I said the Wal Mart thing.
Yeah; I'm an a$$*~!% because somebody who is scrounging off of me to bankroll their breeding program is buying things I wouldn't buy for my own kids and buying a case of beer that I'm not drinking. Why should they have to bankroll that money to get off of government support faster? Why should they have to practice fiscal responsibility? What a jerk ass notion!!!
Not only does everybody have their cup out, and not paying, now I'm the a@#$**~ for pouring it out under duress. I should smile too.
Not only that, it's just anecdotal evidence, so I probably don't even know what I'm looking at.
Or maybe, just maybe, if people learned to take what they needed instead of what they wanted or could take, there would be enough for everybody who needed. I don't know, maybe the myth of them rich folk who have the money to fix it all but won't because they're just too greedy is more powerful than the myth of the food stamp queen.
Again, more garbage.
It has been explicitly stated that the point is NOT that those receiving welfare should not be able to buy toys for their children.
The point is being made that if those not receiving welfare can get by (buying some stuff for their kids) then those receiving welfare who are able to outstrip (in their purchases) then those receiving shouldn't be.
So, stop with the nonsense.
No, your line of thought is garbage. You haven't been there, and I have. You haven't been treated to the kind of bull$#it level of disrespect over food stamps that people feel is appropriate thanks to the myth of the food stamp bum, and I have. So you can take your lack of experience and your made up platitudes and light a fire with them for all I care. I'm a vet and I nearly starved because this system is broken and would rather deny food to the crackheads than feed the hungry. When you manage to come up with something to answer that, you let me know.
In this very thread there is a comment about the mom food stamping her way through Wal-mart while the dad buys toys.
In multiple conversations, the horror at people on food stamps being able to buy energy drinks now, has been brought up, satirized on Youtube, Quickmeme and Facebook and pointed to as evidence that the system is indeed broken.
And until you force people to buy the same toys for their children, there will be discrepancy. As a child, I grew up in a middle class family. I lived next door to a less well off middle class family. As a child, I never made that connection, because the brat who lived there had every Ninja Turtle that came out, while I had to buy mine, and had a much smaller collection. Turns out my father made more than both of his parents' combined, and just didn't really like to spend a bunch of money on toys for us. No two parents or people will have the same idea of what is an 'appropriate' level of toys for their children. Pointing to a foodstamp family that spends more on toys than a poor family that does not is not evidence the system is broken. People not being able to eat is evidence that the system is broken.
On the last sentence...Sure it is. The family can spend less on the toys and more on things that matter to survive if it needs money to survive. Simple reasoning.
On the rest...
If you didn't want to starve, you should have chosen to use your gibill to go through an apprentice program instead of college. Most of those still lead to associates degrees. You get paid while in your apprenticeship and you get paid by the gibill on top of it. I work with one heck of a lot of people who do that. But, you chose a path where you use the money to pay for college while working a job instead of taking an apprenticeship that will get you full time employment, costs you nothing and pays you on top of it while collecting your gibill.
Your choice. Live with it.
Buying beer and toys while his "wife" is buying the foodstamp cart.
Dude wasn't even embarassed. Maybe he was. Owell, he got some beer. He'll get over it.
I'm just saying that if I was angry and standing in the check-out line I could probably imagine a whole bunch of nasty stuff about the people ahead of me.
Maybe it would be true, maybe it wouldn't.
I'm just saying that if I was angry and standing in the check-out line I could probably imagine a whole bunch of nasty stuff about the people ahead of me.
Maybe it would be true, maybe it wouldn't.
and if you weren't hungry because you made enough and were spending it on what mattered (food) then...
My anecdote, comrade?
Your anecdote was long--I haven't read it all yet.
[Goes back up the thread]
I had trouble following all the relationships, but, yeah, she sounds like a terrible mother.
of course, the ONLY solution for putting more foodstamps into the hands of people that need them is to take them out of the hands of those that might be able to get buy without them.
Now excuse me, i need to go make sure bain capital keeps paying half the taxes of the folks just barely out of foodstamps.
of course, the ONLY solution for putting more foodstamps into the hands of people that need them is to take them out of the hands of those that might be able to get buy without them.
Now excuse me, i need to go make sure bain capital keeps paying half the taxes of the folks just barely out of foodstamps.
more useless platitudes...
Anecdotes of my own:
--Was in line at the grocery store. Woman with her brats bought a cart full of beans, rice, tortillas, tomatoes, onions, etc. Paid for it with food stamps. I didn't care.
