Is there a spell that will provide a continuing light source that is strong enough to outright prevent the effects of deeper darkness?
a light subtyped spell of higher level.
It's a level 3 spell. Casting Daylight (also level 3) cancels both leaving other light sources working again. If you want to overpower it, Heighten Daylight to 4th.
Meh. Buy a Continual Flame Heightened to level 5. Problem solved.
==Aelryinth
Don't play low level mods written by Tim Hitchcock.
You know it's funny but I've seen this stymied high level characters too. Everyone thinks they are pass the 'deeper darkness phase' of the game, stops preparing daylight, neglects to get a scroll of it (which you can't use in the darkness anyways since you can't see it) sells their hand of glory and suddenly bam! deeper darkness the room goes black and everyone's cursing as the dark stalkers stab them repeatedly.
The wizard dispels it once, the next dark stalker in initiative simply drops it back on, the cleric dispels it once, another dark stalker does it again, the wizard uses his last dispel and then another deeper darkness happens and they are out of dispels, and still without light.
Meh. Buy a Continual Flame Heightened to level 5. Problem solved.
==Aelryinth
The best solution I have seen!
Though it requires a 9th level caster.
If you have a normal mundane lightsource that gives off Normal Light, then it is only normal darkness and Darkvision will still work.
If you rely entirely on magic lighting, then you are out of luck. (Unless you get a Daylight casting by higher CL.)
@Xraal: nope, mundane lightsources don't work at all in magical darkness
@Xraal: nope, mundane lightsources don't work at all in magical darkness
Yes, reading it I would think so too, but then it makes no sense to mention how many "levels" of dark it adjusts with.
If it annuls all light sources, that is darkness. But in addition, it reduces prevalent light by two steps, which completely makes nonsense of the first statement. (Since the annulment means the prevalent light is "darkness", going down two steps from there is Supernatural Darkness and then Supernatural Darkness +1)
However, it is not crazy, it is poorly worded. There is a clarification by James Jacobs to be found here:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/deeper-darkness
He states:
"Supernaturally dark is where darkvision turns off, basically.
If you cast deeper darkness on a sunny day out under the sky, the area of effect drops two steps from bright light to dim light. Cast it on normal light, and it puts the area into regular darkness that darkvision can see through.
Darkvision is only blocked if you cast deeper darkness in areas of dim light or darkness.
(Sorry the previous explanation was too brief... I spat it out too quickly without having a PFRPG handy to look at, and was too lazy to look the spell up online.)" - James Jacobs, Creative Director.
According to that description by James, the darkness line spells does NOT annul existing mundane light sources. - It DOES annul lower spell level MAGIC light sources.
It is simply a case where you look at the prevalent light level and then subtract a number of steps, as indicated by the spell description.
As far as I can tell there are these steps of light:
Bright light - Sun and Daylight spell does this.
Normal light - Many lanterns and Light spell does this.
Dim light - Outskirts of Normal light and Normal light his by Darkness spell.
Darkness - The default if no light sources are present. What Dim light becomes under Darkness.
Supernatural Darkness - Darkvision does not work here.
The reason Darkness and Deeper Darkness hurt adventuring parties so bad, is the frequent reliance on 0- level Light spells as the only light source.
He states:
"Supernaturally dark is where darkvision turns off, basically.If you cast deeper darkness on a sunny day out under the sky, the area of effect drops two steps from bright light to dim light. Cast it on normal light, and it puts the area into regular darkness that darkvision can see through.
Darkvision is only blocked if you cast deeper darkness in areas of dim light or darkness.
(Sorry the previous explanation was too brief... I spat it out too quickly without having a PFRPG handy to look at, and was too lazy to look the spell up online.)" - James Jacobs, Creative Director.
This is correct (and doesn't really need clarification from the prd text imho). But do note that nonmagical light sources do not increase the light level in the area affected by a darkness spell.
This is correct (and doesn't really need clarification from the prd text imho). But do note that nonmagical light sources do not increase the light level in the area affected by a darkness spell.
