why a rat?
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Then the basic same tacics would be used. Take the tusked race trait. Aspect of the Beast for first ranger feat, taken in the shapeshifter archetype ranger, and choose the Form of the Bear for your Shifter’s Blessing. Then two levels of totem barbarian at 4th level and the lesser fiend totem. Full orc is a good choice as well. You want the instant enemy spell as soon as it is available.
and what about my first feat? The other guy said skill focus (survival)
how about this, 3 levels with shape-shifting ranger (or infiltrator), at least two levels of monk (feral combat training plus flurry of blows), and 4 levels of barbarian (lesser fiend).
hmmm it will make things easier
but i need to get weapon focus (claws) before i get feral combat style (claws)
but feral combat would allow me to apply all bonuses of an improved unarmed strike to an natural attack of my choice. That plus the dragon style would be destruction in the making.
the only problem is that dragon style requires three points in acrobatics, any other good styles you know of?
that is true... did not think of that
ok i have a general idea of what i want now thanks for the help
BBT, would this make sense as a lineup?
1st: Ranger 1 - Power Attack
2nd: Ranger 2 - Aspect of the Beast
3rd: Unarmed Fighter 1 - Imp Unarmed, Dragon Style, Weapon Focus: Claws
4th: Barbarian 1
5th: Barbarian 2 - Fiend Totem, Lesser, Feral Combat Training: Claws
6th: MA Monk 1 - (Stunning Fist)
7th: Unarmed Fighter 2 - Dragon Ferocity, Weapon Focus: Bite
8th: XXXX
9th: XXXX - Feral Combat Training: Bite
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BBT, would this make sense as a lineup?
1st: Ranger 1 - Power Attack
2nd: Ranger 2 - Aspect of the Beast
3rd: Unarmed Fighter 1 - Imp Unarmed, Dragon Style, Weapon Focus: Claws
4th: Barbarian 1
5th: Barbarian 2 - Fiend Totem, Lesser, Feral Combat Training: Claws
6th: MA Monk 1 - (Stunning Fist)
7th: Unarmed Fighter 2 - Dragon Ferocity, Weapon Focus: Bite
8th: XXXX
9th: XXXX - Feral Combat Training: Bite
No, you can only use Feral Combat training on one natural weapon. Claws OR Bite not both.
FCT does not state you can take it more then one time so you can't get it more then one time.This flaw right here makes this a bad feat to take for a character that's going to have multiple natural attack types.
Could a Kitsune natural weapon ranger who gains claws through aspect of the beast use them in fox form? And if so what damage would they do? 1d2?
BBT, would this make sense as a lineup?
1st: Ranger 1 - Power Attack
2nd: Ranger 2 - Aspect of the Beast
3rd: Unarmed Fighter 1 - Imp Unarmed, Dragon Style, Weapon Focus: Claws
4th: Barbarian 1
5th: Barbarian 2 - Fiend Totem, Lesser, Feral Combat Training: Claws
6th: MA Monk 1 - (Stunning Fist)
7th: Unarmed Fighter 2 - Dragon Ferocity, Weapon Focus: Bite
8th: XXXX
9th: XXXX - Feral Combat Training: BiteNo, you can only use Feral Combat training on one natural weapon. Claws OR Bite not both.
FCT does not state you can take it more then one time so you can't get it more then one time.This flaw right here makes this a bad feat to take for a character that's going to have multiple natural attack types.
Hrm...That opens up some things and closes others...
*contemplates 2 level dip into Alchemist for Feral Mutagen and Vestigial Limbs*
Yeh that's the kind of build I was leaning towards
Well maybe not the alchemist part
Is it possible to make an animal lord natural weapon ranger?
Remember, nothing say the claws gained by the Lesser Beast Totem can't be on your feat. Four claws with that.
You, sir, are a deliciously evil little thing.
Remember, nothing say the claws gained by the Lesser Beast Totem can't be on your feat. Four claws with that.