--Three times over the course of my life I have been dressed up in my usual attire of old, crappy clothes and a beard that makes me look homeless and have gone into the store to buy delicious, refreshing Juicy Juice with 120% of the body's needed Vitamin C in one glass and the girl ringing me up asked if I was paying with food stamps.
When did Juicy Juice become Government Cheese?
Yeah, it was my choice. To work my way through college, and become a productive member of society. Your useless statements, empty make believe reality on the other hand, demonstrates what's wrong with your entire line of fake-fact based thinking. You'd rather have people 'live with their choices' and succumb to disease on the streets than put them into places where they can benefit. Now, I defended your abused freedom of speech and thought for years, so I'm not concerned so much that you utilize it selfishly, any more than I'm concerned about a little prick who doesn't stand for the pledge of allegiance. If you don't use your freedom, what's the point? What concerns me is that you spread your poisoned lies throughout the country's mind, to the point where they'd rather watch someone die from starvation than give them a meal, or rot from cancer rather than treat it. And because your mindset is twisted and evil, you need to build up and establish a justification for it, so that the less selfish who support you can get to sleep at night.
Remember folks. The system set up by the Republicans would have let me sponge off it forever, as long as I agreed to stop going to college. That's the kind of welfare we want in this country? The kind that keeps you on it forever, rather than gives you a boost up and out of destitution? The kind that fills streets with dying wretches, rather than gainfully employs them someplace. All the while, the narrative is told about people who beg for fun with $200K jobs, or that jerk in the store who dared buy soda rather than drink water on food stamps, rather than the thousands who are starving to death in the richest country on earth.
Yeah, I don't care that you are a twisted, poor example of an American and that I defended you. What upsets me is that you are trying to twist 'American' into the miserly entity you are. If that happens, if my brothers and sisters died and I gave my time and health for a warped ideal like the ones you espouse, then our efforts really will have lost their meaning.
Anecdotes of my own:
--Was in line at the grocery store. Woman with her brats bought a cart full of beans, rice, tortillas, tomatoes, onions, etc. Paid for it with food stamps. I didn't care.
--Three times over the course of my life I have been dressed up in my usual attire of old, crappy clothes and a beard that makes me look homeless and have gone into the store to buy delicious, refreshing Juicy Juice with 120% of the body's needed Vitamin C in one glass and the girl ringing me up asked if I was paying with food stamps.
When did Juicy Juice become Government Cheese?
That is kinda funny. :)
When about seventeen me and another friend spent the night at a third friend's house and we all managed to get hold of some maddog 20/20...my friends had money that I didn't.
About 02:00 in the morning we broke some of his dad's fifteen year old clothes (including suit coats and hats) out of the closet (this was in '88) and proceeded to grab a basketball and canes and sunglasses and began walking downtown while drunk and matching the steretypical look of the homeless. We made quite a sight and a lot of noise. Fortunately, the streets of Ashland Kentucky were completely devoid of people, including cops, that night.
Another anecdote involves the goggles paizono swimathon '88. The name comes from the Flinstones when Fred became a race car driver. The swimathon involved seeing how many neighborhood pools one could swim in uninvited in a night. One of my friends, while hurriedly fleeing after lights came on one pool, leaped a fence and stuck the landing. the problem with sticking the landing was that he bent his knees so far that his chin hit his knee and split open. Blood was everywhere. Unfortunately (or in retrospect, perhaps fortunately), I wasn't there that night.
Yeah, it was my choice. To work my way through college, and become a productive member of society. Your useless statements, empty make believe reality on the other hand, demonstrates what's wrong with your entire line of fake-fact based thinking. You'd rather have people 'live with their choices' and succumb to disease on the streets than put them into places where they can benefit. Now, I defended your abused freedom of speech and thought for years, so I'm not concerned so much that you utilize it selfishly, any more than I'm concerned about a little prick who doesn't stand for the pledge of allegiance. If you don't use your freedom, what's the point? What concerns me is that you spread your poisoned lies throughout the country's mind, to the point where they'd rather watch someone die from starvation than give them a meal, or rot from cancer rather than treat it. And because your mindset is twisted and evil, you need to build up and establish a justification for it, so that the less selfish who support you can get to sleep at night.
Remember folks. The system set up by the Republicans would have let me sponge off it forever, as long as I agreed to stop going to college. That's the kind of welfare we want in this country? The kind that keeps you on it forever, rather than gives you a boost up and out of destitution? The kind that fills streets with dying wretches, rather than gainfully employs them someplace. All the while, the narrative is told about people who beg for fun with $200K jobs, or that jerk in the store who dared buy soda rather than drink water on food stamps, rather than the thousands who are starving to death in the richest country on earth.