He states:
"Supernaturally dark is where darkvision turns off, basically.If you cast deeper darkness on a sunny day out under the sky, the area of effect drops two steps from bright light to dim light. Cast it on normal light, and it puts the area into regular darkness that darkvision can see through.
Darkvision is only blocked if you cast deeper darkness in areas of dim light or darkness.
(Sorry the previous explanation was too brief... I spat it out too quickly without having a PFRPG handy to look at, and was too lazy to look the spell up online.)" - James Jacobs, Creative Director.
Yes it does; otherwise casting Deeper Darkness on Normal light would give you Supernatural Darkness +1... And it does not, it only gives "Darkness" implying that the Normal light is still there, just reduced by two steps.
From my understanding, Deeper Darkness drops the ambient light level by 2 steps, and any mundane lightsource is treated as if it isn't there at all.
Yes it does; otherwise casting Deeper Darkness on Normal light would give you Supernatural Darkness +1... And it does not, it only gives "Darkness" implying that the Normal light is still there, just reduced by two steps.
No it doesn't.
Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness. Magical light sources only increase the light level in an area if they are of a higher spell level than darkness.
From my understanding, Deeper Darkness drops the ambient light level by 2 steps, and any mundane lightsource is treated as if it isn't there at all.
This would be my take as well.
And it does not, it only gives "Darkness" implying that the Normal light is still there, just reduced by two steps.
The light is still there, correct. However, the light does not *increase* the light level. If the ambient conditions are darkness (say, torch in a dark room with no other light sources) and the torch is in a darkness spell effect, the torch does not increase the light level beyond darkness. It's still lit and still there. It's just not raising the light level -- meaning it has no light effect.
Now, if you were to take the torch out of the darkness effect, it would function normally. If the torch were *adjacent* to a darkness spell effect in an otherwise dark room, the torch's light would even go in the darkness spell effect area. The light would be lowered one step (normal light -> dim light, dim light -> darkness). But put the torch in the darkness effect area and it fails "to increase the light level" *in any way*. Since the base room was dark, it can't be brighter than dark without the torch increasing the light level -- which the spell description says can't happen.
Where does "ambient" light come from in your heads? - It comes from a mundane light source.
If there is no light source, there is no light.
If the Sun is the only light source that count as "ambient" to you two, then you need to look up the word "ambient" in the dictionary.
And even under that premise, sunlight is mundane...
Where does "ambient" light come from in your heads? - It comes from a mundane light source.
If there is no light source, there is no light.
If the Sun is the only light source that count as "ambient" to you two, then you need to look up the word "ambient" in the dictionary.
And even under that premise, sunlight is mundane...
The sun and light sources outside the darkness spell effect function as normal. If the sun somehow entered a cosmically large darkness spell effect (godly power I guess?), it would fail to produce any light (assuming the sun is non-magical).
Ambient light sources generally refer to light sources outside the darkness effect. If all the light sources are in the darkness effect (if they were all gone, the room would be dark), there is no ambient light.
Where does "ambient" light come from in your heads? - It comes from a mundane light source.
If there is no light source, there is no light.
If the Sun is the only light source that count as "ambient" to you two, then you need to look up the word "ambient" in the dictionary.
And even under that premise, sunlight is mundane...
Xraal,
You're missing the point. If the source of light is inside the effect, it doesn't work.If the source is outside the effect of the spell, it still sheds light.
Example 1 :
Noon Day Sun
Sun is outside the spell.
Sunlight is shed through darkness spell.
Darkness spell reduces the light by 2 levels to dim light.
Example 2 :
Torch sitting 5 feet outside darkness spell.
Torch is outside darkness, it sheds light.
It sheds light out to 20 feet (15 feet into the darkness).
Spell reduces that light by 2 levels.
An additional 20 feet out the torch produces dim light.
Darkness spell reduces dim light to supernatural darkness (no darkvision).
Example 3 :
Torch is sitting 5 feet inside the darkness spell.