So, five natural attacks by level 4? My apologies to your GM.
Yeh the template in bestiary 3
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So is the Deinonychus, and it's clawed little feet.Remember, nothing say the claws gained by the Lesser Beast Totem can't be on your feat. Four claws with that.You, sir, are a deliciously evil little thing.
Deinonychus don't have claws on their feet, they have Talons. Functionally the same but a separate entry in the natural attacks column and any attempt to use natural attacks with your feet needs to be either a Hooves or Talons now.
This means no foot claws anymore, and this little trick is no longer legal.
Claws only go on hands for bipeds.
N Medium animal
Init +6; Senses low-light vision, scent; Perception +14
DEFENSE
AC 15, touch 12, flat-footed 13 (+2 Dex, +3 natural)
hp 34 (4d8+16)
Fort +8, Ref +6, Will +2
OFFENSE
Speed 60 ft.
Melee 2 talons +5 (1d8+2), bite +5 (1d6+2), foreclaws +0 (1d4+1)
Special Attacks pounce
any attempt to use natural attacks with your feet needs to be either a Hooves or Talons now.
This means no foot claws anymore, and this little trick is no longer legal.Claws only go on hands for bipeds.
Is this an actual rule, or an extrapolation based on changes to Bestiary entries?
Edit: Relevant entry from Summoner, Eidolon section:
Claws (Ex): An eidolon has a pair of vicious claws at the end of its limbs, giving it two claw attacks. These attacks are primary attacks. The claws deal 1d4 points of damage (1d6 if Large, 1d8 if Huge). The eidolon must have the limbs evolution to take this evolution. This evolution can only be applied to the limbs (legs) evolution once. This evolution can be selected more than once, but the eidolon must possess an equal number of the limbs evolution.
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Foot claws has been argued many times, it has yet to be disproved(effectively).
Here is an example of what you argue against:
Agathion, Leonal
This lion-headed humanoid has golden fur, sharp teeth, and long cat-like claws on its hands and feet.
Yes, this Agathion is called out as having claws on it's feet however it can only make 2 claw attacks a round not 4 and the only time it could use those foot weapons is during a rake (since it's grappling with it's arms or mouth if you want to take those penalties).
Talons are defined as a specific type of claw and it is only ever used in any of the bestiaries as on the lower extremities.
Claws on the feet are called talons. Talons have a specific entry under natural attacks. Therefore to have claws on your feet you need to have talons.
edit: @serisan, The eidolon is a giant collection of rules exceptions. It is not a valid choice for rulings.
So no animal lord?
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The Agathion can make additional claws upon a charge.
Not quite, it means that anyone who has Pounce and Rake gets two free ADDITIONAL CLAW attacks. Nothing in that ever states these are made with your feet, all it says is you get 2 extra claw attacks. It's claws are on it's hands so it gets to attack twice more with it's hands.
A creature with this special attack gains extra natural attacks under certain conditions, typically when it grapples its foe. In addition to the options available to all grapplers, a monster with the rake ability gains two free claw attacks that it can use only against a grappled foe. The bonus and damage caused by these attacks is included in the creature’s description. A monster with the rake ability must begin its turn already grappling to use its rake—it can’t begin a grapple and rake in the same turn.
The only place it has ever been stated that you can attack with weapons on your feet are under Talons and boot blades.
Now, since we have actual examples of using feet to attack anything that doesn't state feet are allowed means you can't use them. Pathfinder is an exclusive system of rules, it only states what you CAN do, everything else is denied.
Does anyone know how to make an animal lord a pc? Also would it affect my level?
edit: @serisan, The eidolon is a giant collection of rules exceptions. It is not a valid choice for rulings.
If that is the case, can you point to a general rule rather than specific monsters to support your interpretation?
The eidolon example, while it may or may not be exceptional, was what I was able to find on the subject when it comes to generation.
Could a Kitsune natural weapon ranger who gains claws through aspect of the beast use them in fox form? And if so what damage would they do? 1d2?