Yeah, I don't care that you are a twisted, poor example of an American and that I defended you. What upsets me is that you are trying to twist 'American' into the miserly entity you are. If that happens, if my brothers and sisters died and I gave my time and health for a warped ideal like the ones you espouse, then our efforts...
More b$@@$*@+.
You could have chosen to be a productive member of society by entering a trade apprenticeship program. That would have given you the money to live without starving or needing food stamps.
That isn't fantasy. People do it all the time.
You made a choice and think that even though you had a choice that would have provided what you asking, it is wrong that things didn't work out the way you wanted when you chose another way.
I appreciate that you were in the service. The service gave you multiple options upon leaving. You did not choose the one that would have kept food in your mouth if hard times hit. It was there and you didn't choose it.
Instead of facing that you made a bad choice when given a better alternative, you attack me and accuse me of lying when telling the truth.
More nonsense and I am calling it out for the b!#$%@+$ it is.
I'm not abusing my right to freedom of speech, I'm just telling it like it is.
I just get a chuckle about my neighbor out in the boondocks with 20 acres of land, around about 10k trust fund once a year, a house, a greyhound dog business, and a "girlfriend" living there popping out kids with him on AFDC, and the whold deal is written away as meany republicans protecting rich people.
Yeah; it's an anecdote.
It's also true.
I don't know what I'm misunderstanding about the situation, it just gives me a chuckle in a bleak sort of way.
Man, if you all just......just knew this guy, you wouldn't have any juice left to call anybody an a#!!#!$ again in your life.
Maybe I shoulda reported him for welfare fraud and woken up with another mouth on my neck he put there with a knife or something.
You could have chosen to be a productive member of society by entering a trade apprenticeship program. That would have given you the money to live without starving or needing food stamps.
And if he'd become a carpenter and then say, broken his back? Then what?
You could have chosen to be a productive member of society by entering a trade apprenticeship program. That would have given you the money to live without starving or needing food stamps.And if he'd become a carpenter and then say, broken his back? Then what?
Then he would still have other options available.
My brother-in-law was a brocklayer and effed up his back in Texas where he lived. I don't know what the official title is there but the their office of vocational rehabilitation allowed him to study to get a new job. He became a realtor, did outstanding, became a Remax realtor, made more money and then became superintendent of a huge building owned by the aTm alumni association. There is big money in aTm athletics and he makes a very good living, especially when paired with my sister's income. But, the point is that other options are available to make good money even if not as good as his.
Did I mention that he is a poor white boy from Carter County Kentucky which has (and has had for a very long while) one of the worst education systems in the whole US? You know, the place that received national exposure because it doesn't have a public library and the residents a few years ago voted down having one because they don't see a need for it?
Every state has offices of vocational rehabilitation as part of their workforce development department.
When industries such as steelworking and such dry up, these offices work and spend money to see that laid off workers receive training and can start new careers. Same for injured workers.
Huh. When i broke my back and foot a "seasonal" job i had for 4 years i was told door, ass, you know the rest.
Its funny that you mention other options and career paths... because that's what Kain took: an option to work and learn and serve his country. It didn't work out.
You make it sound as though there is any sure path to a career: there is not. Any option you name will not be 100% effective no matter how hard you "will" it or how hard you tug up on the boostraps.
Every state has offices of vocational rehabilitation as part of their workforce development department.
When industries such as steelworking and such dry up, these offices work and spend money to see that laid off workers receive training and can start new careers. Same for injured workers.
And those retraining programs work so well that we don't have blighted cities where the steel mills used to be.
Retraining programs are a nice idea and I'm sure they help some people, but they're a band aid being thrown at the wrong problem.
Just to spare you the trouble: More platitudes.
Loss of steel mills meant a large loss of local revenue.
Retraining did not mean suddenly new jobs to work in the same place suddenly appeared. It meant that people moved.I would have preferred to get a job at ACF (American Car Foundry) or Ironton Iron, or Kentucky Electric Steel, or AK Steel (Armco Steel before being bought out by Japanese) after finishing my training to be an industrial electrician but they were on their last legs. So, I got a job at Buckeye Steel Castings in Columbus. Of course, I got laid off and it closed shortly after. I then moved to the Hampton Roads area of Virginia and used my repair skills to get a light industry plant to hire me after getting the door in through a temp service. Then, I got into the apprenticeship at NNSY and the rest is history.
Retraining helps but isn't a kill all for every problem where thousands are laid off (never claimed it was) but it helps and often those people must move to new locations. But, it is immensely helpful to those suffering injuries.
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I just get a chuckle about my neighbor out in the boondocks with 20 acres of land, around about 10k trust fund once a year, a house, a greyhound dog business, and a "girlfriend" living there popping out kids with him on AFDC, and the whold deal is written away as meany republicans protecting rich people.
