halfling slinger is still decently competitive.

[Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti]

A slinger Halfling ranger? That is something I had never thought of.

[Rory]

Halfling the Ranger Slinger

S: 14 D: 17 C: 14 I: 10 W: 10 Ch: 10 (20 pt halfling)

Ranger Archetype:
- Guide/Skirmisher

Traits:
- Armor Expert (1 less ACP)
- Reactionary (+2 Init)

Racial Traits:
- Warslinger (free action load sling)

Feats:
Point Blank Shot(1st)
Rapid Shot (ranger 2)
Deadly Aim (3rd)
Weapon Focus Sling (5th)
Precise Strike (ranger 6)
Sling Flail (7th)

Level 1

- Ranger's Bond: +2/+2 against 1 foe (1/day)

+6 to hit at range w/ sling = +1 BAB + 3 DEX + 1 Size + 1 Point Blank Shot
+4 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +1 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size

sling: 1d3 + 3 (+2 STR + 1 PBS)
long sword: 1d6 + 2 (+2 STR)

Level 2

- Ranger's Bond: +2/+2 against 1 foe (1/day)
- Items: MW Sling

+6/+6 to hit at range w/ sling = +2 BAB + 3 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 Rapid Shot + 1 weapon
+5 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +2 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size

sling: 1d3 + 3 (+2 STR + 1 PBS)
long sword: 1d6 + 3 (+2 STR)

Level 3

- Ranger's Bond: +2/+2 against 1 foe (1/day)
- Items: Sling +1, MW Long Sword

+6/+6 to hit at range w/ sling = +3 BAB + 3 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 weapon - 1 Deadly Aim
+7 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +3 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size + 1 weapon

sling: 1d3 + 6 (+2 STR + 1 PBS + 1 weapon + 2 DA)
long sword: 1d6 + 2 (+2 STR)

Level 4

- Ranger's Bond: +2/+2 against 1 foe (2/day)
- Items: Sling +1, Long Sword +1
- Stats: +1 DEX = 18 STR

+7/+7 to hit at range w/ sling = +5 BAB + 4 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 weapon - 2 DA
+8 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +4 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size + 1 weapon

sling: 1d3 + 8 (+2 STR + 1 PBS + 1 weapon + 4 DA)
long sword: 1d6 + 3 (+2 STR + 1 weapon)

Level 5

- Ranger's Bond: +4/+4 against 1 foe (2/day)
- Surprise Shift (2/day, Hunter Trick)
- Items: Sling +1, Long Sword +1

+9/+9 to hit at range w/ sling = +5 BAB + 4 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 weapon - 2 DA + 1 Weapon Focus
+9 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +5 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size + 1 weapon

sling: 1d3 + 8 (+2 STR + 1 PBS + 1 weapon + 4 DA)
long sword: 1d6 + 3 (+2 STR + 1 weapon)

Level 6

- Ranger's Bond: +4/+4 against 1 foe (2/day)
- Surprise Shift (3/day, Hunter Trick)
- Items: Sling +2, Long Sword +1

+10/+10/+5 to hit at range w/ sling = +6 BAB + 4 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 weapon - 2 DA + 1 WF
+10/+5 to hit at melee w/ long sword = +6 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size + 1 weapon

sling: 1d3 + 9 (+2 STR + 1 PBS + 2 weapon + 4 DA )
long sword: 1d6 + 3 (+2 STR + 1 weapon)

Level 7

- Ranger's Bond: +4/+4 against 1 foe (3/day)
- Surprise Shift (3/day, Hunter Trick Pool)
- Tangling Attack (3/day, Hunter Trick Pool)
- Items: Sling +2

+11/+11/+6 to hit at range w/ sling = +7 BAB + 4 DEX + 1 Size + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 weapon - 2 DA + 1 WF
+12/+7 to hit at melee w/ sling = +7 BAB + 2 STR + 1 Size + 2 weapon

sling, range: 1d3 + 9 (+2 STR + 1 PBS + 2 weapon + 4 DA)
sling, melee: 1d3 + 4 (+2 STR + 2 weapon)

****************************************

It's harder to do a halfling ranger due to the enormous feat requirements.

[Krodjin]

So much for Point Blank Master being a corner case. Your build shows why not being able to use your ranged weapon in melee without eating AoO's is a significant set back when compared against an Archer.

[Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti]

Would a halfling fighter be built the same way?

[Krodjin]

Yes. You get more feats but cannot skip the prerequisites like the Ranger. You can't take Improved Precise Shot until 11th level; which can be a big issue for ranged Fighters depending on the type of game you're in.

[Rory]

Krodjin wrote:

So much for Point Blank Master being a corner case.

Point Blank Master is a corner case because only the fighter and the ranged ranger can get that feat (and the optimized ranged ranger should prefer ManyShot at level 6). There are many, many classes out there afterall.

Krodjin wrote:

Your build shows why not being able to use your ranged weapon in melee without eating AoO's is a significant set back when compared against an Archer.

My build has the ability (Surprise Shift) to move an extra 5 ft in a round without provoking an AOO.

Point Blank Master would have been a wasted feat on this build.

[Krodjin]

The Zen Archer also gets Point Blank Master as a bonus feat/Class Feature. The 3 classes best suited to ranged combat will all eventually have PBM.

DM's learn in a hurry that an Archery focused character is often the most consistent damage dealing martial in a party. As such they will attempt to neutralize the Archer through various methods. One of which is getting in their face. At least that's my experience.

Surprise shift is nice. But it's a limited resource that can be countered pretty easily.

For your build I agree that PBM would be an inferior choice, even if you had the feats to spare. But the fact remains; the slingers inability to reload as a free action without provoking an AoO will be something that troubles them forever, even if they spend the feat on PBM.

I've played a slinger before. Trust me it's an issue. If you have a dedicated Archer in your party it's even more frustrating. I saw a build on here the other day that was a buffing Halfling slinger bard that looked near because it did other things well. That's the way I'd go with my next sling build, if I try it again.

[Khazrandir]

Rory wrote:

Krodjin wrote:

So much for Point Blank Master being a corner case.

Point Blank Master is a corner case because only the fighter and the ranged ranger can get that feat (and the optimized ranged ranger should prefer ManyShot at level 6). There are many, many classes out there afterall.

Just because there are wizards who don't care about a feat doesn't make it a "corner case". That would make all archery feats into corner cases (there are many non-archers after all). Let's just agree that it's not a super common issue, but a feat that many archers consider.