Torch sheds no light at all, and you can't see the torch if you are outside the darkness spell.
EDIT: As pointed out below, all references here are meant to be for deeper darkness
Keep in mind we're talking about two different spells, darkness and deeper darkness.
Regular darkness just lowers ambient light by one step.
Deeper darkness lowers ambient light by two steps.
So in a room of ambient normal light (light sources outside the darkness effect), a lit torch in a deeper darkness effect cannot be seen at all (it's in darkness).
In a room of ambient normal light, a lit torch in a darkness spell can be seen (it's in dim light).
Thank you mdt, that does make sense.
So, if hit by a normal Darkness spell, throw your pebble with Light on it out of the affected area and the resulting overlapping area will be Dim light.
Thank you mdt, that does make sense.
So, if hit by a normal Darkness spell, throw your pebble with Light on it out of the affected area and the resulting overlapping area will be Dim light.
Yep, because the source of illumination is outside the darkness spell. The spell only cancels light sources inside it's area of effect and lowers ambient light by one level.
Since Light is a 0 level spell, if the pebble is inside the spell, then it winks out. If it's outside the area of effect, then the ambient light it's shining is reduced (basically canceling the effect of the darkness where they overlap, since darkness is a one light level effect).
Example, if you had a room that was dimly lit, and someone cast darkness on a pebble and dropped it. Then someone else cast Light on a pebble and dropped it just outside the effect of the Darkness, you'd have this situation.
10 feet of normal light (from light pebble)
10 feet of dim light (mixed darkness/light)
10 feet of darkness (not supernatural, from dark pebble)
Assuming the pebbles both had a radius of 10 feet.
Different but related question:
Assuming normal (human) vision, can you see "through" an area of magical darkness? (Since it only adjusts light-levels.) Or does it act like a black sphere that you cannot see through with normal sight? Is this true also when the magical darkness gets to the point of absolute darkness where even darkvision doesn't work?
The question arises, because in theory if you can see "through" a darkness spell, you can see the silhouettes of creatures inside the darkness if the backdrop on the other side is bright enough.
Personally, I don't read 'ambient light' to mean 'any light outside the darkness effect'. I interpret it as 'natural light level'. All the spell say is that nonmagical light sources can't increase the light level. It doesn't mention anything about this only being true if the source of light is inside the area of darkness.
If you are standing in a dark cave, holding a torch, and someone casts darkness. You are now standing in darkness. The light of the torch is suppressed by the darkness effect, but the darkness doesn't have any other effect (since it's now normally dark).
If you are standing in a cave lighted by torches along the walls, and someone casts darkness on you, you are now standing in darkness. The torches outside the area are not suppressed, but the light of the torches are suppressed inside the darkness effect (nonmagical light sources can't increase the light level), but the darkness doesn't have any other effect (since it's now normally dark).
If you are standing in a dark cave, dimly lit by daylight coming through cracks in the ceiling, holding a torch, and someone casts darkness on you. You are now standing in darkness. The torch you are holding is suppressed. The natural light level of the cave is Dim (I consider sun/moon/starlight 'natural light' that sets the basis for the general light level around you). Darkness reduces this by one level to Dark.
If you are standing in a house on a cloudy afternoon, not holding a torch (because that'd be silly) and someone casts darkness on you. You are now standing in dim light.
If you are standing in an open field on a sunny afternoon, and someone casts darkness on you. You are now standing in normal light.
All that is, of course, entirely IMHO. But it's totally how I'd rule it (because throwing a torch out of the darkness area to lighten the darkness area is silly).
Different but related question:
Assuming normal (human) vision, can you see "through" an area of magical darkness? (Since it only adjusts light-levels.) Or does it act like a black sphere that you cannot see through with normal sight? Is this true also when the magical darkness gets to the point of absolute darkness where even darkvision doesn't work?
With deeper darkness in normal ambient light conditions, the spell effect appears like a black sphere.
With darkness in normal ambient light conditions, the spell effect appears like a translucent, opaque sphere. You can see through it, but I'd imagine it would be like looking through very strong sunglasses.
