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For anyone who has run Dudemeister's Kankerata Run - how did the centaurs manage Kankerata's Den (location 6)?
> 6. *~Kankerata’s Den A) Don’t Wake the Beast (Stealth DC 30) B) Scale the Ceiling (Climb DC 25)
The centaurs have no Stealth skill, so they're not going to be hitting a DC 30 check. Their Climb skill is +6, so they *can* make the DC 25 Climb check, but they're going to be failing a lot before moving out of that location... 90% of the time, they're going to remain on the card and have to roll again next round.
Also, it's one of the locations where Kankerata spring-attacks anyone who fails. A Giant Advanced Bulette's bite is +17 to hit and does 4d6+15/19-20 damage, and a regular centaur has AC 20 and 30 hp - Kankerata can easily one-shot them. Even Danide, with her AC of 21 and 93 hp, is going to be in trouble after a few rounds of failed Climb checks.
Obviously I can change the details of that location in my game, tinkering with the DCs and the skill checks, but I'm wondering how the challenge as originally presented by Dudemeister played at the table.
N.B. The regular centaur statblock in the Bestiary has them wearing breastplate, reducing their movement to 35', so they don't get any bonus on Chase checks from their speed (RAW Paizo's Chase rules say "for every 10 feet faster than the baseline speed he moves, he gains a cumulative +2 bonus on these checks"... that seems like unnecessary rounding off to me, making it +2 per 10 feet rather than +1 per 5 feet. I'm going to change it to +1 per 5 feet, so a move speed of 35' does in fact get +1 relative to a move speed of 30')
In my game, I think the two centaur warriors and Danide will put aside their shields for the run to avoid the heavy shield ACP on their Acrobatics/Climb checks. Danide has the advantage of Barbarian speed, so she's moving at 40' and gets +2 on chase checks even when wearing breastplate. Xamanthe will turn up wearing leather armor, able to move at her full 50' speed and thus get +4 on chase checks, trusting to speed (and thus a better chance of success) instead of AC to protect herself against Kankerata's attacks.
So, the Varnholders made agreements/treaties with the Nomen when they first arrived in their territory, and then did things they thought were legitimate without any re-negotiation, which the Centaurs considered to be breaking the spirit of the agreement. Since the two sides weren’t in constant daily contact, the usual re-hashing didn’t occur, and so the Nomen came to view the two-legs as untrustworthy oath-breakers, while the Varnholders came to believe the Nomen to be belligerent fantasists who kept claiming they'd agreed on things that were never mentioned.
This is a lovely conceit, with the centaurs having signed off on a meaningless piece of paper from their point of view, and the Varnholders being able to easily point to the broken treaty that was made. It's a nice fit for the Centaur oral histories, and and nice culture clash.
For anyone who has run Dudemeister's Kankerata Run - how did the centaurs manage Kankerata's Den (location 6)?
In general, the centaurs in my game did not do too well in the Run. For this location though, one made the check and one initially failed. A couple of PCs also failed and they helped fight off Kankerata so that all three could escape.
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I had the son of the opposition leader in the centaur tribe participate in the Kankerata Run; he was a centaur called Krojun-Eats-What-He-Kills (a nod to the History of A Thousand Ashes). Besides his centaur HD, I gave him 12 levels of unchained barbarian (with the primal warrior and invulnerable rager archetypes). Despite his high level, he only had a Climb +6 and Stealth -1 total (while wearing armour). He was the ONLY centaur in the Run who made the Climb check (DC 25) for navigating through the Den location thanks to a high die roll (eventually).
However, he came in 2nd place as the party's alchemist, a Small grippli, was managing to breeze through many of the locations thanks to his skill modifiers and took the first place quite decisively; climbing was a cake-walk for him. He had a boosted ego after that for a long time.
Fun fact: Krojun failed his Climb check initially in the Den and got attacked by Kankerata who swallowed him on the first bite. The mighty centaur proceeded to cut his way out of its stomach with a knife and then managed to climb out of the Den. While Krojun did not win the Run, everyone was impressed that he not only managed to finish the Run, he also survived being swallowed by Kankerata for a few rounds. The party were convinced that having all-out war with the centaurs was probably a very bad idea. ;)
CB
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In general, the centaurs in my game did not do too well in the Run. For this location though, one made the check and one initially failed. A couple of PCs also failed and they helped fight off Kankerata so that all three could escape.For anyone who has run Dudemeister's Kankerata Run - how did the centaurs manage Kankerata's Den (location 6)?
In my game a PC stayed to keep the Kankerata distracted, and another cast levitate on a Centaur to get them out. The den is really a morality test.
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In my game a PC stayed to keep the Kankerata distracted, and another cast levitate on a Centaur to get them out. The den is really a morality test.
Ok - that's cool. I hope they earned some bonus Trust Points for stopping and helping their opponents out of a sticky situation :)
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In my game a PC stayed to keep the Kankerata distracted, and another cast levitate on a Centaur to get them out. The den is really a morality test.Ok - that's cool. I hope they earned some bonus Trust Points for stopping and helping their opponents out of a sticky situation :)
Yeah I didn't really think of it as a morality test (though in hindsight that seems pretty obvious) but I certainly did give them some bonuses for helping the centaur out.
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The way I looked at it, the Kankerata Run is a test for the newer generations of centaurs on becoming adults and it has multiple purposes. It tests their physical abilities to the extreme, but it also tests their luck. It sometimes puts them into situations where they choose between personal glory and tribal solidarity. And if they are unlucky, Kankerata teaches them that there is always a terrifying beast that will kill you with a single bite; death isn't always a glorious end, sometimes it is just you being somebody else's latest flavoured snack.
Thus, they give centaurs attempting the Run the moonlit torcs of passage to avoid being killed by Kankerata. Withdrawing from an encounter with opponent that could kill you 10 times out of 10 encounters is the best choice you could make for the tribe (especially if you are male!).
For my players who did help out the centaurs, I gave them a bonus to their Diplomacy checks with the centaurs and used the opportunity for the players to turn those they helped into "contacts" within the tribe that they could work with to gain favours/assistance, kind of like building a relationship.
As for the centaurs who failed the Run, the opportunity to retake the test again one year later allows them the time required to re-train their skills or gain class levels to put skill ranks towards the more appropriate skills so that they will have an easier time on the 2nd or 3rd time around. Which makes the Run also a method of encouraging their young to train harder, heh.
Life as a centaur is harsh, ;).
CB
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Since my PCs are a little stronger than base due to some house rules, I like to make my monsters stronger too when they're important and more numerous when they aren't important.
So for the centaurs I replaced their monster HD with ranger levels, and as a result they have a passable stealth score, slightly higher health and 1st level ranger spells.
Even so, one of them failed and nearly died in the result of it weren't for the party healer hanging back and helping the centaur out (he was loosing and knew he couldn't personally win any sort of race with the others, but he could probably at least finish with the ability to fly under his belt)
I decided this centaur would be the one that they found in vordakai's lair so they made a friend