Goblin Squad Member
|
I am not familiar with this Diplomacy system. Can you give me a link to a site explaining it?
I'm not sure it will really be helpful, but here's a pretty good explanation: Vanguard Diplomacy Guide (Basics).
As has been said, it never lived up to it's potential. The "vision" for it was that it would be a "third way" of playing MMOs, complementing Adventuring and Crafting. The general idea is that your character would level up as a Diplomat and be able to make discoveries and influence events in the world. The reality was a really crappy card game.
Since there's really not a good model of this kind of thing anywhere, and since it's (probably) not something that Ryan's been dreaming about doing right for years, I'm not sure I'd try to push them to make it happen in PFO unless we can Crowdforge a fairly simple but really engaging system.
If we were to try to Crowdforge this, I would think we would start with everything cool anyone can think of related to Perform, Diplomacy, Intimidate and related skills from PFRPG. Then the real trick is figuring out some way to standardize those. Then figure out an intuitive UI that lets the player engage those skills in a meaningful way. That's not trivial.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
The way it worked in vanguard was it provided different buffs depending on which way players pushed it using the diplomacy system, it was a cool concept that didn't really live up to its potential, it would be cool if it could be used as a way to influence things like extra guards, faster construction/upgrades, stronger ties to specific gods, maybe rare resources that can't be gained other ways such as silk and spices from far off places
Goblinworks Executive Founder
|
I was thinking that a married couple that is currently working together would get a buff. Mechanically backing in character relationships in general sounds like a good idea.
Adding a mechanical buff for marriage would not have the effect you are looking for. It would cause a lot of players to "marry" some just to get the buff. Once there is a mechanical benefit to something that is mostly about RP it will lose most of its RP value. This would be specially true in PFO where it seems to be shaping itself into a very group centric game, meaning solo players will have it rough as an adventure.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I think the jury is out on wether this will be an RP-haven or same ol' same ol'.
I think this game will surely be more effective than WoW if it doesn't litter itself with pop- culture references and outright immersion breakers like WoW did. I think by sticking with things like their stated naming policies, and creating mechanics that encourage immersive behavior they can attract a lot of RPers and turn anti-RPers off to this game at the same time.
The largest crowd will always be the RP-neutral crowd but a lot of them respect serious RPers and even enjoy RP events once in awhile. As long as it doesn't degenerate into 50 Shades of Pathfinder.
I was thinking that a married couple that is currently working together would get a buff. Mechanically backing in character relationships in general sounds like a good idea.Adding a mechanical buff for marriage would not have the effect you are looking for. It would cause a lot of players to "marry" some just to get the buff. Once there is a mechanical benefit to something that is mostly about RP it will lose most of its RP value. This would be specially true in PFO where it seems to be shaping itself into a very group centric game, meaning solo players will have it rough as an adventure.
As much as I'd enjoy the marriage buff (hubby and I always do a character duo), I suspect this is the case. I'd rather not have the buff than have it used purely for game mechanics with no RP behind it.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I propose, therefore, that rpers band together to found some towns in an area as a sort of "rp strongly encouraged (sometimes with blunt instruments) area", with an overall support network, so we can have people who rp bandits and work out of some wayside tavern, some good and evil towns connected by roads, and MAKE a strong rp presence in a section of the world.Looks like there's a very strong RP/RP-neutral contingent so far on the forums. Since early enrollment will be drawn from our ranks, and we'll have months before open enrollment lets in the general population, this should work.
Also, Chiassa is a very happy little bard right now. I really love where these ideas are going. It's just my luck that all these things popped up on a weekend where my computer use has been pretty minimal!
I think many of the emerging communities here are RP friendly and plan to promote it in one way or another.
|
Goblinworks Executive Founder
|
The game might end up an RP haven and I would like that to be the case. I just don't expect it to ever be a hardcore RP'er majority. These would most likely be the only players that would never use the mechanical advantage unless it was expressly part of their characters "story". The RP neutral group will most likely be the majority and I expect that they would use the marriage buff to give them an edge or to level the playing field. Groups going to war will want any edge they can get. If this means "marring up" to get a buff it will happen. Heh, I guess the divorce rate would spike after the battle though, maybe I can make a divorce lawyer firm...
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I am against marriage buffs on a roleplay level. It encourages people to play romantic characters and that promotes "50 Shades" style RP. This kind of behavior doesn't need encouragement. If people want to RP a romance they will. I want to see non-romantic characters as well.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
What about a "team synergy", the more you work with someone, the more of a buff you get working with them, it dwindles over time and has other bonuses for working as a team, so if all members work together regularly, more, different bonuses. Promoting a sort of "fellowship" vibe
In pathfinder players gain "feats" and there is an entire subset of them called "teamwork feats" that work when characters use them in tandem. One example is a feat that gives bonuses to AC when to characters who have the "back to back" feat fight back to back in battle.
I expect there to be teamwork skills/abilities. They have already hinted at it with talk of battle formations.
Married characters just need to train skills that complement each other.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Nihimon, even though it wasn't perfect, it was my 2d favorite part of Vanguard (after being a bard and actually making your own songs Gawd that was cool). I loved playing the diplo game and following the quest lines.
I did too, and maxed it out on my Paladin. However, one of the most frustrating events in my entire time playing Vanguard (and there were plenty) was when I had to poison an Ambassador or something along those lines early on in Tursh to level up my Diplomacy. It still sticks in my craw that the devs made a Paladin use poison.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I think he's saying "rp" will become erp [Erotic Role-Play] instead. Which, you know, is fine if that's what you wanna do, but there's much more fun to be had with your clothes on :p
That is exactly what I'm saying. Whenever you enter into an RP hotspot in most games half of the people there are smooching on each other and sitting in each other's laps. And a lot of them have a very specific type of private message conversation in mind.
Some of this ok, between willing participants, but way too much of this gives the RP community community a bad name. It also is a real turn off to people like me who enjoy RP but aren't seeking that kind of experience.
A system which encourages character marriage encourages people of opposite (Or same depending on preference) genders to seek each other out and become in-game couples. It also discourages non-romantic characters AKA characters who do not engage in any romantic storyline. Outside extended works and fan fiction this includes a lot of really great characters like Obi-Wan and Palpatine, or Gandalf and Frodo.
Love is a great part of many people's stories but there is no reason to encourage it mechanically. It is popular enough without that.