The deeper darkness spell is more powerful than the regular darkness spell in that darkvision does not apply to the dim light and darkness created in the spell effect. Thus, in my first example with deeper darkness above, the sphere would also appear to be black to a character with darkvision.
With the darkness spell example above, the sphere would not hinder a character with darkvision. They'd see through the "sunglasses" effect with no problem.
The question arises, because in theory if you can see "through" a darkness spell, you can see the silhouettes of creatures inside the darkness if the backdrop on the other side is bright enough.
That's correct. If the ambient light is bright, you can see through even deeper darkness (it's just dim light inside the effect). Creatures with darkvision would also see the "sunglasses" effect (darkvision wouldn't help them).
If you are standing in a cave lighted by torches along the walls, and someone casts darkness on you, you are now standing in darkness. The torches outside the area are not suppressed, but the light of the torches are suppressed inside the darkness effect (nonmagical light sources can't increase the light level), but the darkness doesn't have any other effect (since it's now normally dark).
The key is "nonmagical light sources". If sources aren't in the spell effect, the spell has no effect on them.
Different but related question:
Assuming normal (human) vision, can you see "through" an area of magical darkness? (Since it only adjusts light-levels.) Or does it act like a black sphere that you cannot see through with normal sight? Is this true also when the magical darkness gets to the point of absolute darkness where even darkvision doesn't work?
With deeper darkness in normal ambient light conditions, the spell effect appears like a black sphere.
With darkness in normal ambient light conditions, the spell effect appears like a translucent, opaque sphere. You can see through it, but I'd imagine it would be like looking through very strong sunglasses.
The deeper darkness spell is more powerful than the regular darkness spell in that darkvision does not apply to the dim light and darkness created in the spell effect. Thus, in my first example with deeper darkness above, the sphere would also appear to be black to a character with darkvision.
With the darkness spell example above, the sphere would not hinder a character with darkvision. They'd see through the "sunglasses" effect with no problem.
The question arises, because in theory if you can see "through" a darkness spell, you can see the silhouettes of creatures inside the darkness if the backdrop on the other side is bright enough.That's correct. If the ambient light is bright, you can see through even deeper darkness (it's just dim light inside the effect). Creatures with darkvision would also see the "sunglasses" effect (darkvision wouldn't help them).
But... is this opinion or can you show this in RAW?
By RAW the area affected by darkness or deeper darkness has an illumination rating. (Bright, Normal, Dim, Dark, Super Dark)
If the character looking has a vision mode that is able to see in the relevant category, then by RAW he can also see all the way through to the other side.
- This is of course limited to the total distance the character's visibility modes support.
A source of light that is "behind" the darkened area is either close enough that the area is affected by it and thus the area is illuminated by the relevant number of steps. - Or it isn't and the darkness is just dark.
What I mean is, if you are on side A of an area of Deeper Darkness, and the Sun is shining Brightly from the opposite side, B, then the area is Dimly lit, and a character with Lowlight vision or Darkvision can see just fine and humans would get their Dim light penalties.
If someone pulls the curtain at point B, lowering the Bright light to Normal light, then the dark area can no longer be seen through by Lowlight vision, but Darkvision still could. The area is now "Dark".
If the shutters are closed, the only light seeping in is Dim, making the area Super Dark, and no one but certain monsters can see through it.
If someone at B then had a special magic light that illuminated a single 5 ft. square with Bright light, but for some reason the effect is described as limited to that one square, then someone at A would NOT be able to see through the darkness at all.
The only time you would be able to see silhouettes in a darkened area, is if the light on the other side actually overlaps into the darkened area and increase the light level to something your character's eyes can penetrate.
@Slaunyeh, the rules may be silly but them's the rules. Houseruling is fine, as long as that is what we agree you are doing in your interpretation above.
Consider this:
A long tunnel, with bright light conditions at either end, but (natural) darkness in between. Even without darkvision you can easily see through the tunnel to the bright lit area beyond. Anything inside the tunnel would be visible as a silhouette.
