I have heard the opinion, and pretty much agree, that witches make more sense thematically to cast on wisdom. So thinking on this I wondered what the repercussions would be. Obviously higher Will saves, better perception, and monk dip synergy would all be benefits. In return they would lose...focusing on skill stuff (points, knowledge skills, etc). My question is this, is it worth changing the witch to wisdom, aka do the benefits mechanically far outweigh the idea thematically?
it doesn't really make much of a difference. Really the best reason not to is that prepared arcane casters are always Int casters. Wis is only divine. So if you switch to Divine then you don't have arcane spell failure, but that is the only real issue.
For a pure witch it wouldn't be that much of a difference, really. But a Wisdom-Witch probably opens up some interesting multi-class options.
For a pure witch it wouldn't be that much of a difference, really. But a Wisdom-Witch probably opens up some interesting multi-class options.
right and i mentioned the monk dip, though i don't know if it's actually that bad.
@jb i know about the original paradigm involving casting stats, but paizo has already made exceptions, like paladins and Sage/Empyreal sorcerers, so that didn't really facter into my internal debate. the idea was to make the witch into a wisdom based arcane caster.
with wis to ac AND hex's does the monk/witch seem really powerful? to be honest i don't see that as worsen than empyreal/monk. new thought, this would allow synergy in druid/witch combos. i wonder if that will be problematic, gonna look into it. if anyone notices a warning sign with that combo feel free to post.
I have switched witches primary ability from Intelligence to Wisdom. No problems involved yet. However, it is worth to note that the player decided to invest remaining points in Intelligence score (25 point build, Str 8, Int 16, Wis 20) which helped her with Spellcraft checks.
She considered multiclassing into monk, to the point where the character actually started training with one but later rejected idea finding it not matching her feeling about the character and flunked the training in-game (which, incidentally, made true the dwarven monk's prediction that she lacks discipline and focus).
I have switched witches primary ability from Intelligence to Wisdom. No problems involved yet. However, it is worth to note that the player decided to invest remaining points in Intelligence score (25 point build, Str 8, Int 16, Wis 20) which helped her with Spellcraft checks.
She considered multiclassing into monk, to the point where the character actually started training with one but later rejected idea finding it not matching her feeling about the character and flunked the training in-game (which, incidentally, made true the dwarven monk's prediction that she lacks discipline and focus).
hah! that's hilarious. But did your players ever experiment with druid/witch combos by any chance? i am curious about hexes and wildshape in particular.
Nope and probably never will. I intend to limit campaign to 10-12th level so there will be hardly chance of getting enough of both classes to be a viable project.
|
The Green Ronin and Arcana Unearthed Witch classes were both Wisdom-based, and that really seemed to work, thematically, so it was a bit of a surprise to see the APG Witch based off of Intelligence anyway.
The only considerations I see right off;
A Wisdom-based Witch will naturally have a higher Will save than an Intelligence-based Witch, but that's already the case with other Wisdom-based casting classes with a good Will save, such as the Cleric and Druid, both of which have more HD, better armor and, arguably, better spell lists (and for the Druid, better class abilities).
The Witch having quite a few Int-based skills, like Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft and (potentially) Craft skills and Linguistics, would tend to encourage even a Wisdom-based Witch to avoid dumping Intelligence. A Wisdom-based Witch might have a dire lack of skill points, but that's a burden she shares with the Cleric, Fighter, etc.
Thematically, neither Intelligence nor Wisdom fit perfectly for a Pathfinder Witch, which derives her power from a pact made with an otherworldly patron, whose agent she entreats every single day for her arcane ability (none of which seems to have anything to do with Intelligence or Wisdom). The obvious spellcasting stat for such a character would be Charisma, to represent attracting that patron in the first place, and interacting with its representative (her familiar). So, as long as one is considering opening up a Witch to using Wisdom as a base casting stat (and one that governs the effectiveness of her Hexes), might as well go all the way and have Charisma-based Witches as well!
|
I don't see any big thematic obstacles to witches casting on Wisdom or Charisma. Actually I think Charisma might be a great fit, it allows you to do a lot more with the concept of witches as scary/seductive. Add to that the fact that many witch powers are mind-affecting and Charisma doesn't look strange at all to me.
While you might gain a bit more oomph from Wis-Will or multiclassing, in general witches aren't very multiclass-friendly, because Hexes and spellcasting would develop poorly. So in terms of power gain I think that's balanced on the whole.
The main issue I foresee is skill points: as a class that gets only 2+ skill points, switching away from Intelligence is going to hurt a bit.
I can see your point, but I also look at where the witch is drawing her power from, in this case that is their patron. I have always seen charisma casting as internal power, int casting as learned power, and wisdom as power drawn from an external source. I plan on trying it with various multiclass combinations as NPCs to put it to the test.