Yeah; it's an anecdote.
It's also true.
I don't know what I'm misunderstanding about the situation, it just gives me a chuckle in a bleak sort of way.
Man, if you all just......just knew this guy, you wouldn't have any juice left to call anybody an a~&%#*% again in your life.
Maybe I shoulda reported him for welfare fraud and woken up with another mouth on my neck he put there with a knife or something.
I'm going to take a wild guess here and say that even the most pro-welfare state social democrat in the world would agree that your example is an abuse.
Huh. When i broke my back and foot a "seasonal" job i had for 4 years i was told door, ass, you know the rest.
Its funny that you mention other options and career paths... because that's what Kain took: an option to work and learn and serve his country. It didn't work out.
You make it sound as though there is any sure path to a career: there is not. Any option you name will not be 100% effective no matter how hard you "will" it or how hard you tug up on the boostraps.
No, I do not make it sound as if there is a sure path. Nothing is sure.
People at differing ages and backgrounds have different options.
If you get out of service and can still live with family while on the gibill, going full time to get a four year degree might be a good route for you.
But, especially if older or you have a family to worry about, money sooner rather than later becomes far more important. In that case, going the route of an apprenticeship program (no prior experience is necessary for such) is a very solid choice.
If you need money now and choose the path that gives money later instead of the one that gives money now, you are taking a risky proposition.
About this:
"Huh. When i broke my back and foot a "seasonal" job i had for 4 years i was told door, ass, you know the rest."
There appears to be missing a word or two that makes understanding somewhat difficult. Breaking both a back and foot can have ramifications. If so, you could have qualified for receiving retraining or money to go to a university. I believe qualifying for a pell grant would allow voc rehab to pay all the remaining expenses.
I don't know the extent of your injuries or the extent of the hypothetical injury described earlier when referencing what would happen if the apprentice route had been taken instead of college.
What state are you in and did you apply to the office of vocational rehabilitation? In many states, if an injury or illness has effects that prevent you from entering a particular field (such as the military or labor) then you (in general) will qualify for retraining in either a specific job or money for higher education.
I'm going to take a wild guess here and say that even the most pro-welfare state social democrat in the world would agree that your example is an abuse.I just get a chuckle about my neighbor out in the boondocks with 20 acres of land, around about 10k trust fund once a year, a house, a greyhound dog business, and a "girlfriend" living there popping out kids with him on AFDC, and the whold deal is written away as meany republicans protecting rich people.
Yeah; it's an anecdote.
It's also true.
I don't know what I'm misunderstanding about the situation, it just gives me a chuckle in a bleak sort of way.
Man, if you all just......just knew this guy, you wouldn't have any juice left to call anybody an a~&%#*% again in your life.
Maybe I shoulda reported him for welfare fraud and woken up with another mouth on my neck he put there with a knife or something.
I don't know how pervasive it is. I don't know if the statistics even exist.
I spent 10 years in a literal hell on earth surrounded by people of a type that the men were all convicts by the time they were 18 at the latest, and the women had a kid by a convict by the time they were 16 at the latest.
I always heard gunfire.
One time, the gunfire wasn't for practice. It all sounds the same.
THEN, I come back from that hell after surviving and being beat into muscles made out of wood with completely shut off pain receptors, and you know what I see?
I see the same typical s+@!. So, for me anyway, having only my own personal observations which are totally anecdotal for another cat, I says, "damn. That f~@*ing hellhole wasn't a fluke. This s&!~ is everywhere." For me, the odds that I'm still walking around seeing this b@!*!!!& speaks volumes.
I don't know how pervasive it is though. I try to do stuff scientifically.
Having lived through a hell that owning a firearm was a really good idea, like in the beginning of Prometheus there,.......I now have learned to keep troublish people at arm's length, and understand that statistically a firearm in a house with kids is more of a menace than a deterrant to a jackass coming in to jack my stuff. Hence,....no firearms. In a state that is "made of firearms."
But, I can't discount observations that count as anecdotal. I came to the conclusion that europeans had neanderthal dna long before dna science proved it. By anecdotally seeing people with pronounced brow ridges.
Yeah, it was my choice. To work my way through college, and become a productive member of society.
First off...thank you for your service. America is free because folks like you stood for us. Thank You.
Second, do not let the lack of compassion from some inexperienced children annoy you too much. Only children demand respect without giving respect.
