Beast Rider Cavalier in PFS - Questions about Combat Training, Tricks, Replacing Mounts, etc

[Belryan]

I'm building a Halfling Cavalier, following the Beast Rider archetype for PFS. Half these questions are PFRPG general questions, and half are PFS-specific.

1. The Beast Rider gets Exotic Mount, which replaces Mount.

Mount wrote:

A cavalier’s bond with his mount is strong, with the pair learning to anticipate each other’s moods and moves. Should a cavalier’s mount die, the cavalier may find another mount to serve him after 1 week of mourning. This new mount does not gain the link, evasion, devotion, or improved evasion special abilities until the next time the cavalier gains a level.

However, Exotic Mount says nothing about the replacement of the mount. Is it treated like replacing a standard Cavalier's mount, or like replacing a standard Druid Animal companion?

Also, the Beast Rider gets to constantly upgrade / pick new animal companions if he wants.

Beast Rider wrote:

Each time the beast rider increases in level, he can choose to select a new, more impressive mount better suited to his increased power.

.

If he does so, does each one he picks get the link, evasion, devotion, and improved evasion special abilities, since this "mourning" period is only mentioned under the standard Cavalier Mount, which is entirely replaced by Exotic Mount, which doesn't mention anything about mourning?

2. When a Cavalier or Beast Rider gets a new mount, do they always start Combat Trained?

Beast Rider wrote:

At 1st level, a beast rider forms a bond with a strong, loyal companion that permits him to ride it as a mount. This mount functions as a druid's animal companion, using the beast rider’s level as his effective druid level. The animal chosen as a mount must be large enough to carry the beast rider (Medium or Large for a Small character; Large or Huge for a Medium character). The beast rider does not take an armor check penalty on Ride checks while riding his mount. The mount is always considered combat trained, and begins play with Endurance as a bonus feat. A beast rider’s mount does not gain the share spells special ability.

By Combat trained, do they mean the general purpose combat training that consists of 6 tricks? If so, that means I can't train any other tricks unless it has an upgraded intelligence, correct, because Animals with an Int of 2 are limited to knowing 6 tricks.

So does this mean if I get a new mount, it always knows those six tricks, or only the first mount? If the later, it kinda defeats the purpose of the Beast Rider's ability to take new mounts, if I can only train one trick per scenario.

2. Can I actually ride a bipedal dinosaur?

Beast Rider wrote:

Small-sized beast riders can choose a pony or wolf mount at 1st level. At 4th level, a Small beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, boar, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, mastodon, megaloceros, riding dog, giant snapping turtle, triceratops, or tyrannosaurus. At 7th level, he can also choose a dinosaur (deinonychus or velociraptor)./

Quote:

Beast Rider wrote:

In addition, a 7th-level or higher Medium beast rider can select any creature whose natural size is Large or Huge, provided that creature is normally available as a Medium-sized animal companion at 7th level (like a bear). To generate statistics for such a mount, apply the following modifications:

Size Large
Ability Scores Str +2, Dex –2, Con +2;
Increase the damage of each of the mount’s natural attacks by one die size.
A beast rider cannot choose a mount that is not capable of bearing his weight, that has fewer than four legs, or that has a fly speed (although the GM may allow mounts with a swim speed in certain environments).

Does this apply to all Beast Riders, or is it specifically modifying the Medium beast rider ability to pick "any creature whose natural size is Large?" Because it seems to contradict the ability to ride a bipedal dinosaur.

[Akerlof]

1.) I'm not sure I know what you mean when you ask "However, Exotic Mount says nothing about the replacement of the mount. Is it treated like replacing a standard Cavalier's mount, or like replacing a standard Druid Animal companion?"

Do you mean, if the mount dies does the replacement mount take penalties until you level up?

In that case, I think the answer is Yes, since Exotic Mount explicitly states "his mount functions as a druid's animal companion, using the beast rider's level as his effective druid level." You get the good with the bad.

1.b.) Do you take penalties when you replace your mount at a level up?

I think that's a No, since the Exotic Mount feature explicitly says "Each time the beast rider increases in level, he can choose to select a new, more impressive mount better suited to his increased power," with no comments on drawbacks. This is a case of the specific (change mount on level up) overrides the general (mounts work like druid animal companions.)

2.) Do new (upgraded) mounts start combat trained?

According the the FAQ, replacements for dead animal companions only come knowing their bonus tricks, and you need to teach them any extra tricks at a rate of 1 trick per rank in handle animal per scenario. The wording of the FAQ is "Newly summoned animal companions begin play knowing a number of tricks equal to the bonus tricks granted based on your druid level. All other tricks require the use of Handle Animal to train the new animal companion as normal."

I've seen that interpreted as "every animal companion after your first come into play not knowing any tricks other than bonus tricks." That's the safest assumption. Once you hit 6th level it's not going to be a problem since you can combat train your mount at the start of a session regardless, and by 4th level you can train 4 plus use the always known 2 bonus feats to do the same.