If we have that same scenario but cast some magical darkness in the tunnel. Will the magical darkness now prevent seeing through (for non-darkvision people)?
What about casting deeper darkness to end up with super-darkness in the tunnel. Can you see "through" it to the bright side beyond?
Consider this:
A long tunnel, with bright light conditions at either end, but (natural) darkness in between. Even without darkvision you can easily see through the tunnel to the bright lit area beyond. Anything inside the tunnel would be visible as a silhouette.
If we have that same scenario but cast some magical darkness in the tunnel. Will the magical darkness now prevent seeing through (for non-darkvision people)?
What about casting deeper darkness to end up with super-darkness in the tunnel. Can you see "through" it to the bright side beyond?
Given this:
End one A.1 = Bright light
Tunnel close edge A.2 = Normal light
Tunnel further in A.3 = Dim light
Tunnel middle B = Normal Darkness
Tunnel further in C.3 = Dim light
Tunnel close edge C.2 = Normal light
End two C.1 = Bright light
As B is unaffected by A(all) and C(all), casting Darkness on B will make that area Supernatural Darkness in illumination level. It is now impossible to see from A to C.
Casting Deeper Darkness would have the same result. It would actually be at Supernaturally Dark +1.
If we took a normal candle (giving Dim light) and took it to the edge of A.3, and another to the edge of C.3, and assuming we do not put them (their source) inside the darkness but assume their illumination radius meet inside the darkened area, then;
The illumination level under the Darkness spell is increased from Supernatural Darkness to just Normal Darkness. - A character would now be able to see the light at C from A, but only in the area where the candle radii overlap.
A Deeper Darkness spell would still be at Supernatural Darkness and thus impenetrable.
That is based on the fact that you can see a cigarette butt pretty far away in Normal Darkness, even though you can't actually see in Normal Darkness.
It could be argued that magical darkness increased to Normal Darkness is impenetrable, but if we increased it to Dim Light then no one would argue that you couldn't see from A to C.
Ergo I opt to interpret Normal Darkness as normal, common, real world darkness where you can detect a light source pretty far away, even if it does not illuminate the dark place itself. (B)
This is not in conflict with RAW but since it is not explicitly stated, this is just the "least RAI" I can think up.
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"Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness."
This sentence applies to all nonmagical sources of light, not just sources within the area of darkness.
No matter where the source of light is, it does not increase the light level in an area of darkness.
"Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness."This sentence applies to all nonmagical sources of light, not just sources within the area of darkness.
No matter where the source of light is, it does not increase the light level in an area of darkness.
Wrong. If a non-magical source of light is outside of a darkness spell effect, it is not subject to the rule you quoted. The rule you quoted only applies to non-magical sources of light inside the darkness spell effect.
Non-magical light sources *outside* of a darkness spell effect function normally.
The light that the light sources give out outside the darkness spell effect is modified by the darkness spell effect. But that light is considered "ambient" light outside the spell effect.
Think about it this way. Light streams from a light source. If the light source is in a darkness spell effect, it can't stream out at all -- the light source is "stopped up". If the light source is outside the darkness spell effect, it streams out in all directions (like a sphere) for a certain radius. That light is modified by the darkness spell effect -- but the light source isn't affected.
By RAW the area affected by darkness or deeper darkness has an illumination rating. (Bright, Normal, Dim, Dark, Super Dark)
There's no "super dark" illumination rating.
The lowering of light level made by the deeper darkness spell defeats darkvision -- that is, if you make dim light with deeper darkness, a creature with darkvision sees things dimly -- the darkvision doesn't help. In a deeper darkness spell effect in a dark room, the area in the deeper darkness effect cannot be seen through by a creature with darkvision. But that doesn't make the darkness "super darkness" or darker than dark. It's just that spell effect's area's darkness defeats darkvision.
By RAW there's only bright light, normal light, dim light, and darkness. There's no additional level of illumination.
I think this thread proves the update to Darkness just makes the game confusing.