I've been up and been down and currently I am down again. I am getting unemployment which is a small amount and goes away in a day or so. But it helps with food and my cell phone and I am very grateful for it. I am actively interviewing and it can be tough sometimes. Having to really plan well for a trip to Boston for a job interview and being more scared about having enough money to get home then the actual interview is ironic. (It went well, but the job was pulled due to budget cuts).
I find that in the long run it gets better - but it tends to take much longer than one would wish. (I am in my sixth month of unemployment and lose benefits in about eight weeks - I think.)
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No, I do not make it sound as if there is a sure path. Nothing is sure.
Then how do you possibly justify saying that working through school and going into the military was the wrong choice? This is impossible and quite frankly, condescending as all hell for you to say that he should have known that his plan to better himself and his prospects wouldn't work out.
"There appears to be missing a word or two that makes understanding somewhat difficult"
The missing words are don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out- which is an employers typical response to a workers injury.
{quote]What state are you in and did you apply to the office of vocational rehabilitation?
New york, and i hadnt heard of the program until now.
In many states, if an injury or illness has effects that prevent you from entering a particular field (such as the military or labor) then you (in general) will qualiufy for retraining in either a specific job or money for higher education.
Yes, but i already have a degree. You should also see the interaction of the workers comp insurance and.. well. .ANYTHING.
Anyways, I've never received a dime from the government, state or federal, in assistance, so food stamps aren't something I've ever really thought about until this thread--and I know food stamps are only a portion of the welfare programs out there--but:
It seems to me that if the fed gov't is spending $70 billion a year to give people money to go spend on Juicy Juice at Wal-Mart and a further $20 billion on agricultural subsidies...well, I'd think it would probably be cheaper to pay those farmers to sell their food to the government and then turn around and set up regional food banks.
I mean, why does America keep implementing "socialist" programs (food stamps, bail outs, Obamacare) that channel money into corporate bank accounts?
Oh, wait a minute, I know this one...
I don't know how pervasive it is. I don't know if the statistics even exist.
I spent 10 years in a literal hell on earth surrounded by people of a type that the men were all convicts by the time they were 18 at the latest, and the women had a kid by a convict by the time they were 16 at the latest.
I always heard gunfire.
One time, the gunfire wasn't for practice. It all sounds the same.
THEN, I come back from that hell after surviving and being beat into muscles made out of wood with completely shut off pain receptors, and you know what I see?
I see the same typical s++%. So, for me anyway, having only my own personal observations which are totally anecdotal for another cat, I says, "damn. That f*&+ing hellhole wasn't a fluke. This s#!! is everywhere." For me, the odds that I'm still walking around seeing this b%+!+~!# speaks volumes.
I don't know how pervasive it is though. I try to do stuff scientifically.
Having lived through a hell that owning a firearm was a really good idea, like in the beginning of Prometheus there,.......I...
Spanky, did you finally get a couple of beers from that mooch at Wal-Mart?
Anyways, I've never received a dime from the government, state or federal, in assistance, so food stamps aren't something I've ever really thought about until this thread--and I know food stamps are only a portion of the welfare programs out there--but:
It seems to me that if the fed gov't is spending $70 billion a year to give people money to go spend on Juicy Juice at Wal-Mart and a further $20 billion on agricultural subsidies...well, I'd think it would probably be cheaper to pay those farmers to sell their food to the government and then turn around and set up regional food banks.
I mean, why does America keep implementing "socialist" programs (food stamps, bail outs, Obamacare) that channel money into corporate bank accounts?
Oh, wait a minute, I know this one...
Comrade what you are suggesting would be called socialism because it doesn't enrich corporate bank accounts. If the politicians only care about helping the agribusniess through food stamps would they really care that people are cheating on food stamps. If foodstamps bought less of junkfood and more cheap fruits and vegtables then the poor might be healthier and not in the emergency room. Even with all the cheating that goes on foodstamps are still good for the economy.
Spanky, did you finally get a couple of beers from that mooch at Wal-Mart?
Naah. I'm on call.
I gotta stay sober.
Who needs hooch, when sleep deprivation is free?
No, I do not make it sound as if there is a sure path. Nothing is sure.Then how do you possibly justify saying that working through school and going into the military was the wrong choice? This is impossible and quite frankly, condescending as all hell for you to say that he should have known that his plan to better himself and his prospects wouldn't work out.
"There appears to be missing a word or two that makes understanding somewhat difficult"
The missing words are don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out- which is an employers typical response to a workers injury.
What state are you in and did you apply to the office of vocational rehabilitation?New york, and i hadnt heard of the program until now.
In many states, if an injury or illness has effects that prevent you from entering a particular field (such as the military or labor) then you (in general) will qualiufy for retraining in either a specific job or money for higher education.Yes, but i already have a degree. You should also see the interaction of the workers comp insurance and.. well. .ANYTHING.
