| Daniel Chaplik |
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Those of you familiar with my previous re-write threat, Resurrecting the Rogue, may already know that this thread has been long in the making. After fiddling around with the details of my rewrite, only to be frustrated with the design and starting over from scratch all over again, I feel confident enough in my rewrite of the monk class to publicly publish my current results.
Why a full re-write instead of a list of tweaks? Mostly because I don't have the time to sit down and look through how each tweak will interact with the other features and implied abilities of the class. Also because the purpose of this class rewrite was strictly to balance out the class in comparison to the other martial characters - it is in no way designed to be dropped into the middle of an already existing campaign, though an existing monk character could simply be rerolled to make use of this new progression.
I should preface my presentation with the statement that while the monk has plenty of fluff regarding his focus on enlightenment and meditative reflection, at the core of the class I believe is its combat ability. More often than not, a player is drawn to the monk's ability to perform unarmed combat more than any thematic fluff. In this rewrite, I have attempted to balance both ideas in the class design.
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Hit Die: d10
Base Attack Bonus: Good progression; like a fighter, the monk's base attack bonus is always equal to his level.
Base Saving Throws: The monk uses the good progression for all three of his base saving throws.
Skill Ranks per Level: 4 + Intelligence Modifier
In fact, many of his class features are lost to him while equipped with such gear or otherwise encumbered. For the purpose of losing access to his class features, a monk treats any effect that simulates armor or a shield (that is, an effect or item that provides an armor bonus or a shield bonus to his AC) as actual armor or a true shield. He can carry such items, but cannot make use of them himself. As soon as he removes the offending items, any affected class features return to normal.
Just as the Improved Unarmed Strike feat allows the monk to choose whether he will deal lethal or nonlethal damage with an unarmed strike, he may also choose to deal either lethal or nonlethal damage with appropriate grapple checks. Each time the monk declares an unarmed strike, he may decide to inflict bludgeoning, slashing, or piercing damage. If he can make more than one attack per round (for example, due to the iterative attacks available to a monk of 6th level or higher), then he can make this decision individually for each attack.
In combat, a monk deals more damage with her unarmed strikes than a normal person would. Note that the listed damage values are for monks of Medium size. If the monk is smaller than this, his unarmed strikes suffer a cumulative -2 penalty to damage per step of difference between his own size and Medium; this penalty cannot reduce the monk's damage to less than 1 point. For a larger monk, roll one additional die of damage per step of difference between his own size and Medium.
- 1 - 3: 1d6
- 4 - 6: 1d8
- 7 - 9: 1d10
- 10: 2d6
- 11 - 13: 2d8
- 14 - 16: 2d10
- 17 - 19: 3d8
- 20: 3d10
A monk's unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either. This means that she can be subject to magic fang or magic weapon, though remember that like bonuses do not stack. If she selects the Improved Natural Attack feat to improve her unarmed strike, instead of the feat's normal benefit she rolls one additional die of damage.
His intense training also grants him an intuitive awareness of combat and his own presence, granting to him a bonus to both his AC and CMD as long as he wears no armor, does not use a shield, and carries nothing heavier than a light load. This bonus to defense applies even against touch attacks and when the monk is caught Flat-Footed, but not when she is helpless (such as when restrained, paralyzed, or unconscious).
- 1 - 3: +1
- 4 - 6: +2
- 7 - 9: +3
- 10: +4
- 11 - 13: +5
- 14 - 16: +6
- 17 - 19: +7
- 20: +8
When wearing armor or equipped with a shield, a monk loses all benefit of his enlightenment and instead calculates his statistics as normal with Strength and Constitution. This includes a loss of the appropriate number of hit points.
At 8th level, the monk can make two additional attacks when he uses Flurry of Blows. At 15th level, he can make three additional attacks. A monk that wears armor or uses a shield cannot perform a flurry of blows. Similarly, the monk cannot perform a flurry of blows if burdened with medium or heavy encumbrance. A monk's calculated base attack bonus with a flurry of blows is presented below.
- 1: -1/-1
- 2: +0/+0
- 3: +1/+1
- 4: +2/+2
- 5: +3/+3
- 6: +4/+4/-1
- 7: +5/+5/+0
- 8: +6/+6+1/+1
- 9: +7/+7/+2/+2
- 10: +8/+8/+3/+3
- 11: +9/+9/+4/+4/-1
- 12: +10/+10/+5/+5/+0
- 13: +11/+11/+6/+6/+1
- 14: +12/+12/+7/+7/+2
- 15: +13/+13/+8/+8/+3/+3
- 16: +14/+14/+9/+9/+4/+4/-1
- 17: +15/+15/+10/+10/+5/+5/+0
- 18: +16/+16/+11/+11/+6/+6/+1
- 19: +17/+17/+12/+12/+7/+7/+2
- 20: +18/+18/+13/+13/+8/+8/+3
By spending 1 point of ki from this pool, the monk may make one additional attack at his highest base attack bonus as part of a flurry of blows. He can spend 1 point of ki to immediately move up to twenty feet; this movement provokes attacks of opportunity as normal, but it does not count against his total speed for the round. Finally, the monk can spend 1 point of ki to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to either his AC or his CMD, or a +2 dodge bonus to each, for 1 round. Using ki in any of these ways is a swift action.
As a standard action, the monk can concentrate and focus the flow of ki throughout his body for 1 minute per monk level. When he does so, even those without any eldritch heritage or assistance can see the flow of his ki and his whole body sheds light as a torch. At 3rd level, this grants his unarmed strikes a +1 enhancement bonus, which either stacks with any existing enhancement bonus (such as from an enchanted gauntlet or an amulet of mighty fists) to a maximum of +5 or can be used to add weapon properties to the monk's unarmed strikes. A monk's unarmed strike, just like a weapon, must have at least a +1 enhancement bonus to benefit from weapon properties in this way. At 6th, 9th, 13th, 16th, and 19th levels each, the enhancement bonus provided in this manner improves by +1.
Any melee weapon property can be added to the monk's unarmed strike in this fashion, provided that it only takes effect as long as the unarmed strike is applicable. For example, the disruption property can be added, but it has no effect whenever the monk decides to inflict piercing or slashing damage with his unarmed strikes. Weapon properties consume an amount of bonus equal to their cost. They are added to any properties a weapon already has, but duplicate abilities do not stack.
Once the monk has allocated the bonuses from his ki strike, he cannot change them until he focuses his ki again. The monk may use this ability once per day at third level, twice per day at ninth level, and thrice per day at fifteenth level. If the monk is rendered unconscious or reduced to 0 hit points or less while using his ki strike in this manner, he loses all use of his ki strike feature for 30 days or until he gains a new monk level, whichever comes first. During his time period, he suffers a -1 penalty on unarmed strike attack and damage rolls due to his shaken confidence in his own abilities.
If the monk chooses not to specialize in a martial art, he instead gains a bonus feat at 4th level. This feat may be chosen from the following list: Adder Strike, Bodyguard, Catch Off-Guard, Combat Reflexes, Crushing Blow, Deflect Arrows, Dodge, Enforcer, Improved Grapple, Quarterstaff Master, Scorpion Style, Throw Anything, and Weapon Focus (unarmed strike).
At 7th level, he selects another bonus feat from this list. At 10th level, the monk can select another bonus feat and he adds the following to the list of available feats: Breadth of Experience, Gorgon's Fist, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Feint, Improved Trip, In Harm's Way, Jawbreaker, Ki Throw, Mobility, Nightmare Fist, Tripping Staff, and Weapon Specialization (unarmed strike).
At 13th level, he selects another bonus feat. At 16th level, the monk can select another bonus feat and he adds the following to the list of available feats: Blinding Throw, Cockatrice Strike, Bonebreaker, Greater Blind-Fight, Greater Bull Rush, Greater Disarm, Greater Feint, Greater Trip, Greater Weapon Focus (unarmed strike), Improved Critical (unarmed strike), Improved Ki Throw, Medusa's Wrath, Snatch Arrows, Spinning Throw, Spring Attack, and Greater Weapon Specialization (unarmed strike).