I think this thread proves the update to Darkness just makes the game confusing.
+1 -- but really the confusion started with 3.5.
I think this thread proves the update to Darkness just makes the game confusing.+1 -- but really the confusion started with 3.5.
No, this is WAY more confusing.
3.5 Darkness - object radiates shadowy illumination and cannot be penetrated by anything that lets you see in the dark. That is of course kind of waffly because shadowy illumination is basically a non-defined term other than "it's not light."PF Darkness - area becomes darker than it currently is but it may or may not be magically dark so you may or may not be able to see in it. No source of non-magical lighting works in an area of darkness, but everything BUT non-magical lighting is how ambient light is defined and therefore ANY area where darkness is cast that isn't magically lit plunges to straight "I can't see a damn thing" (the sun is NOT magical lighting if you missed my point here). The spell was updated but not proofread/playtested by casual (read crazy) players.
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Non-magical light sources *outside* of a darkness spell effect function normally.
They function normally outside the darkness effect. No one is arguing they do not. But the spell itself explicitly states that nonmagical sources of light do not increase the light level inside the spell's effect.
The light that the light sources give out outside the darkness spell effect is modified by the darkness spell effect. But that light is considered "ambient" light outside the spell effect.
Wait, the light outside the spell effect is modified? Why? How?
Also, the word "ambient" does not appear in the spell description, nor in the Vision and Light rules section. Are you referring to some mechanic for "ambient" light somewhere else in the rules?
I think this thread proves the update to Darkness just makes the game confusing.+1 -- but really the confusion started with 3.5.No, this is WAY more confusing.
3.5 Darkness - object radiates shadowy illumination and cannot be penetrated by anything that lets you see in the dark. That is of course kind of waffly because shadowy illumination is basically a non-defined term other than "it's not light."
A non-magical light source was also suppressed in a 3.5 darkness spell effect.
Normal lights (torches, candles, lanterns, and so forth) are incapable of brightening the area, as are light spells of lower level.
No source of non-magical lighting works in an area of darkness, but everything BUT non-magical lighting is how ambient light is defined and therefore ANY area where darkness is cast that isn't magically lit plunges to straight "I can't see a damn thing" (the sun is NOT magical lighting if you missed my point here).
Ambient light is simply light from light sources that are outside the spell effect.
A non-magical light source was also suppressed in a 3.5 darkness spell effect.Normal lights (torches, candles, lanterns, and so forth) are incapable of brightening the area, as are light spells of lower level.
Of course they were, but 3.5 also wasn't screwing around with changing the light level in the area. Darkness was a binary thing - either it was in effect and it was dark, or it wasn't in effect and it wasn't.
Ambient light is simply light from light sources that are outside the spell effect.
Which don't increase the light level inside the area. Otherwise it just makes it confusing AND silly. "Hey, some one cast darkness on us, we can't see! Oh wait, quick, toss your lantern outside the area of darkness and the darkness will get brighter."
But the spell itself explicitly states that nonmagical sources of light do not increase the light level inside the spell's effect.
If a non-magical source of light is outside the spell effect, it is not affected by the spell.
So you're saying that every time you cast a darkness spell, it affects the sun? I don't think the sun is in range (:
The light that the light sources give out outside the darkness spell effect is modified by the darkness spell effect. But that light is considered "ambient" light outside the spell effect.Wait, the light outside the spell effect is modified? Why? How?
The light that *is emitted from a source outside the spell effect* is modified. The light source itself isn't modified.
Also, the word "ambient" does not appear in the spell description, nor in the Vision and Light rules section. Are you referring to some mechanic for "ambient" light somewhere else in the rules?
I think it's just shorthand for "the area's light level". But you're right, the specific word isn't used. For instance, in a dark cave there is no ambient light. If you're in a room in a house, the default ambient light comes from the windows or lights in the room. If it's night and there are no lights on, there's no ambient light. If a darkness spell effect fills a room with a sunny window, the sunny window isn't suppressed -- it's not really a light source (the sun is). So the light level in the room would most likely be dim light in a darkness spell effect. That's why casting darkness outside in the daytime isn't extremely effective.
