Acrobatics Skill = Assassin's Creed

[Coldman]

In a previous thread, Elth mentioned a desire for a return to GTA3'esque movement fluidity; climbing, jumping and vaulting walls, scaling rooftops and leaping from building to building. This immediately got me watching videos of Assassins Creed; a game I could not bare to play properly, yet put an exorbitant number of hours into simply for the enjoyment, the feel and the brand of freedom the game offered in regards to movement and truly being a thief in an urban environment.

I'm now in a frame of mind to ask myself and to you on the forum, why can this fluidity of gameplay not be transferred to an MMORPG? Many of the pitfalls of transferring mechanics to the MMORPG environment would not be felt in implementation of this mechanic and it would merely be a case of balance than that of technology.

Video illustration.

We're yet to find out how skills are handled, how character development will truly function and for this reason it is difficult to offer possible means of balance. It is however possible to say that this 'could' be balanced; offering such manouverability to only the most skilled acrobats would be key, and such a level of skill should come at a high sacrifice should one want to be a true street ninja (only light armour, ridiculously high dex, high deployment of available skill into acrobatics etc). Such acts of acrobatics would also severely drain stamina and such a character would be railroaded into being designed specifically to allow such athletics.

I don't need to emphasise how much of a positive thing this could be for the game; any MMORPG which produced a trailer including that of a thief backstabbing his victim, scrambling up the face of a building and disappearing into the night...unthinkable pleasure.

As I said, given the right engine, such mechanics are more an issue of game balance than programming and I'd believe the time invested in coding and designing such gameplay would make my eyes melt, and many others. Never before has an MMORPG had any degree of freedom of movement, and such an investment would trickle down to all classes as they would have a means to invest little skill in order to gain greater agility; at the very least have cool animations for jumping over obstacles.

[Elth]

I can't stress enough how much I would love to see something like this. I think back to games like the original tomb raider where Lara croft would vault over obstacles, hang from a ledge and shimmy across to another section of wall to pull herself up, or even something as simple as pushing a large stone block out of the way to reveal a secret passage and it makes me really wish these things could be present in an online game. They would add so much depth to dungeon crawling and urban environments and really give rogue-like characters that extra feature that embodies the class rather than just being the melee DPS glass cannon. Vaulting over obstacles should be at the base level, that most if not all lightly armored characters could do. Climbing and getting to hard to reach places could be the further advancement to the skill. Pushing large boulders, stuck doors and other feats of strength would also be a great feature that just hasn't been done in an MMO (that I'm aware of).

The weakness of climbing balances itself as the climber is unable to attack and is generally an easy target while they are in such a vulnerable position. Scaling the wall of a keep during a siege is easily countered by defenders if the climbing points are designated sections.

I hope that something like this could be possible for the game engine.

[Coldman]

Tomb Raider! Imagine a dungeon puzzle in which a thief has to perform a Lara Croft esque vault, shimmy etc to a secret lever?

Definitely drooling now.

[Alexander_Damocles]

Nice concept...but I can't really see it working that well in an MMO. Especially as it seems like the majority of the gameplay is designed to be done "in the wild" and not in a town. It would be *a lot* of effort for something that a small fraction of people would enjoy in a small fraction of the game world.

[Coldman]

I think you're underestimating the impact of what would largely be determinant to the overall feel of playing a character, especially in regards to it's determination of how a player could move and potentially interact with any obstacle within the game. It's not a mini game; such a system at it's lowest levels would allow players to roll/shift in combat, leap or vault smaller obstacles etc. At it's highest level? Scale buildings, leap greater distances etc.

Think of it less the ability to be the guy from Assassin's Creed, more the determinant of how a character realizes and deploys his own agility and maneuverability. I'd consider that quite central to everyday gameplay and something which could also heavily feature/relate to combat.

[Elth]

MMOs like Age of Conan and Dungeons and Dragons Online already have climbing points in dungeons, this is just an evolution of that design by mixing it with that of games like tomb raider, grand theft auto 3+ and other similar RPGs. Considering how popular rogue-like classes are I fail to see how this would be a wasted effort and that isn't even taking into consideration that it wouldn't be limited to rogues but to anyone using the acrobatic and climbing skill lines. Age of Conan went as far as developing a whole zone with rooftop walkways and climbing points in one of their content patches. Nearly every dungeon in DDO had ladders and multiple levels. This is just a desire to see that improved and incorporated into the next generation of MMOs. If done early in development by when the environmental objects are being created or modified from the engine, then there is only a few animations needed for vaulting, climbing, shimmying, push & pull objects. If it could be done in tomb raider in the early 90s it should be easily possible now. The additional depth this could add is phenomenal.

[Nihimon]

It seems to me that there would be a significant cost to model each large tree in a forest well enough so that a character with appropriate climbing skill could animate correctly to grab branches, etc.

I would think it would be significantly less costly to do the same for castle walls, etc.

However, even that is probably a moot point early on. GW has already said that we shouldn't even expect to be able to walk around inside Player-Created Buildings and Structures right away.

[Elth]

Climbing every branch of every tree seems to be an extreme exaggeration of what we're asking.

[Coldman]

Exaggeration indeed; funny that you admitted how easy it would be to do for walls, ledges etc...Lets do it :)

[Nihimon]

Elth wrote:

... extreme exaggeration of what we're asking.

I'm asking too! I'd love to see Climbing, and the use of ropes.

[Elth]

Nihimon wrote:

Elth wrote:

... extreme exaggeration of what we're asking.

I'm asking too! I'd love to see Climbing, and the use of ropes.

I knew that silly. I just meant your whole climbing branches thing was exaggerated. I've posted in your Rope thread too :)

[Maerik]

Yes! All of that stuff! Flipping and rolling and evading techniques, all good. Swinging from tree's is a little much but urban crawling sounds terrific.

[Nihimon]

Elth wrote:

Nihimon wrote:

Elth wrote:

... extreme exaggeration of what we're asking.

I'm asking too! I'd love to see Climbing, and the use of ropes.

I knew that silly. I just meant your whole climbing branches thing was exaggerated. I've posted in your Rope thread too :)

Sorry, I was trying to make climbing tree branches an obvious exaggeration when I first brought it up.

It's so difficult to express personality in forum posts. Thanks for taking me lightly :)