A monk loses the benefits and features of his martial style, or his bonus feats, whenever he wears medium or heavy armor or readies a shield. Similarly, he loses these benefits when carrying a medium or heavy load.
Sometimes, a monk may be subject to a dangerous fall when no suitable item is within reach for him to brace against. In such cases, a monk has the supernatural ability to expend 1 point of ki from his pool as an immediate action. This allows him to benefit from his Slowfall feature, but at half effectiveness. For example, at 4th level the monk would benefit from only Slowfall (10 feet) instead of Slowfall (20 feet). The use of Slowfall in this manner results in visible effects. The details of these effects are unique to each monk, and should remain fairly consistent throughout a campaign. One monk may appear to surround himself with a bubble of glowing ki energy, while another might seem to sprout great wings and slowly flutter to safety.
A monk gains his first ki power at 5th level, with a new power every three levels after. If the monk already has a particular ki power, he may allocate further selections to gain one or more ranks of mastery over it. Each power details the additional benefits granted to a master.
While in this trance, the monk can hold his breath for twice as long as normal before he risks suffocation or drowning. He gains a bonus on Fortitude saves and Constitution checks made to resist the effects of cold and heat, smoke, starvation, and thirst. See "Environment," in chapter 13 of the Core Rulebook for more information on each of these hazards.
Thereafter the monk can try to slay the victim at any later time, as long as the attempt is made within a number of days equal to the monk's level. To make such an attempt, the monk merely wills the target to die (a free action), and unless the target makes a Fortitude save (DC 10 + half his class level + his Wisdom modifier), it dies. If the saving throw is successful, the target is no longer in danger from that particular quivering palm attack, but it may still be affected by another one at a later time.
A monk can have no more than one quivering palm in effect at one time. If a monk uses quivering palm while another is still in effect, the previous effect is negated. The victim of a quivering palm cannot be slain in this manner as long as it remains on another plane of existence that is not coterminous or co-existent with the plane in which the monk currently resides (such as an enemy that has fled the Material Plane in favor of the Ethereal Plane). In either latter case, the victim can be slain by a quivering palm but gains a +5 bonus to its saving throw.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Ki Powers
Alternatively, the monk can call upon his Diamond Soul as an immediate action by spending 2 points of ki. His subsequent spell resistance has a duration of only rounds instead of hours (minimum 1 round) but it resists only hostile spellcasting and will not interfere with spells intended to heal or otherwise assist the monk. If used in this manner, Diamond Soul grants spell resistance equal to only 6 + half his class level + his Wisdom modifier.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, he can choose from a small list of benefits. He can choose to increase the spell resistance he gains by +2; He can increase the duration of his spell resistance by one hour (when activated as a swift action) or 1 round (when activated as an immediate action); He can lower his spell resistance with a faster action (from a standard action to a move action, from a move action to a swift action).
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, he can cause one additional creature to ascend to the Ethereal Plane with him. Each affected creature has the same duration as the monk himself, no matter how far apart they become after becoming ethereal. Once the duration is up, or if the effect is dispelled from the monk, then that applies for all affected creatures. If the effect is dispelled from an individual creature the monk caused to become ethereal, only that creature is affected.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, the enhancement bonus lasts for 1 full round, affecting all Acrobatics checks made during that time period. At any point during this time, a master ki acrobat can prematurely discharge this effect to automatically succeed at a single Acrobatics check.
Mastery: At first rank, a master of Ki Block similarly prevents an enemy from activating any supernatural abilities; passive or constantly-active abilities are suspended for the duration of the block. At second rank, an affected creature cannot cast spells or spell-like abilities of up to 1st level. Each additional rank increases the maximum level of spell and spell-like ability that the enemy loses access to.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, he can choose one of several benefits. He can increase the number of rounds that a ki charge remains effective by 1; He can add +1 to the Reflex save DC for half damage; He may increase the range of the burst by five feet.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, the range of his darkvision increases by an additional 10 feet.
Prerequisite: Ki Vision, Wholeness of Body
The monk can focus greater ki when summoning forth his darkvision, granting him the benefits of see invisibility for as long as his Ki Vision technique lasts. See the Unseen is activated on the same action as Ki Vision, and expends an additional 2 points of ki from his pool.
Mastery: This technique cannot be mastered.
Mastery: When a monk masters the art of creating shadow clones, he may cause one of the clones to become quasi-real by spending one additional point of ki from his pool. This clone does not look like a living shadow, but is instead an exact replica of the monk in every detail. Any gear or items on the shadow clone are part of its body, however, and have no effect (nor can they be disarmed, sundered, or otherwise interacted with). As a swift action, the monk can move a quasi-real monk as noted above, cause it to speak in his own voice, or cause it to attack one creature within its reach. If a quasi-real clone attacks a creature, it makes one attack at the monk's highest attack bonus; this is a primary slam attack that deals damage as appropriate for the shadow clone's size. After this attack is resolved, successful or not, the clone vanishes.
Each additional rank of shadow clone mastery allows him to turn one additional shadow clone quasi-real if he spends additional points of ki.
Mastery: At first rank, a master of the Tongue of the Sun and Moon can communicate with animals and with plants while under the effects of this ki power, as though by speak with animals and speak with plants. Each additional rank of mastery thereafter increases the duration of this effect by one minute.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, its effects last for 1 additional round.
Mastery: With each rank of mastery a monk obtains in this ki power, he also restores 1 point of ability damage when he uses wholeness of body. He may apply all of this healing to a single damaged ability, or he may divide it among several damaged ability scores as desired.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Martial Styles
- Novice: The monk's unarmed strikes threaten a critical hit from 19 to 20. Apply this effect before other modifiers to the critical threat range of his unarmed strikes, such as by the Improved Critical feat. The monk gains Critical Focus as a bonus feat, even though he does not meet its prerequisites.
- Apprentice: The monk's unarmed strikes threaten a critical hit from 18 to 20. In addition the monk gains his coice of either Bleeding Critical or Sickening Critical as a bonus feat, even though he doesn't meet the prerequisites of either.
- Journeyman: The monk's unarmed strikes inflict x3 damage on a critical hit, instead of only x2. In addition, the monk gains his choice of either Deafening Critical or Tiring Critical, even though he doesn't meet the prerequisites of either.
- Expert: The monk's unarmed strikes threaten a critical hit from 17 to 20. In addition the monk gains Critical Mastery as a bonus feat, even though he does not meet its prerequisites.
- Master: The monk's unarmed strikes inflict x4 damage on a critical hit, instead of only x3; increase the damage multiplier of any manufactured weapon he wields with the Monk special property by one, as well.
- Grandmaster: As a swift action, the monk can spend 3 points of ki to evoke an All-Consuming Blaze. For 1 round, he can automatically confirm any critical threat scored with an unarmed strike, or a weapon with either the monk or ki focus properties. A critical threat confirmed in this manner has a damage multiplier of one less than normal, however. At the beginning of each subsequent turn, he may spend 1 point of ki as a free action to extend the duration of this effect by 1 round.
- Novice: The monk gains a +2 bonus on all initiative checks. In addition, he gains the Fast Movement feature and has a faster speed than typical members of his race. This feature gives him a +10 enhancement bonus to his speed. Apply this bonus before modifying his speed for his load or for armor. The monk has the supernatural ability to expend ki to further enhance his Fast Movement. As a swift action, he can expend any number of ki points from his pool as he desires. Each point of ki spent in this fashion increases this bonus to his speed by an additional 10 feet until the end of the encounter.
- Apprentice: The monk's bonus to initiative checks improves to +4. In addition, he gains the Evasion class feature and can use it to avoid damage from even many magical attacks. If he makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that deals only half damage on a successful save, then the monk takes no damage at all from that attack. A helpless monk does not benefit from evasion.
- Journeyman: The monk's bonus to initiative checks improves to +6. When the monk uses a full-round action to attack an enemy, he may move a total distance as part of that action equal to half his speed (including modifiers such as from haste or his Fast Movement feature), instead of only five feet. This movement provokes attacks of opportunity as normal from any foe with a higher Dexterity than himself, and it cannot exceed his total speed for the round. The monk may divide this movement up as desired before, after, or between each attack.