Ambient light is simply light from light sources that are outside the spell effect.Which don't increase the light level inside the area. Otherwise it just makes it confusing AND silly. "Hey, some one cast darkness on us, we can't see! Oh wait, quick, toss your lantern outside the area of darkness and the darkness will get brighter."
Yes, that's about right. If you throw a rock with the light spell on it outside the darkness spell effect, the light from that light source goes into the darkness spell effect area -- which lowers the light one step. So the light source's normal light would be dim light in that area. The light source's dim light would be darkness.
That's also one reason why deeper darkness is a more powerful spell -- it has a 60 ft. radius.
In 3.5, the light coming from the light rock would have overlapped with the "streaming shadowy illumination". But the "streaming shadowy illumination" doesn't create light. If you cast darkness in the dark, you see nothing. If you cast a light spell outside the spell effect, you still see the light -- but it gets "muddled" by the darkness spell effect.
That's also one reason why deeper darkness is a more powerful spell -- it has a 60 ft. radius.
No, it was already like that. It's really a more powerful spell now because it makes it darker.
That doesn't make the series make any more sense.
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If a non-magical source of light is outside the spell effect, it is not affected by the spell.
So you're saying that every time you cast a darkness spell, it affects the sun? I don't think the sun is in range.
Light *sources* are not affected by the spell at all. Only *light itself* is affected, specifically the light level inside the spell's radius.
The spell description explicitly states that the light level inside the spell's effect is not increased by non-magical light sources. The spell description does not constrain that effect based on the location of the light source.
That's also one reason why deeper darkness is a more powerful spell -- it has a 60 ft. radius.No, it was already like that. It's really a more powerful spell now because it makes it darker.
That doesn't make the series make any more sense.
A bigger area to hit more light sources. If a room has lots of non-magical light sources then the spell's area may not potentially cover all the light sources. You may not be able to throw a lighted rock outside of a deeper darkness effect.
And if the darkness spell is used appropriately (in cramped quarters with no ambient light), you can't really get any light sources that aren't affected by the darkness spell.
The spell description explicitly states that the light level inside the spell's effect is not increased by non-magical light sources.
Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness.
Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do increase the light level outside an area of darkness.
But darkness only works on the following two things:
* Light coming into it (lowered one step)
* Light sources in an area of darkness. (Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness.)
They don't increase the light level in an area of darkness.
Restated, that means in the spell effect area of darkness, the light sources do not increase the light level -- they fail to function.
But that doesn't mean that light sources outside the darkness spell effect fail to function.
@meabolex, James Jacobs introduced the term "supernaturally dark" as a category below normal darkness. The only level of light that darkvision cannot see through.
I just took the liberty of calling that category Super Dark. :-)
And if the darkness spell is used appropriately (in cramped quarters with no ambient light), you can't really get any light sources that aren't affected by the darkness spell.
Light the wall up.
I don't think you can
@meabolex, James Jacobs introduced the term "supernaturally dark" as a category below normal darkness. The only level of light that darkvision cannot see through.
I just took the liberty of calling that category Super Dark. :-)
So then there must also be a category "supernaturally dim light" -- since Deeper Darkness cast in an area of bright light would create dim light that darkvision cannot see through.
(Naming both categories is kind of unnecessary, but whatever (: )
@meabolex, James Jacobs introduced the term "supernaturally dark" as a category below normal darkness. The only level of light that darkvision cannot see through.
I just took the liberty of calling that category Super Dark. :-)
So then there must also be a category "supernaturally dim light" -- since Deeper Darkness cast in an area of bright light would create dim light that darkvision cannot see through.
(Naming both categories is kind of unnecessary, but whatever (: )
False. Until you get to "Super Dark" (or "impossibly dark" or "darker than dark" or "by the gods, I'm blind!"), "normal" methods of penetrating dimmer light work.
Like I said. Confusing.