I didn't say working through school and going through the military was the wrong choice.
It was a given that the poster went through the military.
The response was regarding the choices afterward with the money from the gibill.
Going to school (when not living at home with parents) was a risky choice. He paid for it. It may or may not be a bad choice when all is said and done but there is not reason to complain that one had it hard when one chose the path where being hard was assured.
Going through an apprentice program instead (most of these programs heavily favor military from my experience job searching and working for them) would have given full-time pay (instead of part-time work while in school full-time) and gibill money on top of that which would not have gone to pay for school expenses. That is a very safe choice.
If given both the opportunity to take a safe proposition and a risky one, and you (in general) choose the risky one, there is no room to complain of not being fair when it is hard.
Still in the end, it may be worth the hard work. Those are choices and they are fair.
Regarding the last bit about having a degree...
Did the injury permanently prevent you from working with your degree?
If so, then qualification for voc rehab should have been in the mix.
If not, I don't know the extent of the complaint or what was being asked for and not received that was related to the points being made.
to qualify for low income housing...
"In general, the family's income may not exceed 50% of the median income for the county or metropolitan area in which the family chooses to live."
median income of portsmouth virginia can be found here
"The median income for a household in the city was $36,742."
The male residing in the household is a WG12 step 5 US government worker.
That puts him well over $25 per hour, over $50G per year.
Boom, there you go.
But, the OP didn't ask for such specifics, it asked for examples of mooching.
thejeff made vague comment that it is difficult enough as is (which is difficult to determine regarding thousands of differing forms of government assistance) so I asked for specifics.One asked for an example of mooching. Those were given. One stated that a certain criteria existed. That requires specifics.
That is very simple reasoning.
36,742 / 2 = 18,371
18371+36742 = 55,113
$25*38*50=47500
$25*40*50=50000
$25*40*52=52000Still under 50% in those cases.
WTF are you talking about?
The income of the household shall not exceed 50% of the locality median income. It is not the household income shall not exceed 50% over the median income of the locality.
The locality median income is $36742.
50% of $36742 is 18371.
The income of the household shall not exceed 50% of the median income for the county or metropolitan area in which the family chooses to live ($36,742) therefore the income of the household shall not exceed $18371.
$50,000>$18,371.
All the rhetoric is disguising the fact that the system is broken. Welfare was originally invented by conservatives to stop people from working--they were terrified of the prospect of women leaving the home and entering the workplace.
Most welfare recipients are still single mothers, divorced or abandoned by the children's father.
Invented by conservatives? Franklin D. Roosevelt was FAR from a conservative. He was very liberal and put a lot of people to work with his new deal, creating jobs with the tva, the ccc, and other government agencies. But even he didn`t envision todays rampant beauracracy and gaming the system that goes on.
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Going through an apprentice program instead (most of these programs heavily favor military from my experience job searching and working for them) would have given full-time pay (instead of part-time work while in school full-time) and gibill money on top of that which would not have gone to pay for school expenses. That is a very safe choice.
So everyone thats served our country should have to come back to a life of menial manual labor at low rates or face the possibility of living on the streets.
How many levels can this possibly be wrong on?
Factually those apprenticeship jobs are the first ones to go when the economy changes. We keep telling people to prepare for the future, broaden your skills, do something with technology, and you want to heap dispersion on someone for LISTENING to good advice?
Morally people have a right to something better than a broken back and aching joints working till they're 70 and then keeling over dead from a heart attack.
Going through an apprentice program instead (most of these programs heavily favor military from my experience job searching and working for them) would have given full-time pay (instead of part-time work while in school full-time) and gibill money on top of that which would not have gone to pay for school expenses. That is a very safe choice.So everyone thats served our country should have to come back to a life of menial manual labor at low rates or face the possibility of living on the streets.
How many levels can this possibly be wrong on?
Factually those apprenticeship jobs are the first ones to go when the economy changes. We keep telling people to prepare for the future, broaden your skills, do something with technology, and you want to heap dispersion on someone for LISTENING to good advice?
Morally people have a right to something better than a broken back and aching joints working till they're 70 and then keeling over dead from a heart attack.
Except that I didn't say or imply that everyone who has served our country should come back to a life of menial manual labor.
I'm not talking about digging ditches. This apparent lack of understanding of the real world bewilders me.
Electricians who have gone through apprentice programs, whether they be working residential, commercial, industrial, naval, or avionics are highly skilled professionals. The same can be said for electronics mechanics; I am an electronics measuring equipment mechanic (trade that calibrates electronics equipment, in my case radiacs). It also be said for machinists and welders and painters and automotive mechanics and HVAC technicians.
