So, for those that have not read the books/ 2ed Ad&d adventure.....a collective of 5 evil power groups work together to create an artificial person to control and send out into the world to complete various task they want done. the controlled person is compelled to complete the tasks via a super geas spell in that manifest in the form of a Azure tattoo. Now I'm currently running the Jade Regent AP and I was planning on using this as fuel for adventures after they complete the ad or as needed for fill xp(as i have 6 player in the AP). I have the power groups picked out and decided to talk the idea over with the player I was thinking of using the tattoo on so that I didn't just drop a super plot hammer on him. My thought was to replace his character with an exact copy of his current character and give him the stats of the "novels" main character....all 17's....and not allow him any ability increases (as he would now be a construct). He seemed interested in the idea up till the ability score thing. Part of me sees his point as he would be losing 2 points of Dex. here is a look at his old stats V.S. what his new stats would be.
old
- Str: 12
- Dex: 19
- Con: 14
- Int: 15
- Wis: 10
- Cha: 8
New
- Str: 17
- Dex: 17
- Con: 17
- Int: 17
- Wis: 17
- Cha: 17
He felt that it would be better if he was allowed to keep raising his Dex score. Now part of my plan and I have all ready kind of set this up is that he just found out his father had been a Red Mantis Assassin at one time and one of the power groups that set up this hole thing was going to be part of a demon cult that wants him to kill high ranking Red Mantis operatives...this would have given him the Charisma to get into that prestige class (also something he doesn't like for his character). Part the reason behind my whole train of thought was that for the past month and a half he has been complaining that given the build he has done for this character, was that he saw nothing that he liked after 9th level. I asked him why is his character still with the party at this point....he replied "to get money".
So My question is
- 1: is it to much if I never let him get an ability increase for leveling if he agrees to the idea?
- 2: Should I even waste any more time trying to keep his character tied to the AP and beyond if all he is there for is money?
As this got moved from advice to here I guess I'll have to give it a little bump to get noticed.
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I remember playing the computer game, and I remember playing through most of the module as well.
I also remember the tattoos as being a tremendous source of frustration. In the table top game I played in, the azure bonds caused so much frustration in the players that they revolted and basically kick the GM out of the game.
I remember this plot device came from a time in module design where the players would take part in a story and help the NPCs succeed. That style of adventure design has fallen out of favor and you don't see it much any more. I remember complaints about such adventures being "rail roads". But I guess "the Jade Regent" falls in that category.
My advice would be don't use the azure bonds....I had a terrible experience with them.
Would someone please correct the spelling of the thread title? Its making me giggle.
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I ran the module back when it came out, and unlike ElyasRavenwood, neither the players nor myself had a bad experience with this adventure. However, that being said, gamers today tend to not like having control of their character taken away from them (even for short periods of time). So I would caution you about running something like this and to make it ABSOLULTLY clear to the player(s) that there are going to be times that they will have zero control of their character's actions...
But I have to ask...
Why would you change the PC's stats, or make him a construct? I mean, while it is true that Alias had all 17's for her stats; she was a construct from the start... The module did not change the stats for the PCs (whom also were given the controlling tattoos, and retained their humanity) and it did not affect the adventure...
Also, keep in mind that a 17 in 2nd edition is not the same as a 17 in Pathfinder (the bonuses were MUCH lower in 2nd edition).
@ Digitalelf my thoughts where that the evil groups replace the PC with an optimized version...thus the all 17's. That being said I originally posted this in the advice section not because I was wondering on how to convert it, but more about the last two questions in the original post. The issue was that I took the time to talk with the player that had been complaining that he really didn't see his character growing past 9th lvl, as he would have all the feats he needed to max out his combat trick. I was thinking of using this to fuel a few adventures after the group has finished the Jade Regent AP.
The player seemed ok with the idea of replacing all of his below 17 scores with 17's but didn't like the 2 point lose in his Dex & that I was not going to allow him to get any more ability score increases from that point on. After more of what seemed to be whining about other players being able to increase their scores and having to use magic items to increase his which could be targeted by dispel magic, I ended our conversation. I then made the Original post.
Maybe make it to where he gets the increases to all scores but gets them a level late (with the exception of the Level 20 Stat Increase).
@ Azaelas Fayth: Take a look and the amount of over all increase he would be getting to his ability scores....( it's a +24)....that is 19 more than the rest of the players are getting....making that kind of agreement is just plain unfair to the rest of my players.
The game mechanic with the tattoos is that the player can fight the urges of the geas if they make a will save at a -6. If they make that save and expose themselves to the same geas trigger -5, and it keeps lowering till there is no more penalty at that point. Using his ability scores as they stand now he will never be able to make the first one, let alone the rest.
The thing is If he is becoming this version after say level 12 he would only get 2 stat increases.
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If the player makes the decision and agrees to the changes, IMO, he should have no complaint as to not being able to raise his DEX any further. However, if that is his sticking point for not agreeing to the concept, then I would say take the offer off the table and present it to another player that will be more agreeable to the terms.
Bear in mind that I say this as a card carrying "You kids get off of my lawn!" grognard, but I think that this player has no real argument here, as his character would be getting a great deal more benefit than loss (I mean 5 out of 6 substantial stat increases at the cost of a mere 2 points on ONE stat)...
I say, hold your ground and let him take the deal or not... His loss if he doesn't...
And as for keeping him in the AP, I would say yeah, let him finish it out if he wants and is enjoying himself...