With an Amulet of Mighty Fists what counts as "the weapon"?

[Rycaut]

Specifically in Ultimate Equipment there are some really flavorful abilities that at first seem rather weak in most cases.

i.e. Quenching

Quote:

This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons.

A quenching weapon thrust into a non-magical fire of Medium size or smaller extinguishes it. When used against a creature of the fire subtype, it deals an extra 1d6 points of damage. The wielder of a quenching weapon receives a +2 competence bonus on saving throws against fire-based effects, and the weapon itself is immune to fire damage.

I'm fairly sure this can be an enchantment in an Amulet of Mighty Fists - it is melee weapons only and doesn't have any other restrictions that would prevent it (i.e. no limbs being thrown etc)

But note that last line "the weapon itself is immune to fire damage" - hence my question - what counts as "the weapon" in this case? (or other similar abilities for other energy types)

[kantas]

I would rule that your natural weapons, gain the immune to fire quality

so... your claws (but not hands), your bite (but not face).

The portion of your body that you use to deal damage is immune to fire, however the part of your body attached to the natural weapon is not immune to fire.

I don't think that any GM would allow you to say "ok, you have quenching so your whole body being attached to your natural weapons is now immune to fire."

I could see a GM saying "Your claws are immune to fire due to the AoMF, so if you wanted to reach into the forge to pull out the sword that's being worked on, go ahead"

cause it wouldn't be game breaking. but Aside from those limited RP effects, I wouldn't allow the AoMF's to allow for fire immunity.

The +2 bonus vs fire based effects would of course still function, because you can use your weapons to shield some of the effect. but not all of it. in the same way that you use a Sword with that effect to attempt to deflect some of the incoming fireball.

[Benchak the Nightstalker]

Here's how I'd run it:

So long as your hand/foot/whatever is making an attack, it's a weapon, and thus immune to fire. That way you can punch a fire elemental in the face and not worry about taking damage.

If you're not making an at attack, then you're not being a weapon, and no immunity for you. If you and that fire elemental finish your boxing match and decide to shake hands, just to show there's no hard feelings--ouch, horrible burns.

I'd probably also make allowances for when you're intentionally shoving your limbs into fires to extinguish them, as per the weapon ability.

That seems like a fair way to adjudicate this ability (which I agree is very fun and flavorful)

[blackbloodtroll]

Okay, but what if you want to put out the fire, by punching it?

[Benchak the Nightstalker]

Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:

Here's how I'd run it:

So long as your hand/foot/whatever is making an attack, it's a weapon, and thus immune to fire. That way you can punch a fire elemental in the face and not worry about taking damage.

If you're not making an at attack, then you're not being a weapon, and no immunity for you. If you and that fire elemental finish your boxing match and decide to shake hands, just to show there's no hard feelings--ouch, horrible burns.

I'd probably also make allowances for when you're intentionally shoving your limbs into fires to extinguish them, as per the weapon ability.

That seems like a fair way to adjudicate this ability (which I agree is very fun and flavorful)

[blackbloodtroll]

So, same deal for Neutralizing, and Thawing enchantments?

How would it function with the Impervious enchantment?

[Dabbler]

I think Benchak has the right of it. Your unarmed strikes count as the weapon, when they are being used as the weapon.

[Umbranus]

I would rule that you don't get damaged if you punch a fire elemental or other creature that deals fire damage when attacked.
But you would still be dealt damage (from the fire) if the elemental hits you.

[Benchak the Nightstalker]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

So, same deal for Neutralizing, and Thawing enchantments?

How would it function with the Impervious enchantment?

Thawing and Neutralizing, yeah, I'd probably run those the same way (though it's late and I didn't read over them too closely).

Impervious, I'd probably say it doesn't do anything for you. Unless you're a plant or a construct, you're not going to be made of metal or wood, so the first half is right out. If you are made of metal or wood, I'd let you punch things that rust, rot, or warp you on contact without being rusted, rotted, or warped.
You already don't receive a hardness or additional hit points from an amulet of mighty fists, so doubling 0 leaves you with 0.
Finally, with the exception of certain creatures (the hydra most notably), sunder attacks and break checks don't really apply to unarmed strikes or natural attacks.

If you really had your heart set on it, I might houserule it to reduce the damage you take from hitting people or objects that deal physical damage--such as those using the thorn body spell.