- Expert: The monk's bonus to initiative checks improves to +8. The monk gains the Light Steps feature, which allows him to move while barely touching the surface underneath him. As a full-round action, the monk may move up to twice his speed and ignore difficult terrain while he does so. Any surface will support a monk moving in this way, no matter how much he weighs or is carrying. This allows him to move across water, lava, acid, or even the thinnest tree branches. He must end his move on a surface that can support him normally, or immediately become affected by the terrain beneath him. He cannot move across the air, nor can he walk up walls or other vertical surfaces.
When moving in this way, the monk does not take damage from surfaces or hazards that react to being touched, such as lava or caltrops. He does not need to make Acrobatics checks to avoid falling on slippery or rough surfaces. Finally, when using this feature, he ignores mechanical traps that use a location-based trigger. This feature does not protect the monk from other dangers or hazards that affect an area around the surface of a hazard, at the GM's discretion. For example, the monk could easily move across a river of magically frozen water without risk of the supernatural cold freezing him solid. However, if the magic of that frost is so powerful that creatures within so many feet of the river still take cold damage from their proximity, the monk might still be at risk.
- Master: The monk's bonus to initiative checks improves to +10. Furthermore, his ability to avoid magical and mundane area attacks improves, and he gains the Improved Evasion feature. This functions just as Evasion, except that the monk now takes only half damage as if he had made a successful Reflex saving throw even if he actually fails the save.
- Grandmaster: The monk gains the Unarmed Parry feature. A number of times each round equal to his Wisdom bonus (if any, minimum once per round), the monk can declare an unarmed parry against any melee, ranged, or magical attack that requires an attack roll. An unarmed parry is accomplished by making an attack roll of his own using an unarmed strike, natural weapon, or manufactured weapon with either the monk special feature of ki focus property. If the monk's attack roll at least equals the attack roll of his enemy, that attack is turned aside and negated. If the enemy used any expendable resources as a part of that attack (such as attempting a stunning fist), then that use of the resource is wasted to no effect. For example, a touch of idiocy spell can be parried, because it requires a melee touch attack roll. Normally, the charge of a missed touch spell is held until the caster is able to connect with his enemy; if that spell was successfully parried, however, the charge is still expended to no effect. Unarmed parries do not require an action.
- Novice: Enemies that are up to one size category larger than the monk gain no size bonuses to either CMB checks or combat maneuver defense against him. Additionally, the monk gains the supernatural ability Vigor. By spending 1 point of ki from his pool as a swift action, the monk gains a number of temporary hit points equal to his class level. The temporary hit points of Vigor stack with temporary hit points gained from additional sources, but not with subsequent uses of this feature; if the monk has any temporary hit points from a previous activation of Vigor and calls upon this ability again, unused temporary hit points are lost.
- Apprentice: The monk gains 25% resistance to extra damage or other additional effects resulting from critical hits or precision-based attacks such as sneak attack. Whenever the monk is subject to such an effect, or any other effect that does not affect creatures that are immune to critical hits, roll 1d100 (d%); on a roll of 1 – 25, that attack is reduced to normal damage and no additional critical hit or precision-based effects come into play. This resistance stacks with the resistance of armor or shields enhanced with the fortification property.
- Journeyman: Enemies that are up to two size categories larger than the monk gain no size bonuses to either CMB checks or combat maneuver defense against him. Additionally, the strict vigilance and defensive maneuvers of the monk force opponents to tread past him with care. Enemies treat all squares that the monk threatens as difficult terrain.
- Expert: The monk's resistance to critical hits and precision-based attacks improves to 50%.
- Master: Enemies that are up to three size categories larger than the monk gain no size bonuses to either CMB checks or combat maneuver defense against him. Additionally, the monk learns to stand his ground against all enemies, warding the spot where he makes his stand to prevent foes from slipping past and attacking those he protects. If an opponent attempts to use the Acrobatics skill to move through the monk's threatened area or his space without provoke attacks of opportunity, the skill check DC to avoid his attack increases by an amount equal to his class level.
- Grandmaster: The monk's resistance to critical hits and precision-based attacks improves to 75%. Additionally, the monk gains impetuous endurance. He never automatically fails a saving throw when he rolls a natural "1" on the d20, though he may still fail the save if his total result is not high enough to beat the DC.
- Novice: When the monk makes use of his stunning fist, he can apply a new condition to his target; as he gains levels and his expertise over his martial style improves, he learns additional conditions he can choose from. He must decide which condition will apply before the attack roll is made, and it replaces stunning the target. A successful saving throw (at the normal DC) still negates the effect. These conditions do not stack with themselves, but additional hits do increase the duration; a creature fatigued by the monk's stunning fist, for example, does not become exhausted when struck again. A novice of the Path of the Western Wind can choose to make the target fatigued.
- Apprentice: When the monk makes use of his stunning fist, he can also choose to make the target sickened for 1 minute. Additionally, the monk gains the supernatural Unbalancing Blow feature. Each time the monk declares an attack roll with an unarmed strike or a manufactured weapon with the Monk special property, he may spend one point of ki as a free action to turn that attack into an unbalancing blow. The monk must choose to activate this ability before making the attack roll, so a failed attack ruins the attempt. An unbalancing blow cannot also be performed as a stunning fist.
A foe that takes damage from an unbalancing blow must attempt a Reflex save. If successful, the enemy cannot make attacks of opportunity for 1d6+1 rounds; if they fail the save, they are also left flat-footed against all attacks for the same duration. An enemy with the uncanny dodge feature cannot be affected by an unbalancing blow. Multiple strikes increase the duration of this effect.
- Journeyman: When the monk makes use of his stunning fist, he can also choose to make the target staggered for 1d6+1 rounds.
- Expert: When the monk makes use of his stunning fist, he can also choose to either permanently blind or deafen the target. Additionally, the monk gains the supernatural ability to strike out at an enemy's chakra points. Each time the monk declares an attack roll with an unarmed strike or a manufactured weapon with the Monk special property, he may spend two points of ki as a free action to infuse his attacks with his power. The monk must choose to activate this ability before making the attack roll, so a failed attack ruins the attempt. This attack cannot also be performed as a stunning fist.
A foe that takes damage from this attack must attempt a Will save as the natural flow of his chakra, or spiritual energy, is interrupted. If successful, the enemy takes 1 point of damage to an ability score of the monk's choice; if the enemy fails this save, the ability damage becomes two points. If the attack confirms a critical hit, apply it's critical modifier to the amount of ability score damage that is dealt.
This ability damage does not heal normally. It can be removed with any magical healing that removes ability damage (such as restoration), or with a Heal check to perform special acupuncture and massages that takes 1d4 hours to perform. The DC of this check is the same as the monk's stunning fist DC, and the monk himself enjoys a +10 bonus on such Heal checks. A successful check heals 1d4 points of damage from a single ability.
- Master: When the monk makes use of this stunning fist, he can also choose to paralyze the target for 1d6+1 rounds.
- Grandmaster: The monk can deal crippling blows to his enemies, leaving them unable to do battle at full effect. Each time the monk declares an attack roll with a unarmed strike or a manufactured weapon with the Monk special property, he may spend three points of ki as a free action to perform a crippling blow. The monk must choose to activate this ability before making the attack roll, so a failed attack ruins the attempt. A crippling blow cannot also be performed as a stunning fist.
A foe that takes damage from a crippling blow must make a Fortitude save or be unable to threaten critical hits on any roll less than a 20, no matter what the threat range of his enemy's weapon actually is, for 1d6+1 rounds. Each time a struck creature benefits from any amount of magical hit point healing, he can attempt another Fortitude save to end this effect prematurely. Multiple strikes increase the duration of this effect.
| Vadskye |
As he continues his training, the monk slowly transcends the normal bounds of his mortal existence and can eventually do away with his mortal coil entirely and become something perfectly attuned to the universe.
I like this fluff.
When calculating any statistic that normally uses his Strength or Constitution modifier, the monk may instead use his Wisdom bonus (if any) if it is higher.
I hate this mechanic. So a 1st level monk can have 8 Strength and 8 Con while still being beefy and hitting like a truck? No slow development into enlightenment - all monks just gain the ability to eschew the need for the body the instant they step out of the monk school.