There are still manual laborers, but they don't have apprentice programs.
Apprentice programs put people in making good solid wages. Maybe not great, but good when finished and the gibill supplements in the meantime. Second, due to the work ethic and organizational abilities displayed by armed forces veterans, they quickly rise through the ranks into management (WL and WS, eventually into even higher paid salaried positions) and training positions (salaried). I see the promotions of former servicemen on a regular basis where I work. That is not to mention those who show initiative and get moved into testing positions or gain access to field that move them into engineering schools.
Secondly, I stated that the four year university path was a solid option for those who could still depend upon parents to provide support (food and shelter).
Thirdly, the four year option is still available for those who are older and have families. But, these people have multiple responsibilities and that makes it difficult. But, that is a choice one must make if one wishes to go for the big bucks.
Choices exist. They aren't nearly as bad as they are being made them out to be. There are many fine fields available with much room for growth and promotion. Granted, things are hard right now, but most apprentice programs like what men and women who have served bring to the table and are more than willing to give them a chance.
Those apprenticeships used to disappear but people have now realized the error in that. NNSY cut out its program in the face of cuts in the '90s and now its workforce is retiring. They restarted their program back around 2002 and have been going ever since. Apprentices are protected in that if a large cut comes in spending, they will keep their job so as to prevent an age and experience gap in the future.
Puget Sound, the same.
Pearl Harbor, the same.
Newport News and BAE systems, the same.
All off the top of my head and they all heavily favor military personnel.
True that. Did the apprenticeship thing, got let go in the first round of lay-offs. I know guys who were in the NNSY Apprenticeship programs and were also let go.
So everyone thats served our country should have to come back to a life of menial manual labor at low rates or face the possibility of living on the streets.How many levels can this possibly be wrong on?
Factually those apprenticeship jobs are the first ones to go when the economy changes. We keep telling people to prepare for the future, broaden your skills, do something with technology, and you want to heap dispersion on someone for LISTENING to good advice?
Morally people have a right to something better than a broken back and aching joints working till they're 70 and then keeling over dead from a heart attack.
That has changed. New rules.
Seems to be very much your bag.No, it is not. Just more making things up.Again, more garbage.
It has been explicitly stated that the point is NOT that those receiving welfare should not be able to buy toys for their children.
The point is being made that if those not receiving welfare can get by (buying some stuff for their kids) then those receiving welfare who are able to outstrip (in their purchases) then those receiving shouldn't be.
So, stop with the nonsense.
Except that's how the anecdotes always play out: I saw a guy buying a nice toy that I couldn't afford, therefore he is able to outstrip me (in his purchases).
It's always generalizing off of one example. If you want to prevent the one example, you have to prevent them all. You have to set up a situation where no one on food stamps can ever buy anything that someone not getting food stamps doesn't think he can afford.
Maybe the guy buying the toy really was scamming the system. Maybe that was the one big thing he bought all year because he really wanted to make his kid happy, even if they couldn't really afford it.
The whole point of the anecdote, is that he shouldn't have been able to do it, however long he scraped and saved for it.
No, it is not.
The vast majority of people on TANF are there for a reason and are not gaming the system. In your example, did you ask about the toy cart? I've seen people on welfare save up for months in order to get things for Christmas. We were on welfare for awhile and my mom saved up for eight months in order to get me a really nice leather jacket for Christmas. She also saved up and bought my brother a tv. She had to go without, but people -like you- who didn't know any better, thought she had gamed the system. You're example is just an assumption. And it makes you look like the very first letters.
Would you demostrate that your perception of what the rule is happens to be different than what others say the rule is?
Not my example, someone else's. Ask them.
Our TV broke when I was a kid and we went months without one before finally getting a black and white tv. Cable? Ha.
But, that isn't the point. It isn't just seeing a single thing that people have, it is also seeing the clothes they wear, and the watches and jewelry, and the shoes on their feet. If someone is saving like that, those things aren't on their person. I've seen it and I know because I have been that person with no money and no what it means to have nothing as opposed to have something and get assistance on top of that.
I'm not talking about digging ditches. This apparent lack of understanding of the real world bewilders me.
The real world has a broader definition than what's happened to you personally.
Electricians who have gone through apprentice programs, whether they be working residential, commercial, industrial, naval, or avionics are highly skilled professionals. The same can be said for electronics mechanics; I am an electronics measuring equipment mechanic (trade that calibrates electronics equipment, in my case radiacs). It also be said for machinists and welders and painters and automotive mechanics and HVAC technicians.