I personally think a new mount that comes in through a class feature upgrading the mount should come in trained, but I can't point to any FAQs or posts to support that opinion. So I gotta go with the wording of the FAQ.

2.b.) "Combat Trained" means it has the 6 tricks for the general purpose combat training already trained. BUT, since it is an animal companion, it comes into play with 1 bonus trick, for a total of 7 tricks, and you can choose that. Even when you replace the mount, the bonus tricks are always trained and it gets more as you level and more if you add intelligence. Also, you can retrain it for new tricks if you want to.

3.) Can you ride a bipedal dinosaur?

You can use the list of mounts listed in the Beast Rider archetype, no more and no less. If that list contains 2 legged mounts, you're golden. You don't have GM approval for anything else, unless you get a boon on a chronical sheet or a new additional resource specifically says "This animal is a legal mount for cavaliers." The only thing I know of that does the latter is the Beast Rider cavalier archetype, so you're stuck with the small rider list from there:

Quote:

Small-sized beast riders can choose a pony or wolf mount at 1st level. At 4th level, a Small beast rider can also choose an allosaurus, ankylosaurus, arsinoitherium, aurochs, bison, boar, brachiosaurus, elephant, glyptodon, hippopotamus, mastodon, megaloceros, riding dog, snapping turtle (giant), triceratops, or tyrannosaurus. At 7th level, he can also choose a dinosaur (deinonychus or velociraptor).

So, putting it all together:

At 4th level you can start riding a two legged Tyrannosaurus, it will have all the mount features of a 4th level druid companion (no waiting!) plus it has endurance as a bonus feat. It will know two bonus tricks but you will have to train it to get it combat trained. Since you can have 4 ranks in handle animal at 4th level, you can finish off the combat training at the start of the first session you get the monster.

[Belryan]

Ah right, I missed this part of the FAQ:

FAQ wrote:

If the character replaces the animal companion for any reason, the new animal starts with no tricks known, save for bonus tricks granted based on the PC's effective druid level. Once per scenario, you may attempt to train the animal companion a number of times equal to the number of ranks you have in the Handle Animal skill. Each success allows you to teach the animal a single trick; a failed attempt counts against the total number of training attempts allowed per scenario, and you may not attempt to teach the same trick until the next scenario. Alternatively, you may train one animal for a single purpose as long as you have enough ranks in Handle Animal to train the animal in each trick learned as part of that purpose. You may take 10 on Handle Animal checks to teach an animal companion tricks.

However, for the Cavalier penalties of having a mount die, that's only listed under the standard Mount Class Ability, but not under Exotic Mount, which replaces Mount. If a Druid replaces it's animal companion, it automatically gets Link, plus Evasion and whatnot if it is a high enough level. I'm not trying to weasel my way out of it, but I'm wondering if it was intended to be a bonus for being a Beast Rider (the big penalty being you can't use Horse Master if you multiclass).

[Serum]

Quote:

The mount is always considered combat trained, and begins play with Endurance as a bonus feat.

I believe combat trained refers to the animal not treating hoofs as secondary attacks. This is generally referenced with horses (as you can buy a horse, and you can buy a combat-trained horse, the second having hoof attacks as primary attacks). I don't know of any other mount-type monster that also has something like the Docile (Ex) special feature, though.

[SCPRedMage]

Serum wrote:

I believe combat trained refers to the animal not treating hoofs as secondary attacks. This is generally referenced with horses (as you can buy a horse, and you can buy a combat-trained horse, the second having hoof attacks as primary attacks). I don't know of any other mount-type monster that also has something like the Docile (Ex) special feature, though.

Actually, it refers to the "Combat Training" general purpose training, listed under the Handle Animal skill.

Core Rulebook, page 98 wrote:

Combat Training (DC 20): An animal trained to bear a rider into combat knows the tricks attack, come, defend, down, guard, and heel. Training an animal for combat riding takes 6 weeks. You may also “upgrade” an animal trained for riding to one trained for combat by spending 3 weeks and making a successful DC 20 Handle Animal check. The new general purpose and tricks completely replace the animal’s previous purpose and any tricks it once knew. Many horses and riding dogs are trained in this way.

[Serum]

If you're treating Exotic Mount (ex) as a complete replacement for Mount (ex), then you can't get a new mount until you level. That means if your current mount dies, you're stuck unless you resurrect it or gain a level. There's your penalty. It's either that, or the standard Mount (Ex) description applies, and the writers forgot the "Otherwise, Exotic Mount (Ex) functions like Mount (Ex)" clause that many of the other archetype abilities have.

SCPRedMage is correct, and Docile refers to needing Combat Training for the horse to not treat hooves as secondary attacks. My mistake.