We may have a difference in perception. But in my head, your normal monk is agile and strong. Yes, there are legends of venerable masters who can transcend physical constraints by the sheer power of their own enlightenment. But that level of power is only gained through years of training, not an inherent part of the monk.
| Daniel Chaplik |
I like this fluff.
Thank you. :)
I hate this mechanic. So a 1st level monk can have 8 Strength and 8 Con while still being beefy and hitting like a truck? No slow development into enlightenment - all monks just gain the ability to eschew the need for the body the instant they step out of the monk school.
We may have a difference in perception. But in my head, your normal monk is agile and strong. Yes, there are legends of venerable masters who can transcend physical constraints by the sheer power of their own enlightenment. But that level of power is only gained through years of training, not an inherent part of the monk.
That's why it only comes into play if the monk's Wis is higher. While I imagine many will focus on Wis instead of Str and Con because it applies to so much, there are many things it won't apply towards. It specifically only affects things that use those ability score modifiers for a reason; so, outside of bonus feats for a monk who selects not to focus on a martial style, his Str and Con will limit what feats he's eligible for. I don't know of any Prestige Classes that have specific Str or Con prereq's off hand, but if there are any then it won't apply towards that, either.
For me, I think that there isn't enough to differentiate some 1st-level PC's from their 1st-level NPC counterparts. A 1st-level NPC should NOT be as powerful as a higher level PC, of course; but even one level in a PC class implies that the character is already far outside the norm for his kind.
At the end of the day, I think that it's enough of a trade-off ability to warrant it; you can either let yourself be physically weak and frail but "understand the universe" enough to make up for it, or you can focus on being actually buff and then qualify for more features, without being as wise and accepting that some of the class features you'll grow into are going to be weaker than they could be.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Below are listed all of the monk archetypes from the Advanced Player's Guide. Each has been edited as necessary to fall in line with my re-write of the monk progression. Some of these archetypes have had abilities rewritten or intensified, or had new abilities given to them, in an attempt to better balance out the thematic concept of an archetype and its usefulness in a campaign as a whole.
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Drunken Master
Most monks lead lives of moderation and quiet contemplation. But the drunken master finds perfection through excess. Powered by strong wine, he uses his intoxication to reach a state where his ki is more potent, if somewhat fleeting. A drunken master has the following class features.
HUNGRY GHOST MONK
The hungry ghost monk looks to spirits that prey upon the living as models of perfection. He sees the life energy of the universe as a resource to be manipulated, even going so far as to steal it from other creatures. It is through this constant influx of energy that he hungry ghost monk reaches his ultimate goal: Power – personal, pure, and simple. A hungry ghost monk has the following class features.
- Novice: If the novice hungry ghost monk chooses to push an opponent back, he can move the target up to ten feet away. He can always choose to knock an opponent back to a distance less than this, as long as that distance is expressed in five-foot increments. If the monk knocks an opponent back and that opponent cannot travel the full distance because they encounter some sort of obstacle (such as an enemy being knocked back into a wall, for example), they take 1d4 damage for every five feet of movement they are prevented from traveling, plus the monk's Strength bonus (or his Wisdom bonus, as appropriate for Enlightenment).
For example, a hungry ghost monk with a Wisdom score of 16 decides to knock his opponent back ten feet. That opponent, however, is already adjacent to a wall and cannot travel any distance. After the punishing kick is resolved, the opponent takes an additional 2d4+3 damage on contact with the wall because of the force of his momentum.
- Apprentice: When the hungry ghost monk decides to push back an enemy with his punishing kick, any movement his enemy is forced to take provokes attacks of opportunity as normal for moving out of the threatened space of creatures. When a creature is knocked prone instead of being pushed back, the hungry ghost monk can sap some of that enemy's vitality on contact. By reducing the saving throw DC of his punishing kick attack by two points, the monk forces a creature knocked prone to become momentarily tired – to stand up from a prone position, the creature must use a standard action instead of a move action.
- Journeyman: If the journeyman hungry ghost monk chooses to push an opponent back, he can move the target up to fifteen feet away. The saving throw DC to resist being knocked prone increases by +4.
- Expert: When the hungry ghost monk uses his punishing kick attack to push back an enemy, that enemy must make a Reflex saving throw. This save DC is the same for if the were to be knocked prone. If the enemy fails this save, then the hungry ghost monk can push them into a space that is unsafe for them or unable to support their weight. An enemy could be knocked into a jet of steam or a river of molten stone, for example, or onto a weakened area of the floor or even off the edge of a cliff.
- Master: If the master hungry ghost monk chooses to push an opponent back, he can move the target up to twenty feet away. Alternatively, he can choose to push his opponent back and knock the prone simultaneously. In this case, the opponent can be pushed back up to only ten feet and receives a saving throw as normal to resist being knocked prone.
At 11th level, each time the monk successfully steals ki, he can immediately spend the energy to afflict his enemy. Instead of replenishing his own pool of ki, the hungry ghost monk can spend the stolen point of ki to cast contagion as a spell-like ability. His effective caster level for this ability is equal to half his class level. If another hungry ghost monk attempts to cast contagion on him in this manner, the monk gains a bonus to save versus the effect equal to his Wisdom bonus (if any).
As a result of the distaste this attack engenders in others, the hungry ghost monk suffers a permanent -4 penalty to Bluff and Diplomacy checks made against any other kind of monk who sees him perform this technique; at the GM's discretion, half this penalty may be applied when dealing with other monks who have heard of the hungry ghost monk's actions but did not personally see the event.
[spoiler=Life Funnel (Su); 9th Level]A hungry ghost monk can steal a creature's life force to replenish his own. If the monk has at least 1 point of ki in his pool and scores a confirmed critical hit against a living enemy or reduces a living enemy to 0 or fewer hit points, he heals a number of hit points equal to his monk level; he cannot exceed his maximum number of hit points in this manner. As with steal ki, some monks believe that this technique is an unsavory act, no better than what the undead do to the living. As a result, the hungry ghost monk suffers a penalty to Bluff and Diplomacy checks just as he does for stealing ki; these penalties stack if the monk is seen using both techniques. This ability replaces Diamond Body.
KI MYSTIC
The ki mystic believes that violence is sometimes necessary, but knowing and understanding is the true root of perfection. Through meditation and spiritual visions, a ki mystic can see beyond the veil of reality to the underlying truth of all existence. A ki mystic has the following class features.
MONK OF THE EMPTY HAND
The monk of the empty hand eschews normal weapons in favor of whatever is lying round – rocks, chair legs, flagons of ale, even a simple quill pen all become deadly weapons in the hands of such a monk. A monk of the empty hand draws on his own ki to infuse his improvised weapons with power, and can transform a broken bottle into a magical weapon. A monk of the empty hand has the following class features.
MONK OF THE FOUR WINDS
The monk of the four winds is connected to the natural world in a way that few other creatures – even other monks – can hope to match. He can call upon the elements and the spirits of the world in times of need, and as he nears his goal of perfection, he gains the ability to slow down time and even defeat death itself. A monk of the four winds has the following class features.
- Aspect of the Carp: The monk's skin becomes a coat of golden, iridescent fish scales, his neck grows gills, and his fingers become webbed. He can breathe water and gains a swim speed equal to his land speed. The spirit of the carp is heroic and adventurous, and does not smile upon the acts of the vile and the depraved – only non-evil monks may take on this aspect.
- Aspect of the Ki-Rin: The monk's skin takes on a golden luminescence, and a silvery mane that cannot be bound grows atop his head. He gains a fly speed equal to his land speed, but he must end each turn on the ground. If the monk does no land by the end of his turn, he falls from whatever height he has attained. The spirit of the ki-rin is honorable, honest, and eagerly sacrifices of itself so that others need never do so – only a monk that is good may receives its favor.
- Aspect of the Monkey: The monk's face becomes that of monkey, and he grows a prehensile tail. The monk can pick up objects and make unarmed attacks with his tail, though he does not gain an extra attack per round simply for having this tail. In addition, the monk gains a climb speed equal to his land speed. The spirit of the monkey is a creature of whimsy and a lover of pranks – a monk who chooses to follow in its path becomes chaotic, but does not become an ex-monk for doing so.
