Hello,
I am thinking about changing the location of the AP (to a homebrew world, not in Golarion), but the geography I have chosen does not support a nation in the locale of Mivon. Pittax is okay, the are on the edge of the great frontier forest, just as our heroes will be, but I just don't see a way of justifying Mivon's existence. (I have dispensed with the whole Swordlord business, so I don't need anywhere for them to flee).
I only have the first three books of the AP, but I have read several campaign journals and advice threads, so I think I can get away without Mivon, but I just wanted outright confirmation.
Thanks in advance,
Tauric
Yep, Mivon is window dressing unless you decide otherwise.
If you remove Mivon, you will need a certain amount of explanation for the 'Contest'. Not a great deal, but a certain amount. That is really the only adjustment necessary in my opinion.
You can probably get away with skipping straight from Vordakai to the Tiger Lords and Armag, yeah. Most of the Mivon scene is to point your party toward where the Barbarians came from, as well as giving them a corrupt regime to overthrow if they want.
You'll probably want to use something to pad the time between for levels/XP purposes (unless you aren't using XP) with side quests or kingdom-related business, as you're expected to gain a couple of levels at least while dealing with Mivon before you take off after Armag.
Thanks for the confirmation. I was planning on putting Fellnight Queen and Bloodsworn Vale into the lineup at some point (pre- or post-VV)(I was thinking that the story of building a road through the forest would be a good way to establish ties with Varnhold), so that would pad the character levels a bit.
The only thing I would say is that given the trade routes the parties are trying to open up, Mivon is actually the best candidate as the major trading partner. Mivon as such doesn't play much of a part, but if you don't have a nation down there, your players may question where the trade is coming from.
I'm with Thrund, if you are into political elements int he game Mivon is useful.
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My campaign has gone so far outside the original sandbox that I basically had to put that sandbox inside another sandbox in an enormous sandbox its like Inception...
[spoiler] Brevoy's civil war is well under way. I had made a side trek to stop it from happening but the players didn't feel they should get involved.
They also interacted with Varnhold so much, I couldn't let them die. Once Brevoy's war started, Restoc seceded a few months in. Varnhold annexed them (seeing as the restov Aldori prefer to be the power behind the throne) and quite a bit of surrounding land. Surtova is too busy fighting rebels to effectively deal with that but said he'll take care of it asap.
So the party's kingdom is currently between Varnhold (and the Restov Aldori) and Mivon (and the Mivon Aldori) and they're nervous about when these distant cousins might reunite the family (which won't ever happen... Too much cultural drift between them in the last century but the players don't know it.
Mivon has stayed quiet but its about to move from dressing to stage front soon...
My group won't be into the political stuff all that much. They do seem very keen on the killing monsters in the wilderness aspect, and the kingdom building.
The storyline I'm running is loosely based on English history: Choral syncs as William, the Stolen Lands become the Welsh March. Irovetti is a Gealic Prince. I had originally planned on having Mivon be another princedom, but I wanted to use the Old Margreve, so I decided that the Narlmarches were a weak extention of same, with the heart of the wood being where Mivon currently is.
If anyone has read "Last Light of the Sun", I was greatly inspired in my choice by the spirit wood, basically a great forest where the Fair Folk and old gods live, and humans are not welcome.
You don't need Mivon as a Trading partner, you have Pitax and Bloodsworn Vale for that. However, not having Mivon in place reduces the effectiveness of using the River Sellen as a trade route, and if you want the growth of a city (all those cool toys that turn up in the markets and business for all those people) you need some trade.
When you get book 4, you will see that the old Pitax was run by a bunch of trade houses, and they are still there in a minor role. One of the possible solutions from that module is to that the PCs encourage some of the trade houses to take control of Pitax again. So a decent road from Fort Drelev can open up a trade route through Pitax.
Bloodsworn Vale is all about establishing a trade route through a mountain range - You could extend the Tors slightly and run it through to whatever you put behind them. Plenty of mountains to play with around the Wesh Marches :)
I think I would probably probably leave Kamelands between Tuskwater and Varnhold - but expand the bottom to the Narlmarches Eastwards across the bottom of the Map. If you were to make the initial settlement into Bloodsworn vale another contract from Brevoy, it could be another type of 'save the settlement' mission.
Especially if the party need that trade route ....
Ahh - I just re-read your last paragraph.
Book 6 is definitely on my to-buy list, once the funds are available.
Would it work if, instead of making the fey presence in the Margreve obvious, I just play up the Aura of Rust, and the moving trails, and the un-taming of animals? That way the players won't ever see a fairy, but they will have a huge disincentive to continue into the forest. Especially if, whenever they try to go into the forest, I have a large monster emerge to attack their cities?
Another question, how important is it that Thousand Breaths is located over by Pittax? Could it successfully be moved to Mivon's current location?
On the one hand, there's no absolute need for it to be by Pitax especially. Nyrissa doesn't NEED to be in Irovetti's back yard to execute her plans.
On the other, moving it closer to the party may prompt them to investigate it more sooner into the story. They might start poking around N's home turf before they're really ready to.
@ Tauric, that's called railroading :P
Simply tell your people that the adventure doesn't stretch in that direction. Worked for my peeps.
Book 6 is definitely on my to-buy list, once the funds are available.
Would it work if, instead of making the fey presence in the Margreve obvious, I just play up the Aura of Rust, and the moving trails, and the un-taming of animals? That way the players won't ever see a fairy, but they will have a huge disincentive to continue into the forest. Especially if, whenever they try to go into the forest, I have a large monster emerge to attack their cities?
Another question, how important is it that Thousand Breaths is located over by Pittax? Could it successfully be moved to Mivon's current location?
I'll be adding a thread about incorperating the tales of the old margreve, fellknight queen, carnival of tears, and some other sources fairly soon...
@ Rickmeister: I can see where some (my players included) would think that, but looking at the first two adventures, it's basically waves of monsters coming out of the woodwork to attack the city anyway. Well, okay, the Stag Lord is just kinda there, but then there is the trolls, and the owlbear, Howl of the North Wind, and all the little encounters.
Since somewhere the text says that Nyrissa is directing all these monsters agains the PCs, why not have it be because she doesn't want the PCs getting too close to her?
@ GM Solspiral: I look forward to that thread.
Again, this is all just planning on my part, I have some months before I have to solidify anything (and I could always just toss it all and play in Golarion).
I do appreciate all the advice, this will be the first AP I've DM'd, and the first time at that end of the table in about 8 years.
Mivon is probably as far away from the PCs as the original location of 1000 breaths, so it shouldn't do any real harm. :)
You might want to read the sticky thread on book six - you will at least gain a flavour of its content.
JohnB, I haven't read that thread yet, I've only been reading the sticky threads as I get the books, to see what is written, then what the community has done with it.
But I suppose it wouldn't hurt to read ahead, even if I'm not completely sure what everyone will be talking about.
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I'd say Mivon adds something, but removing it also gives you a great frontier feeling. I might add in more scattered Baronies of various March lords that the players sometimes come across. (Like Thornkeep) But then I like what settlements add to the game. Whehter its that fringe religious viewpoint, or its Robber Barons, legitimate military presence, a river trading port. Whatever makes society varied.