Nevermind that the spell name is "grease" and that grease is in fact flammable. If they wanted it to not be flammable, they should have named it "ice slick."
Nearly everything is flammable if you get it hot enough and enough oxygen is present.
|
There really is no good reason for it not to be flammable.
Without magic, a pint of oil can set a 5 foot square on fire. Grease can cover 10 square feet. I don't see anything remotely overpowering about being able to set 10 square feet on fire using magic.
If you use grease to cover one monster, then set it on fire, then you've done nothing more than you could with a pint of oil and prestidigitation other than waste a spell.
Nevermind that the spell name is "grease" and that grease is in fact flammable. If they wanted it to not be flammable, they should have named it "ice slick."
This is funny still with people saying "Grease is flammable". nearly EVERYTHING has a flashpoint. Canola oil needs to be heated to 600F to ignite, and that is generally when it starts to give off enough vapor for the vapor to combust in the heat. Just laying a torch on a pool of room temperature grease is not going to creating a flaming slick. A single point of heat is not enough.
There was already a few discussions on this.
http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5n0f&page=3?Is-the-spell-grease-flammable
To sum up:
James Jacobs said no, the magical grease cannot be ignited by a spark or the Spark spell.
Kevin Andrew Murphy suggested that it might be flammable, but only from intense heat like a Fireball. In which case it would follow the same rules as burning lamp oil.
So... the counterargument appears to be that grease is less flammable than jet fuel, it isn't flammable enough to be flammable?
Not buying it. A spell worthy of being better than a cantrip must work at least as well as mundane oil.
So... the counterargument appears to be that grease is less flammable than jet fuel, it isn't flammable enough to be flammable?
Not buying it. A spell worthy of being better than a cantrip must work at least as well as mundane oil.
*boggle*
Are you actually telling us that grease is no better than a cantrip if you can't readily light it on fire? That's... well, I don't think it's true.
To a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Are you really suggesting spells should be one-trick ponies?
Oil is slippery, especially on most stone floors. If grease can't be set on fire, then it's not much better than dumping a gallon of oil on the floor.
WAIT NO, it's worse, because you can SET OIL ON FIRE. So in order to be worth a spell slot, grease has to be at least as good as lugging around a gallon of oil. If it isn't flammable, it's not worth it. You're better off preparing any other spell and buying the fighter a gallon of oil to throw at the first pack of monsters.
There is no rules support for it being flammable so it isn't. That does not mean it is not reasonable to allow it, but if it is flammable how long does it burn for? That is just off the top of my head. I am sure other issues can come up.
Since this is the rules thread you mostly get rules based answers instead of "what is reasonable" answers.
|
|
Are you really suggesting spells should be one-trick ponies?
I am flat out saying, per RAW, that is exactly what this spell is. It makes a 10x10 area slippery, or an object or creature slippery. there are degrees of flammability and grease it not on the lines of "drop a torch on it and it burns". If it had a real fuel mixed with it, maybe. As written, no. This is a rules forum.
Make it a spell trick (if that's what it's called). If you include a flask of alchemist's fire in the casting, it becomes flammable.
Oddly I was just having this conversation with a friend of mine. He liked the idea of it being flammable, I thought that combined with the spark cantrip it might end up being too exploitable at low levels. We talked about a higher level spell (not by much) that is similar but is flammable; I'd also say since it's higher level it should cover more area.
Whether you'd determine it was flammable or not, I would say that if you allow it to be flammable, it ceases to be slippery when it starts burning. I can't imagine that if it's burning its friction reducing qualities would remain, although I'm open to other arguments.
Well, as a conjuration spell, it's probably safe to apply just a little bit of physics to it. What burns with most such substances is the vapors coming off of them. So the grease underneath would still be the same as always and just as slippery, at least until the last round or so when most of it has evaporated.
To a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Are you really suggesting spells should be one-trick ponies?
Oil is slippery, especially on most stone floors. If grease can't be set on fire, then it's not much better than dumping a gallon of oil on the floor.
WAIT NO, it's worse, because you can SET OIL ON FIRE. So in order to be worth a spell slot, grease has to be at least as good as lugging around a gallon of oil. If it isn't flammable, it's not worth it. You're better off preparing any other spell and buying the fighter a gallon of oil to throw at the first pack of monsters.
One Trick Pony? Are you serious? Gallon of oil?
Grease doesn't weigh 8 pounds, or have to be retrieved from a pack.
You can throw the oil on the ground from 20' away, but you can't grease a rope from that distance, and you can't do it with a standard action.
You can cause an opponent to drop an object, make climb checks near impossible, make escape artist checks near auto-success, make any surface slippery, a gallon of oil can't slick sand.
You might as well complain that Glitterdust isn't flammable.
WAIT!
Glitterdust isn't flammable????? But it has a huge surface area, like non-dairy creamer!!!!! Or Tang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And everyone knows the Tang Dynasty was the ancient civilization that burned the brightest!!!!!!
What most of you guys are not seeing is the age of the poster...
Cause a lot of us graybeard will tell you hat how we did back in old days. Remember some of us choice elf as our fist class. A lot of this banter is smiles and nostalgia for us. Cause that how it was and will always be... I just turned 39 tuesday and realized I I haved been play D&D in one way or and other for 30 years... Longer than many of the folks on the board have been alive.
|
|
Make it a spell trick (if that's what it's called). If you include a flask of alchemist's fire in the casting, it becomes flammable.
Now what would be a reasonable solution, adding Alchemist's fire as an additional expended component. That would create a fuel aspect, making it ignitable. Using alchemical components to augment spells was included in the Armory supplement, but didn't have this specifically.