| Phasics |
Just looking for some feedback on this archetype in particular any imbalance loop holes that it might create or any overt strengths or weakenesses.
Magic Maneuvers (Ex)
The Force Archon calculates his CMB as follows. Intelligence + Wizard class level.The Force Archon calculates his CMD as follows. Intelligence + Dexterity + Wizard Class level. Size modifier is not included in either calculation. The Force Archon may apply bonuses from feats that modify his CMB and CMD. The Force Archon may substitute his CMB bonus including relevant feats into any spell with a force descriptor that uses a CMB attack roll to perform a combat maneuver as part of the spells effect.
This ability replaces Arcane Bond
Force Specialist (Ex)
A Force Archon treats any spell with the force descriptor to be on his wizard spell list. A Force Archon treats any Wizard spell with the force descriptor to be one level lower than listed in all regards. This means a wizard can learn such spells earlier than normal, add them to his spell list and cast them using a lower level slot. This ability allows the Force Archon to prepare 1st level wizard force spells as cantrips, however if she does this she can only use that cantrip a number of times per day equal to her Intelligence modifier. A Force Archon can still only prepare up to 4 cantrips like a normal wizard.
The Force Archon can prepare one extra spell per spell level as long as the spell is a wizard spell with the force descriptor. After casting this bonus spell she can recall the spell as a swift action once.
As a result of this specialisation all wizard spells without the force descriptor are treated as one level higher in all regards, this will mean the wizard will need to be a higher level than normal to learn and add such a spell to his spell list as well as requiring a higher level slot to cast.
This ability replaces Arcane School
| Wiggz |
I created this version of a Force Wizard, treating Force in a similar fashion to how the elemental schools were done:
Force Supremacy:
Spells with the force descriptor count as one level lower when determining the total spell level after meta-magic feats have been applied. i.e. – an Extended Mage Armor spell counts as a 1st level spell while an Quickened Mage Armor spell counts as a 4th level spell.
Force Push:
As a swift action you can cause a burst of force to emanate from you, pushing back adjacent creatures 1 size level larger than you or smaller 5’ and knocking them prone. A successful Reflex saving throw negates being knocked prone. The DC of this save is equal to 10 + ½ your wizard level + your INT modifier. You may use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your intelligence modifier.
Blade Barrier:
At 8th level you can unleash a Blade Barrier as a standard action. This ability functions as the 6th level Cleric spell but is limited to a ring centered on you, moving with you, with a 5’ radius. This maximum radius increases to 10’ at 12th level, 15’ at 16th level and 20’ at 20th level. This ability can be used a number of rounds per day equal to your Wizard level. These rounds do not have to be consecutive.
Obviously, the standard 1 extra spell per level was applied as well - I even made up about a dozen new Force spells, levels 1-9.
Never got a peep. Seems like the interest isn't there...
| Dominigo |
I actually really like the idea of a force based caster and have always wanted to play one. The main problem I have always found with it is that there are very few force spells, and the few there are tend to be fairly powerful for what they do. Balancing them while giving a character a proper compliment of force spells would be difficult at best.
I think you would have better luck with a prestige class based around the concept rather than a full 20 level class. Just my thoughts on the matter.
As for the two specific classes you guys mentioned, Phasics's Force Specialization would severely gimp the wizard who took it by increasing the spell level of 95% of their choices. I can't imagine when it would be worth it to do this unless you made a lot more force spells to replace the ones they just lost normal access to, in which case they are probably simply better when they can directly replace a spell, and some spells they simply couldn't replace.
For Wiggz, the swift action to push back everything adjacent to you 5 feet is pretty amazing since it makes it easier to get away from melee combatants who might harass you and could be combined with your blade barrier power to rather brutal effect by letting them walk through it then pushing them back out while still hitting them with a spell. The mobile Blade Barrier would be pretty powerful even without that little bit.
| Wiggz |
For Wiggz, the swift action to push back everything adjacent to you 5 feet is pretty amazing since it makes it easier to get away from melee combatants who might harass you and could be combined with your blade barrier power to rather brutal effect by letting them walk through it then pushing them back out while still hitting them with a spell. The mobile Blade Barrier would be pretty powerful even without that little bit.
Certainly it would be effective, but compared to other wizard abilities offered by the various schools it is right in line with power level. The Blade Barrier ability is actually just a gimped version of the clerical spell, itself a force-based evocation spell.
| Dominigo |
The part that concerns me more about the pushback effect is that it is a swift action rather than a standard. Doing a quick look through the various schools and subschools, I only found 2 that could perform their 3 + Int Mod ability as a swift action. One allowed the wizard to grow a natural weapon, and the other let him do a short range Dimension Door, which would prevent him from taking more actions after he activates it in a turn. The matter is worsened by the fact that you are moving an enemy rather than yourself without them having any way to prevent it. You can easily push enemies into pits or other hazardous areas if they stray to close to them or if the wizard puts them near it by other means, such as Create Pit and its related variants.