- Aspect of the Oni: The monk's skin becomes pitch black, and is hair turns white, black, red, or violet. He can assume gaseous form (as per the spell) as a standard action for 1 minute per day per monk level. This duration does not need to be consecutive, but it must be spent in 1 minute increments. The spirit of the oni is treacherous and deceitful; a creature the lives to dominate others and hungers for the pain and death of living creatures. A monk must be evil to earn its dark blessings.
- Aspect of the Owl: The monk grows feathers, and his head becomes avian, with wide, unblinking eyes and a sharp beak. He gains af fly speed of 30 feet, a +2 racial bonus on Perception checks due to his new keen senses, and a bite attack that deals damage as appropriate for his size. The spirit of the owl is a sage creature, deeply serious, and driven towards a single goal – a monk only of lawful alignment will know the taste of its favor.
- Aspect of the Tiger: Dark stripes appear on the monk's skin, and his face becomes more feline. His eyes become catlike, with vertical pupils, and his canines enlarge. Once per hour,t he monk can move at 10 times his normal land speed when he makes a charge and is treated as though he had the pounce ability. The spirit of the tiger is swift, fierce, and deadly, but no more so than any other predator beast – it is not cruel or malicious in intent, and grants its boon to monks of any alignment.
Each game master is encouraged to make as much or as little of a spirit's involvement as best fits his or her campaign. In one game, the spirits may simply be nameless benefactors of greater power – no more thought is given to them than what new class feature they provide. In another, they may be fleshed out as fully-functional NPC's (at least in regards to their personality, if not their statistics), wise and mighty beings of a divine nature that may also tend to be cryptic and enigmatic. They may be exactly as they appear on face value, or a spirit may have a hidden agenda, an end it subtly maneuvers those monks who have earned its favor towards.
If the monk has at least 6 points of ki to spend upon his return, any gear that was left at the place of his demise mysteriously vanishes from that location, only to reappear on his person once more. This strange twist of fate also affects any items that were pilfered from his corpse; if his enemies stole his +5 quarterstaff and sold it to a traveling merchant, circumstance over the next 24 hours would have seen it lost from that merchant's possession and somehow returned to the monk, no matter how far away he might be.
MONK OF THE HEALING HAND
Monks of the healing hand seek perfection through helping others. By focusing their meditations on the flow of life within themselves and all creation they gain an understanding of how to share their ki with others, healing wounds and even bringing the dead back to life. For such a monk, sacrificing himself to save another is the surest way to achieve transcendence into something greater than even the gods themselves can understand. A monk of the healing fist has the following class features.
Alternatively, if the monk of the healing hand uses this ability to grant temporary ki points to an undead creature, that creature also has the option of using a standard action to consume the life energy and regain a small spark of its lost spirit. For a number of minutes equal to the creature's Charisma bonus (if any, minimum 1 round), that creature is healed by positive energy and harmed by negative energy as though it were a living creature.
At 15th level, a monk of the healing hand can channel all of his ki to bring life back to the dead. It takes 1 hour to perform this ritual. At the end of the ritual, the monk sacrifices all of his ki in order to cast raise dead (as the spell) with a caster level equal to his monk level. He must spend at least as many points of ki as the subject had hit dice. If he can spend twice as many ki points as the subject's hit dice, the ritual instead casts resurrection. These rituals require no material components. When emptied in this manner, the monk's pool of ki cannot be replenished by any means until 24 hours have passed. This ability replaces Quivering Palm.
Alternatively, the monk can perform an even greater miracle of resurrection but only the ultimate price. When the monk activates his true sacrifice feature, he may instead choose to return life to slain allies within a one mile radius of himself. This functions exactly as outlined above, except that the monk's consciousness does not transcend to a higher state. He is completely and utterly destroyed. It isn't that others forget his name and cannot record it; his entire existence is wiped out of time, as though he were never born. The flow of history is not changed in a grand sense, but his deeds are remembered to have been accomplished by others.
MONK OF THE LOTUS
Monks are warriors who hone their bodies into deadly weapons, but some monks eschew violence in favor of a more peaceful philosophy. While a monk of the lotus realizes that combat cannot always be avoided – and is more than capable in a fight – he understands that all creatures are connected, and to harm another is to harm the self. Instead, he strives to find peaceful resolutions to conflicts, and in doing so, hopes to achieve inner peace. A monk of the lotus has the following class features.
- Novice: The duration of the monk's touch of serenity increases by 1 round. At the start of the subject's turn on additional round, they may attempt an additional Will save (at the same DC) to prematurely end this effect.
- Apprentice: While under the effects of a touch of serenity, the monk's enemies cannot perform an aid another action to grant one of their allies a bonus to any attack roll or CMB check, to AC, or to their CMD.
- Journeyman: The duration of the monk's touch of serenity increases by 1 round.
- Expert: A victim of the monk's touch of serenity cannot benefit from Teamwork feats, and does not count towards his or her allies' use of teamwork feats either, for the duration of the touch of serenity.
[spoiler=Touch of Peace (Su); 15th Level]A monk of the lotus can set up vibrations within the body of another creature to win over the creature's mind. The monk can use touch of peace once per day, and must announce his intent before making an attack roll. On a successful hit, the attack deals no damage, but the target is charmed as if the monk had cast charm monster with a caster level equal to the monk's level. The target does not get a saving throw against this effect. The creature is charmed for 1 day per level. If the monk or his allies attack the charmed creature, or if the monk asks or commands the charmed creature to take hostile actions, the effect ends. This is a mind-affecting charm effect. This ability replaces Quivering Palm.
MONK OF THE SACRED MOUNTAIN
The monk of the sacred mountain finds strength and power in the earth beneath his feet. Rather than spinning through the battlefield with the fluid motion of the river, he roots himself to the ground, as immovable and unshakable as the stones of the mountain. A monk of the sacred mountain has the following class features.
WEAPON ADEPT
While all monks train in both armed and unarmed combat, the weapon adept seeks to become one with his weapons, transforming them into perfect extensions of his own body. Through such training, a weapon adept seeks to attain perfection by becoming a living weapon himself A weapon adept has the following class features.
ZEN ARCHER
Some monks to become one with another weapon entirely – the bow. The zen archer takes a weapon most other monks eschew and seeks perfection in the pull of a taut bowstring, the flex of a bow's limbs, and the flight of an arrow fired true. A zen -archer has the following class features.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Here are three feats I've brewed up to go along with my monk. I'm going to go through all the "monk" feats that are official in the CRB, APG, UM, UC, and ARG, once I'm done tweaking archetypes.
Prerequisite: Ki power
Benefit: When you select this feat, you gain one new ki power. Alternatively, you can gain a new rank of mastery in up to two ki powers you already possess.
Special: A character may take this feat multiple times; its effects can be applied to a new ki power each time, or can be used to continue mastering a ki power that the character already possesses.
Prerequisite: Constitution 14
Benefit: You may drink a beverage, be it alcoholic or virgin, as a move action instead of a standard action. This also applies to similar items, such as drinking a potion or spreading an oil. If you can already drink a beverage this fast, you can instead drink it as a swift action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity.
Special: A character may take this feat multiple times; its effect stacks.
Normal: A character can drink a beverage as a standard action that provokes an attack of opportunity.
Prerequisite: Human-only; Knowledge (arcana) 8 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 15 ranks, Quivering Palm
Benefit: You may have a number of additional quivering palm attacks in effect equal to your Wisdom bonus. You may only affect attempt to place a quivering palm on a creature once per round, and can only attempt to slay a creature that holds these vibrations within their body once per round.
Normal: You may only affect a single target with your quivenrig palm at any given time.
| Banglor |
My main concern as I was reading was the damage you gave him. A monk at level 20 without magic items without strength or any feats added just with the spell haste if he hits with all his attacks does 24d10 in one round. Thats without amulet of the mighty fist with vicious and flaming bane etc etc. Just seems like too much damage for one character to do in one round. I do know he may not hit with all his abilities but 3d10 for one attack without str enhancement bonuses style feats damaging feats or magic items just seems like a little much to me. I personally like that you made it any non chaotic but the strict training/discipline made sense to me that they were lawful.
