Goblin Squad Member
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I'm afraid I'm treating this whole topic more as an MMORPG tutorial than anything else, so apologies if this thread isnt much value. Nonethless (in the hope there's someone on the internet who might like to share their opinions about things...):
Have there been any successes/failures at implementing an 'expanding' world?
It seems to me that a reasonable objection to player-made-stuff is that the world has to be huge in order to give everyone room and not overly preference those who were able to play one hundred hours per week in the first month of the game's existence. A massive, 'empty' world seems like it would inevitably lead to repetitive, bland scenery (or repetitive, annoying 'wandering monsters') since actually crafting an interesting world with the intention of it soon being overwritten by players would just be a massive waste of effort.
One solution would appear to me to have the fringe of the map ever expanding (in an admittedly bland way, but hopefully out where nobody noticed except for when they wanted to build something). In future updates/releases of new material (I presume that happens relatively frequently?) new dungeons could be 'discovered' near those newly settled areas - some of which didnt even exist on the games release.
It may seem this would no doubt violate people's sense of verisimilitude, but I wouldnt really see that in a practical sense - I wouldnt imagine you seeing these extra areas being added on, although there might be a way through the swamp you didnt manage to find last time you were there.
No doubt there are other problems, but I'd be interested to hear what those have proven to be. My experience is pretty much restricted to MUDs and the addition of new areas there was always commonplace, though facilitated by the extremely restricted style of MUD navigation.
Is this common in MMORPGs? Doomed to failure?
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Goblin Squad Member
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It wouldn't necessarily have to violate anybody's verisimilitude. I for one am actually open the game continues to expand outwards from the River Kingdoms into the surrounding regions (as it grows and gains the resources to do so of course.)
I guess that surprises me. I would have expected you to object if, when you turn up at Oleg's, there's suddenly a road to Brevoy which wasnt there last week.
Having said that, I dont think it should be an issue. It seems to me that's more an issue of meta-verisimilitude* since it wouldnt impact on any specific session of play.
* I'm sure that's a word.
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It wouldn't necessarily have to violate anybody's verisimilitude. I for one am actually open the game continues to expand outwards from the River Kingdoms into the surrounding regions (as it grows and gains the resources to do so of course.)
It certainly isn't the norm nowadays, and I highly doubt it is a popular opinion that I hold, but I would love to see a return to meaningful travel. I understand that at the higher levels of the game, travel can be very repetitive and people do not necessarily wish to trudge through scenery for 15 and 20 minute journeys for the hundredth time, but one of the points that stood out to me about Golarion from the beginning was the promise of meaningful travel, and the limitations that the Pathfinder RPG placed upon teleportation and the like were features that I thought were awesome and would love to see in PFO.
A sandbox game will need such travel restrictions, imo, because otherwise the sandbox too quickly begins to feel far too small. Also, a huge selling point of sandbox style gaming is that the journey is as important as the destination. This is certainly true of the tabletop games, but it is an idea that has been discarded in today's current MMO market, wherein the journey is just a minor annoyance to be raced through in the haste to get to endgame.
It wouldn't necessarily have to violate anybody's verisimilitude. I for one am actually open the game continues to expand outwards from the River Kingdoms into the surrounding regions (as it grows and gains the resources to do so of course.)
That would be great if PFO were really successful. It would be phenomenal if the developers, after a year or more after released, created the reams of Cheliax and the rest.
I don’t think the ‘there was not a road here before” would be much of a problem. Yes, it would detract from the immersion of the game – for a time – but, I think that this would be a worthy sacrifice for an expanding world.
I was really excited by this but when i searched through different PF wikis and found the "river kingdoms" i was sort of under-whelmed by the map. I was hoping to make my guild on an island off the coast. So myself and fellow guildies can sail forth and raid people's settlements.
You thought the River Kingdoms were on the coast? :P
I didn't even know what they were.
I was really excited by this but when i searched through different PF wikis and found the "river kingdoms" i was sort of under-whelmed by the map. I was hoping to make my guild on an island off the coast. So myself and fellow guildies can sail forth and raid people's settlements.
I am assuming/hoping that the developers chose the River Kingdoms, in part, because it is a land locked “country” – well, separate, city-states that refuse to work together – technically. Anyway, the point is that River Kingdoms is land locked…meaning that the developers can expand the world in all directions.
Ustalov, Razmiran, and Numeria to the east. Brevoy to the north. Kyonin and Galt to the south. The west? According to the Inner Sea World Guide, that is the absolute edge of the map. And all of these countries have a grudge against the River Kingdoms because of its free spirit and tendency to harbor unseemly characters and political upstarters.
As far as islands go…it is the “River” Kingdoms. While there are no oceans, there is plenty of naturally occurring water masses – rivers, lakes, marshes, and whatnot. Imagine having a tower on an island in the middle of the river...automatic traffic control. Fortunately, River Kingdoms is a “free” land and bandits who tax traveling merchants are thanked by a spear in their side. :)