Nobody an answer for that?
i guess it would work
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edit: @serisan, The eidolon is a giant collection of rules exceptions. It is not a valid choice for rulings.If that is the case, can you point to a general rule rather than specific monsters to support your interpretation?
The eidolon example, while it may or may not be exceptional, was what I was able to find on the subject when it comes to generation.
Your previous example is an exception itself. That entry specifically states that these claws can be applied to an eidolon's feet and can only be done once. No other entry on any ability that grants claws states that. This is one of the many examples of powers that eidolons get that is different then for every other PC/NPC choice out there.
edit: @serisan, The eidolon is a giant collection of rules exceptions. It is not a valid choice for rulings.If that is the case, can you point to a general rule rather than specific monsters to support your interpretation?
The eidolon example, while it may or may not be exceptional, was what I was able to find on the subject when it comes to generation.
Your previous example is an exception itself. That entry specifically states that these claws can be applied to an eidolon's feet and can only be done once. No other entry on any ability that grants claws states that. This is one of the many examples of powers that eidolons get that is different then for every other PC/NPC choice out there.
Again, while that may be the case, please provide your evidence rather than repeatedly asserting your claim. I understand that specific trumps general. So far, you've provided evidence of a specific, and I've provided evidence of a specific. I'm still looking for evidence of a general rule. If you have one, please provide.
Also, keep in mind that it's quite possible to have several sets of the Limbs Evolution, which makes a difference in terms of how you would want to word it.
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edit: @serisan, The eidolon is a giant collection of rules exceptions. It is not a valid choice for rulings.If that is the case, can you point to a general rule rather than specific monsters to support your interpretation?
The eidolon example, while it may or may not be exceptional, was what I was able to find on the subject when it comes to generation.
Your previous example is an exception itself. That entry specifically states that these claws can be applied to an eidolon's feet and can only be done once. No other entry on any ability that grants claws states that. This is one of the many examples of powers that eidolons get that is different then for every other PC/NPC choice out there.
Again, while that may be the case, please provide your evidence rather than repeatedly asserting your claim. I understand that specific trumps general. So far, you've provided evidence of a specific, and I've provided evidence of a specific. I'm still looking for evidence of a general rule. If you have one, please provide.
Also, keep in mind that it's quite possible to have several sets of the Limbs Evolution, which makes a difference in terms of how you would want to word it.
Please remember that the basic ruleset is an exclusive setup. The default assumption for any question is no, unless you find a rule that says you can.
Putting fighting claws anywhere other than your front appendages is the same as asking:Can I jump off this cliff and fly away? (no, unless you have an ability that says you can like flight, wings or airwalk spell)
Can I wield this wand with my ponytail? (No, unless you have prehensile hair hex)
Can I put claws on my feet ? (No, unless you are playing an eidolon with the legs evolution and even then you can only do it on one pair)
Add to that if there is a rule that specifically addresses something that you are trying to do (ie use a natural attack with your feet) and that calls out a specific type that does that (hooves & Talons) then unless you find another rule or example that does what you are trying to do then you can't.
The real question you need to ask is:
"Is there any rule in any Paizo book that says I CAN put claws on my feet AND attack with them?"
Hey sorry to interrupt the discussion but is it possible to use an animal lord for an natural weapon ranger? And if so, how?
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Hey sorry to interrupt the discussion but is it possible to use an animal lord for an natural weapon ranger? And if so, how?
Animal lord is a special template that can only be applied to humanoids of more then 10 hit die.
Now IF you managed to make it to 10th level and IF your DM rules that class level hit dice equals racial hit die and IF your GM rules that one of the gods decides to choose you as the new animal lord then yes, you can play an animal lord.
I really wouldn't hold your breath for this series of IF's to happen.
I have to say, the default assumption is "ask your GM."
Ok I was thinking of making a race with my gm that is a toned down version of the animal lord.