P.S that's only for a monk of medium size a titan monk will kill a god in one-2 rounds solo.
| Daniel Chaplik |
My main concern as I was reading was the damage you gave him. A monk at level 20 without magic items without strength or any feats added just with the spell haste if he hits with all his attacks does 24d10 in one round. Thats without amulet of the mighty fist with vicious and flaming bane etc etc. Just seems like too much damage for one character to do in one round. I do know he may not hit with all his abilities but 3d10 for one attack without str enhancement bonuses style feats damaging feats or magic items just seems like a little much to me. I personally like that you made it any non chaotic but the strict training/discipline made sense to me that they were lawful.
P.S that's only for a monk of medium size a titan monk will kill a god in one-2 rounds solo.
But keep in mind that the amulet of mighty fists is ALL the monk has, traditionally speaking. As in, that's the only way for him to GET any additional magic damage or effects out of his unarmed strikes. The extra base damage is a necessary upgrade to keep the monk in line with other martial characters.
That's why I changed ki strike to what it is now - I don't want a character that relies on a single magic item to function. I want one that can either remain powerful without them, without becoming overpowered WITH them, or one who can use a diverse array of magic items like anyone else. Hence, I tried to make the AoMF a non-necessary thing for monk builds.
Now, the average damage of 3d10 is 16. Assuming he does get hasted or he gets his hands on a +x amulet of mighty fists of speed, AND assuming he does actually manage to hit with every attack - he's looking at 128 damage. To give you an example of how this breaks down in an actual combat, let's throw him up against a pit fiend.
He's going to have to move to get over to his enemy; this limits him to a single attack, if he isn't a Monk of the Eastern Wind, which, granting to you, he's hitting on a 3 or higher. After a round a full attacks from the pit fiend, he decides to return the favor with a flurry of blows. So his best three attacks are hitting on a 5; the next two are hitting on a 10, the next two are only hitting on a 15, and his last is only hitting on a natural 20. So, statistically speaking, he has an 85% chance of hitting with his first three attacks, a 50% chance with the next two, only a 25% chance of hitting with the next two, and only a 5% chance of hitting with the first!
Making the assumption that he monk does hit with every attack, that puts us at 128 damage. BUT. Not really. Because the pit fiend has both Damage Reduction and regeneration that has to be taken into account. IF the monk is of good alignment, then he can overcome the DR at least because of his ki strike feature. He's still only dealing nonlethal damage, though, because of the regeneration! Ki Strike comes into play specifically for overcoming DR, just like it does for the standard monk, nothing else.
In order to overcome the creature's regeneration and deal lethal damage, the monk would have to have used some of the enhancement bonus off of ki strike ritual to purchase the holy property. This would raise his average damage by 6 points, admittedly, but it would also reduce his chance to hit by two points - a full 10%, in this scenario.
And if the monk is not good, then he isn't overcoming the DR either; he might if it was silver OR good, but it's silver AND good - and a non-good monk's ki strike can only overcome part of that. So his maximum damage potential right now is dropped down to...
A measly 8 points!
Now, compare that to Amiri, the iconic barbarian. According to the NPC Codex, she runs around with a large bastard sword that inflicts 2d8 damage. Well, what happens if we turn this into a +x bastard sword of impact? Now, it's dealing 3d8 damage - at 13 average damage, there's no only 3 points of difference between her and the monk. So then let's thrown on some more magic.
In any event, it's very unlikely for character's to hit with every attack, if they're fighting creature's with CR's at level with them. The crazily optimized-all-I-can-do-is-win-combat-encounters characters might be able to do it with less effort, but not anyone else. So this fact of probability reduces the character's damage output even further.
Also don't forget that the flurry of blows is mechanically equivalent to two-weapon fighting. I don't specifically call that out in my re-write for the sole reason that I'm writing this up in a PDF document to release the final version with new feats, magic items, the whole nine yards, so I'm trying to conserve word count. But if you look at the numbers, it's no different from the CRB version. Taking that into account, a TWF martial could be seen as just as much of a threat as the monk can, in that regard, because she can get just as many attacks per round as he can. And as I've shown above, her ease of acquiring magical tools to do battle with more than makes up for the one extra die of damage given to the monk.
The bottom line is, even with one extra die of damage, my monk isn't going to outshine anyone else's martial characters straight by the numbers.
| Dabbler |
That's why it only comes into play if the monk's Wis is higher.
Why the hell wouldn't they in point buy?
"When calculating any statistic that normally uses his Strength or Constitution modifier, the monk may instead use his Wisdom bonus (if any) if it is higher."
Basically that's everything but holding your breath and carrying capacity. So at 20 point buy, I get 7 back by dumping Str, Con and Cha, and spend 17 to pump Wisdom to 18 (where my rzcial mod goes as well to take me to 20), and put everything else into Dexterity. Then I have in effect 20 Str, 20 Con, 16 Dex, 20 Wis. So it doesn't count toward feats, carrying capacity and holding my breath...it counts for what really matters: hitting things, hurting things, taking damage, and making saves.
Way broken.
| +5 Toaster |
Daniel Chaplik wrote:That's why it only comes into play if the monk's Wis is higher.Why the hell wouldn't they in point buy?
"When calculating any statistic that normally uses his Strength or Constitution modifier, the monk may instead use his Wisdom bonus (if any) if it is higher."
Basically that's everything but holding your breath and carrying capacity. So at 20 point buy, I get 7 back by dumping Str, Con and Cha, and spend 17 to pump Wisdom to 18 (where my rzcial mod goes as well to take me to 20), and put everything else into Dexterity. Then I have in effect 20 Str, 20 Con, 16 Dex, 20 Wis. So it doesn't count toward feats, carrying capacity and holding my breath...it counts for what really matters: hitting things, hurting things, taking damage, and making saves.
Way broken.
and a super mega awesome dip for other classes. A SADder cleric, why not? reeaally gotta consider beyond the monk class with this one.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Daniel Chaplik wrote:That's why it only comes into play if the monk's Wis is higher.Why the hell wouldn't they in point buy?
The first problem is that you're arguing a mechanic over its merits for a single method of character development. Even if that were the case for point-buy, which I disagree on, anyway, not everyone uses the PB system. As a GM I never have, and I have only ever had a single GM ever use PB - either in DnD or in Pathfinder. In any event, if it were that much of an issue for PB, the GM can easily avoid this by not using the point-buy method. Hell, he can even just assign an array or a list of arrays for payers to choose from.
*shrugs*
My point is there are plenty of ways to avoid that being an issue.
Basically that's everything but holding your breath and carrying capacity. So at 20 point buy, I get 7 back by dumping Str, Con and Cha, and spend 17 to pump Wisdom to 18 (where my rzcial mod goes as well to take me to 20), and put everything else into Dexterity. Then I have in effect 20 Str, 20 Con, 16 Dex, 20 Wis. So it doesn't count toward feats, carrying capacity and holding my breath...it counts for what really matters: hitting things, hurting things, taking damage, and making saves.
Way broken.
And if it doesn't count towards feats, good luck doing anything other than standing in one spot and hitting an enemy and not getting killed in the process. I'm sorry, but your ability scores are not the be-all-and-end-all of over-powered or under-powered; even within the confines of the game, a character's basic potential will only carry him so far.
With a STR of 7, good luck qualifying for a number of martially-inclined feats. The only ones you'll be able to pick up are those that are bonus feats for you, if you choose to forgo martial styles.
Not to mention it doesn't matter what Wisdom replaces when it comes to ability score damage. Choose to dump your actual Constitution, and you're leaving yourself open to all sorts of risks; a 1d4 STR damage poison is much more deadly to someone with 7 points of Strength than it is to someone with 14.
and a super mega awesome dip for other classes. A SADder cleric, why not? reeaally gotta consider beyond the monk class with this one.