And these are the very jobs that are severely at risk due to competition from changing economics or immigrant labor. You test electronic equipment. What happens when that equipment gets replaced with an IPAD ap or a machine thats so cheap you throw it away and get a new one every 6 months? Painters and automotive mechanics have very labor intensive jobs exposing them to metal filings, toxic chemicals, and falling cars.
At the park they tried to have the prisoners do the asbestos amelioration for the garage and they had to give them hazard pay to work there.
The vast majority of people on TANF are there for a reason and are not gaming the system. In your example, did you ask about the toy cart? I've seen people on welfare save up for months in order to get things for Christmas. We were on welfare for awhile and my mom saved up for eight months in order to get me a really nice leather jacket for Christmas. She also saved up and bought my brother a tv. She had to go without, but people -like you- who didn't know any better, thought she had gamed the system. You're example is just an assumption. And it makes you look like the very first letters.
Would you demostrate that your perception of what the rule is happens to be different than what others say the rule is?
I'll field this then.
What about the beer? See, he's working, and I'm supplementing his breeding program and his beer fund, and feeding his kids for him, when I'm actually going without buying my kids something he is buying for his kids.
And I'm sorry, but I really don't feel bad about that. Because what he's doing is b$@+*$&$. He should buy food for his kids instead of getting beer and leave my money the f!$* alone if he has money for beer.
I've seen kids buying bubblegum with foodstamp money to get the change to buy their crackhead dad beer and other things.
And I'm sorry, but I really don't feel bad about calling him an ass, because he is (or, at this point maybe WAS) a total ass.
And I don't feel bad about that. Because what he's doing is b@~~***&.
Oh, and I forgot about this, but my wife reminded me.
I had a cheezy ass denim jacket with a f~*!ing lameo red lining on it that was a hand-me-down, and we got color t.v. in 1980.
Yay me.
Glad you had leather though.
I lived in a f#&$ing trailer!!!
I'm not talking about digging ditches. This apparent lack of understanding of the real world bewilders me.The real world has a broader definition than what's happened to you personally.
Electricians who have gone through apprentice programs, whether they be working residential, commercial, industrial, naval, or avionics are highly skilled professionals. The same can be said for electronics mechanics; I am an electronics measuring equipment mechanic (trade that calibrates electronics equipment, in my case radiacs). It also be said for machinists and welders and painters and automotive mechanics and HVAC technicians.And these are the very jobs that are severely at risk due to competition from changing economics or immigrant labor. You test electronic equipment. What happens when that equipment gets replaced with an IPAD ap or a machine thats so cheap you throw it away and get a new one every 6 months? Painters and automotive mechanics have very labor intensive jobs exposing them to metal filings, toxic chemicals, and falling cars.
At the park they tried to have the prisoners do the asbestos amelioration for the garage and they had to give them hazard pay to work there.
First, I CALIBRATE electronics measuring equipment used in the field. If new equipment replaces that which I calibrate, I learn to calibrate it because equipment that makes measurements must be calibrated for it to be useful.
The equipment I calibrate measures radiation. the equipment I calibrate has changed and I have changed my methods with it.
electricians and machinists and automotive mechanics still do the same work and if it changes they will change too.
Even if a car is built overseas, it gets worked on here.
HVAC systems built elsewhere will need to be installed and maintained.
Residential housing and commercial and industrial facilities built here will still need to be built and maintained.
Some links for people...
Skilled Manual trades-More Evidence of the Worker Shortages and Crucial Need
Shortage of skilled workers could hit Texas
7 Industries in need of workers now
Skilled Labor Shortage Frustrates Employers- CBS News
People don't want to work with their hands to their own detriment.
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They would rather have me stuck on food stamps forever than pay temporarily for me to eat while I was using the GI Bill to go to college.
West Virginia has the exact same policy.
You cannot attend college and collect food stamps.
It does not matter if the GI bill is providing an income equal to what you would make without a degree. You have to quit school before they will help you.
So in other words, unlike the protests above, people on food stamps should not be allowed to buy beer.Got it.
No, you don't got it.
So, here it is in essence: I don't really feel I should be taken advantage of and I don't feel bad about saying that I am being taken advantage of.
If you have money for beer, you have money to pay for your own kids to eat. One should come before the other, and, frankly, it shouldn't be my duty to make sure your kids' belly is full when you're buying a case of beer.
In fact, the Alligator newspaper, a student run paper at the University of Florida that wasn't exactly run by the Young Republicans of America (I'm sorry I don't have the article handy it was 20 years ago) had an article that stated "you shouldn't be accepting student aid if you're buying beer and cigarettes."
It's called social responsibility.