The Blade Barrier effect isn't really that much gimped over the higher level spell. The advantage of the mobile version is that you can force others through the wall and thus take the damage from it just by moving towards them. Adding in the fact that you can keep it in tight around you means that you can reduce the chance of friendly fire and ensure medium and smaller creature take the damage again when you push them back through it with your school ability, it just seems like it would be rather potent.
| Wiggz |
The part that concerns me more about the pushback effect is that it is a swift action rather than a standard. Doing a quick look through the various schools and subschools, I only found 2 that could perform their 3 + Int Mod ability as a swift action. One allowed the wizard to grow a natural weapon, and the other let him do a short range Dimension Door, which would prevent him from taking more actions after he activates it in a turn. The matter is worsened by the fact that you are moving an enemy rather than yourself without them having any way to prevent it. You can easily push enemies into pits or other hazardous areas if they stray to close to them or if the wizard puts them near it by other means, such as Create Pit and its related variants.
The Blade Barrier effect isn't really that much gimped over the higher level spell. The advantage of the mobile version is that you can force others through the wall and thus take the damage from it just by moving towards them. Adding in the fact that you can keep it in tight around you means that you can reduce the chance of friendly fire and ensure medium and smaller creature take the damage again when you push them back through it with your school ability, it just seems like it would be rather potent.
The spell Blade Barrier allows for one to create a protective ring or a wall, this one allows only one option. The spell Blade Barrier allows you to cast at range, up to 300 feet away, this one only allows a range of personal. The spell Blade Barrier has a duration of minutes per level, this one only allows for mere rounds per level. The spell Blade Barrier allows you to form a ring up to 50 feet in radius, this one's limits are significantly smaller... less versatile, shorter range, shorter duration, smaller area of effect - all in all, I'd say that's pretty gimped.
.The ability to cast a spell (like Detonate, for instance) and then Dimension Door away as a swift action is pretty potent I'd say, to use one of the examples you offered. Any Wizard who finds himself repeatedly surrounded by adjacent foes has bigger problems than the ability to push them 5' away - I think you're focusing on teh combo of the two a little much, though I'll admit I thought the possibility that granted abilities might actually work together was a pleasant novelty.
| Dominigo |
The swift action Dimension Door actually isn't as amazing as you would think. You only get to move 5 ft per 2 wizard levels, and due to Dimension Doors limitations, you can't use it it teleport away to safety then cast a spell in the same round. Additionally, you can't take anyone with you and must be able to see your target location, meaning you can't use it to jump to the other side of walls or anything like that.
As for the gimped Blade Barrier, you don't need the combo to make it good. All you do is turn it on and walk around. Everyone who gets too close takes a 1D6 per caster level every time the wall passes over them, with a Reflex for half of course. The fact that they can't throw it 300 feet or have for another 10 minutes after a typical combat has ended doesn't buy them much when you are potentially turning the casters move action into extra offensive spell damage by just walking around the battlefield.
The main thing to keep in mind about Blade Barrier is that its main deterrent as a defensive spell is that anyone who decides to walk through it is going to take some significant damage for making that decision, and you are allowing the wizard to remove that decision making process from their victim.
I can pretty easily come up with scenarios where either of these abilities is incredibly powerful, both by themselves and in tandem.
| Phasics |
The list of force spells is not exactly tiny, in fact I'd go as far as saying its a pretty decent list you could do reasonable well with all by itself let alone with delayed access to the rest of the wizard spell list.
Scoop 0
Floating Disk 1
Magic Missile 1
Mage Armor 1
Shield 1
Pilfering Hand 2
Instant Armor 2
Ablative Barrier 2
Spiritual Weapon 2
Cushioning Bands 2
Force Punch 3
Explosive Runes 3
Sepia Snake Sigil 3
Twilight Knife 3
Force Hook Charge 3
Chain of Perdition 3
Shining Cord 3
Tiny Hut 3
Resilient Sphere 4
Spiritual Ally 4
Forceful Strike 4
Telekinetic Charge 4
Interposing Hand 5
Wall of Force 5
Blade Barrier 6
Leashed Shackles 6
Symbol of Sealing 6
Caging Bomb Admixture 6
Forceful Hand 6
Forcecage 7
Grasping Hand 7
Mage's Sword 7
Deflection 7
Telekinetic Sphere 8
Clenched Fist 8
Crushing Hand 9
| Sazbirtraz |
@Phasics
As a Wizard Archetype I think this would definitely drop a Wizard out of a tier 1 position because you are giving up such a huge swathe of useful/powerful spells at any given level to pick up a rather small list of specific spells that they cant even technically cast better than any other Wizard, just earlier. It feels like pigeonholing a class that is built for versatility and utility. I honestly think that this seems like it would be a better fit as some kind of Sorcerer bloodline/archetype, as they are already constrained on the spells they can know anyway.
Also, considering Spiritual Weapon and Ally are particularly bad if you don't have a decent Wisdom, a low level Force Archon would pretty much be stuck with all Magic Missile all the time, which could be completely shut down with a Shield spell or Brooch of Shielding. That can be compensated for with wands and such, but again that pretty much just makes a Sorcerer right there. I might suggest having the Spiritual spells gain the benefit of primary casting stat if that is the route you want to go down.