This is a legitimate concern, however. I may consider limiting the bonus similar to the duelist - up to one point per class level. Or maybe one per two class levels.
rainzax
|
how about:
Enlightenment
A monk may choose a number of Strength or Dexterity based class skills equal to his Wisdom modifier. He gains a +1 enlightenment bonus to these skills for every two monk levels he possesses.
or
Enlightenment
A monk may take a +1 enlightenment bonus for every two monk levels he possesses to any Strength or Constitution based check he makes. He may do this a number of times per day equal to his Wisdom modifier.
| Petty Alchemy RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16 |
We may have a difference in perception. But in my head, your normal monk is agile and strong. Yes, there are legends of venerable masters who can transcend physical constraints by the sheer power of their own enlightenment. But that level of power is only gained through years of training, not an inherent part of the monk.
Keep in mind transitional difficulties here. If your monk starts with high Str and high Con, he's not going to magically be able to have a better Wisdom when he's lvl15-20 (depending on when you assume the monk will be "enlightened" enough to mainstat wisdom).
Of course, if you put that ability at lvl3 (much like the Zen Archer's +Wis to ranged attacks), it will be a much more punishing dip to casters.
Alternatively you can add a rider of something like: "By focusing on understanding the universe, the monk restrains himself from ever learning how to rewrite reality (ie cast spells)"
Of course, being able to use Wis for two stats is a little too much, and you 100% should balance for PB if you want this to be considered for tables other than your own, because PB is the most popular stat gen method (at least in my experience). I'd drop it to replacing Str and not Con.
| Dabbler |
Dabbler wrote:The first problem is that you're arguing a mechanic over its merits for a single method of character development.Daniel Chaplik wrote:That's why it only comes into play if the monk's Wis is higher.Why the hell wouldn't they in point buy?
Your problem is that it is the MAIN method of character developement and the one used for play-testing and games design.
Even if that were the case for point-buy, which I disagree on, anyway, not everyone uses the PB system.
If you use random methods, you just need ONE lucky roll and you have three whacked up stats. In any method, it turns a single racial +2 bonus into three +2 bonuses.
As a GM I never have, and I have only ever had a single GM ever use PB - either in DnD or in Pathfinder. In any event, if it were that much of an issue for PB, the GM can easily avoid this by not using the point-buy method. Hell, he can even just assign an array or a list of arrays for payers to choose from.
So the monk player just assigns his lowest two scores to strength and con, and his highest + racial modifier to Wisdom, and you have the same problem again.
My point is there are plenty of ways to avoid that being an issue.
Could you mention one other than all characters having the same score in every attribute with no racial modifiers please? I just found the flaws in everything you have mentioned so far
And if it doesn't count towards feats, good luck doing anything other than standing in one spot and hitting an enemy and not getting killed in the process.
Really? What can't you get that rely on Strength or Con? Power Attack feat tree (which is meh unless you use a two-handed weapon), and that's about it. Besides, with +5 hp per die and +5 to hit and damage, and a good AC, standing and hitting things is not such a bad plan!
I'm sorry, but your ability scores are not the be-all-and-end-all of over-powered or under-powered; even within the confines of the game, a character's basic potential will only carry him so far.
They aren't, but they sure can help.
With a STR of 7, good luck qualifying for a number of martially-inclined feats. The only ones you'll be able to pick up are those that are bonus feats for you, if you choose to forgo martial styles.
Actually, there are not that many feats that rely on strength or constitution. Power Attack is the only common one, and as your unarmed strike counts as a light weapon you can replace it with Piranha Strikes. Other than that, what is there that a monk needs? Not much, many more styles and feats rely on dexterity and wisdom than on strength.
Not to mention it doesn't matter what Wisdom replaces when it comes to ability score damage. Choose to dump your actual Constitution, and you're...
They have to hit you first, and with the touch AC you can have that won't be easy. You'd have to be careful, maybe make sure you are always carrying a potion of lesser restoration, but that's about it.
+5 Toaster wrote:This is a legitimate concern, however. I may consider limiting the bonus similar to the duelist - up to one point per class level. Or maybe one per two class levels.and a super mega awesome dip for other classes. A SADder cleric, why not? reeaally gotta consider beyond the monk class with this one.
Which is a much better idea - in fact, I'd go further and say one per two levels would be a better way to go.
| +5 Toaster |
hmm lets see
Enlightenment:The Monk may choose to substitute his wisdom modifer (to a maximum of half his level) in place of any of his physical ability score modifiers for any class features and effects, with the exception of bonus hit points per level, for which the monk may substitute his full wisdom modifier at any level.
I was concerned for monk survivability at lower levels so I tried a little hitpoint boost.
Zen Defense: The monk gains a +3 Insight bonus to armor class. At 4th level and every 4 levels thereafter this bonus increases by + 1.
I thought of this because getting double wis bonus to your AC seemed really awkward, and this seemed like a reasonable scale.
| Daniel Chaplik |
Your problem is that it is the MAIN method of character developement and the one used for play-testing and games design. If you use random methods, you just need ONE lucky roll and you have three whacked up stats. In any method, it turns a single racial +2 bonus into three +2 bonuses. So the monk player just assigns his lowest two scores to strength and con, and his highest + racial modifier to Wisdom, and you have the same problem again.
If the "play-testing and game design" was functional in the first place, the monk wouldn't need fixing, therefore the point is moot. "Main" is debatable, unless you can honestly tell me that you've sampled every single gaming table in the world and actually have some sort of research to support the idea. Regardless, main does not mean required - if a player or GM can't fit the rules to the story, and have to fit the story to the rules, then that isn't my concern.
I suppose I fail to share your concern with how many extra bonuses the character gets. The monk, as it is in core, is MAD beyond belief, requiring all but one ability score to function as thematically intended. This mechanic only eliminates two scores from the list, still leaving a three-split need: Dexterity to supplement the class' inherent AC bonus, Wisdom for class features and to supplement STR and CON, and Intelligence to gain the skill points needed to fully capitalize on skill-based mobility in and out of combat. That puts it in line with other special interest martials, such as the Paladin (STR, CON, CHA) and the Magus (STR, INT, CON).
Could you mention one other than all characters having the same score in every attribute with no racial modifiers please? I just found the flaws in everything you have mentioned so far.
The mechanic is an issue, but not for any of the reasons you've brought up.
Really? What can't you get that rely on Strength or Con? Power Attack feat tree (which is meh unless you use a two-handed weapon), and that's about it. Actually, there are not that many feats that rely on strength or constitution. Power Attack is the only common one, and as your unarmed strike counts as a light weapon you can replace it with Piranha Strikes. Other than that, what is there that a monk needs? Not much, many more styles and feats rely on dexterity and wisdom than on strength.
Distance Thrower, and Two-Handed Thrower, for a player rolling up a Monk of the Empty Hand.
The Final Embrace tree, for an NPC grappler or a monstrous PC grappler - and that's three feats, just for that.
My monk allows for some multi-class combinations that were not available before - for example, a monk barbarian is going to want to consider Raging Throw if he wants to explore bull rushing/knock back.
Once I get around to converting the Monk of Many Styles, that will be the only way to get style feats as bonus feats, so that's going to make for all other monks Dragon Style a concern.
Deep Drinker for a Drunken Master.
Elemental Fist, if you aren't playing a Monk of the Four Winds.
Djinni style. Efreeti Style. Marid Style. Shaitan Style.
Fast Drinker, Fast Healer, Fight On.
Okay, I'm bored of this, and only made it through UC and part of the APG. The point is this. While it may be accurate to say there are more feats that rely on DEX or WIS than STR or CON, but as I think I've shown, those that do rely on STR or CON are not part of an inconsiderable list.
There are more people in China than the US, but there aren't four of us sitting in America.
Besides, with +5 hp per die and +5 to hit and damage, and a good AC, standing and hitting things is not such a bad plan!
You should really take a look at the combat example I posted above to get a new perspective on that. There are plenty of creatures that prevent the monk from doing just that.
They have to hit you first, and with the touch AC you can have that won't be easy. You'd have to be careful, maybe make sure you are always carrying a potion of lesser restoration, but that's about it.
Unless of course, you know, the poison isn't on a weapon. How about a gaseous poison? Or poisoned food? Or a poisoned door handle? Or the thousand other ways that a character can find himself exposed to it.
What you should have mentioned is that my monk is normally immune to poisons because of my combination of Purity of Body and Diamond Body. But since some archetypes trade that ability out, that's going to be an issue for some monks.
As far as combat is concerned, better hope you aren't in their threatened space if you're going to go drink it.
| Daniel Chaplik |
So this is my final version of Enlightenment.
Starting at 1st level, the monk may choose to substitute one point of his Wisdom bonus (if any) in place of his Strength and Constitution modifers, if it is higher. At 3rd level, and every two levels thereafter, the amount of Wisdom the monk can include in this substitution raises by one point.
He continues to calculate his lifting and carrying limits by Strength, and qualifies for feats and other character options by his actual Strength and Constitution scores. When wearing armor or equipped with a shield, a monk loses all benefit of his enlightenment. This includes a loss of the appropriate number of hit points.
For example, a 1st level monk with a Strength of 10, a Constituion of 14, and a Wisdom of 16, would only replace his Strength modifier; at 5th level, when he can substitute all of his +3 Wisdom bonus, he would then replace his Constitution modifier as well.
On another note, it has come to my attention that my "It Runs in the Blood" feat makes Fast Drinker obsolete. I think I'll leave it up and let GM's decide which one they want their players to be able to use.
| +5 Toaster |
hmm lets see
Enlightenment:The Monk may choose to substitute his wisdom modifer (to a maximum of half his level) in place of any of his physical ability score modifiers for any class features and effects, with the exception of bonus hit points per level, for which the monk may substitute his full wisdom modifier at any level.
I was concerned for monk survivability at lower levels so I tried a little hitpoint boost.Zen Defense: The monk gains a +3 Insight bonus to armor class. At 4th level and every 4 levels thereafter this bonus increases by + 1.
I thought of this because getting double wis bonus to your AC seemed really awkward, and this seemed like a reasonable scale.
what say you daniel?
edit:nevermind you went in a slightly different direction.| Daniel Chaplik |
+5 Toaster wrote:hmm lets see
Enlightenment:The Monk may choose to substitute his wisdom modifer (to a maximum of half his level) in place of any of his physical ability score modifiers for any class features and effects, with the exception of bonus hit points per level, for which the monk may substitute his full wisdom modifier at any level.
I was concerned for monk survivability at lower levels so I tried a little hitpoint boost.Zen Defense: The monk gains a +3 Insight bonus to armor class. At 4th level and every 4 levels thereafter this bonus increases by + 1.
I thought of this because getting double wis bonus to your AC seemed really awkward, and this seemed like a reasonable scale.what say you daniel?
edit:nevermind you went in a slightly different direction.
Well, I did seriously consider your proposal. In fact, you kind of went into my past mindset, to be honest. When I first started working on this project, I had actually intended for Enlightenment to affect all ability scores. Within a few revisions and additions, it made the monk's AC bonus work weird, so I threw it out.
Danial Chaplik,
your current enlightenment proposal still seems wonky. i had another idea that may help:you may substitute up to half your monk level for the appropriate ability score modifier to {certain checks} so long as the bonus does not exceed your Wisdom modifier.
To be honest, I decided from the start that I wanted to shy away from writing out a list of specific checks and rolls that it affects. For one part, I've got a page-count issue to work with - I've got kind of an OCD thing when I'm writing up a document; if my paragraphs don't end cleanly on the bottom of a page, and even one sentence spills on to the next, I lose my s!&* and start editing and revising my wordage to make it fit again. xD
The real issue is that I want to make it clear from the get-go that Enlightenment exists to fix the monk's anger issues. While I could achieve the same effect another way, it just felt that being direct about what is actually being swapped around was the best option for that.
On another note, I do have to modify my write-up for Uncanny Initiative, a feature of the Weapon Adept archetype. It seems that by omitting a line I had meant to include, I created an infinite "I-Go-First" loop among weapon adepts.
| Daniel Chaplik |
So, I said that I was done tweaking Enlightenment.
Apparently, I lied.
I spent some time thinking about something that I had mentioned earlier - that I wanted to use the Canny Defense feature of the Duelist as a baseline for what Enlightenment should do.
So, I've tweaked it again. Heh. I feel that the new mechanic helps to ease off the anger issues of the monk, while not completely supplanting the role of two other ability scores. It also helps - in my opinion - to better scale the bonus of enlightenment.
For example, a 1st level monk with a Wisdom of 17 would gain a +1 enhancement bonus to both Strength and Constitution. This bonus improves to +2 when the monk reaches 3rd level, and +3 at 5th level. If the monk chose to improve his Wisdom score at 4th level, then the enhancement bonus of his enlightenment would also improve to +4 when he attains 9th level.
| Daniel Chaplik |
QUINGGONG MONK
The quinggong monk is a master of his ki, using it to perform superhuman stunts or even blast opponents with supernatural energy. Some achieve their power over ki through extreme discipline, while others attain this power by accidentally or intentionally rare herbs or strange mystical fruits, and a few are gifted these abilities by a dying quinggong master. A quinggong monk has the following class features.
All of these alternative ki powers have a minimum monk level requirement to select them. A quinggong monk who does not meet this requirement cannot select that ki power; however, a higher-level monk may select a lower-level power in place of a higher-level one.
Most ki powers require that the monk spend ki points, and the exact amount is included beside each alternative ki power in the list below. Ki powers that cost 0 ki power do not require the monk to have any ki points in his pool to use that ability.
The saving throw against a monk’s ki power, if any, is equal to 10 + half his class level + his Wisdom bonus.
Acrobatic Steps (1 ki point)
augury (1 ki point)
barkskin (self only, 1 ki point)
Deny Death (0 ki points)
feather step (self only, 1 ki[/] point)
High Jump (monk ability)
[i]hydraulic push (1 ki point)
ki arrow (1 ki[/i point)
[i]Ki Stand (0 ki points)
message (1 ki point)
Power Attack (1 ki point)
Quick Draw (1 ki point)
scorching ray (2 ki points)
Throw Anything (1 ki point)
true strike (self only, 1 ki point)
6th Level Ki Powers
cloak of winds (self only, 2 ki points)
Deep Impact (monk ability, 1 ki point)
gaseous form (self only, 1 ki point)
Heroic Recovery (1 ki point)
hydraulic torrent (2 ki points)
remove disease (2 ki points)
Sidestep (1 ki point)
Snatch Arrows* (1 ki point)
Spring Attack (1 ki point)
9th Level Ki Powers
Diamond Body (monk ability)
dragon’s breath (2 ki points)
Gliding Steps (1 ki point)
neutralize poison (3 ki points)
poison (2 ki points)
restoration (self only, 2 ki points)
share memory (0 ki points)
silk to steel (1 ki point)
Spider Step (1 ki point)
Whirlwind Attack (2 ki points)
12th Level Ki Powers
Abundant Step (monk ability, 2 ki points)
discordant blast (2 ki points)
Greater Bull Rush (2 ki points)
Greater Disarm (2 ki points)
Greater Feint (2 ki points)
Greater Sunder (2 ki points)
Improved Blind-Fight (1 ki point)
ki leech (0 ki points)
Lunge (1 ki point)
shadow step (1 ki point)
spit venom (2 ki points)
Step Up and Strike (2 ki points)
Wind Stance (2 ki points)
15th Level Ki Powers
battlemind link (4 ki points)
Elemental Fists (2 ki points)
Improvised Weapon Mastery (2 ki points)
Ki Throw (2 ki points)
Punishing Kick (2 ki points)
Quivering Palm (monk ability, 2 ki points)
shadow walk (3 ki points)
18th Level Ki Powers
blood crow strike (2 ki points)
Cloud Step (3 ki points)
cold ice strike (3 ki points)
Disarming Strike (2 ki points)
Improved Ki Throw (2 ki points)
ki shout (3 ki points)
sonic thrust (2 ki points)
Timeless Body (monk ability)
20th Level Ki Powers
Bleeding Critical (3 ki points)
Greater Blind-Fight (2 ki points)
Improved Vital Strike (2 ki points)
Lightning Stance (3 ki points)
Penetrating Strike (2 ki points)
strangling hair (3 ki points)