What is the difference between summoning a creature and calling it? Yes, I know that when you call a creature that it is there for real and will die if it is killed. I also know that summoned creatures reform after they die. However, what exactly is different about summoning a creature that allows it to reform?
I've read in a few places that a summon is really just a 'mirror' of the creature that you are summoning, but I haven't been able to find anything official about this in the Pathfinder core rulebook.
I'm asking about this mostly for roleplaying purposes, because I'm wondering about whether or not my good aligned character should worry about curing my summons of diseases and curses before dismissing them. I had always assumed that diseases and stuff would go away when a summoned creature is dismissed because it isn't there for real, but my rp group is giving me a hard time about it ;)
The background info is from earlier editions. It may take Paizo a while to duplicate this information if they have not done so already. They do have a number of Chronicles books out so it may be in one of them.
I don't think a good aligned creature would waste resources since the summon auto-cures when it goes back home anyway. It is essentially just a gesture of kindness.
PS:Let nobody tell you how to RP your character. Then again if you burn a restoration on a summon that is not really affected by it when they need it due to a vampire(energy drain) or ability drain they might change their minds. :)
The background info is from earlier editions. It may take Paizo a while to duplicate this information if they have not done so already. They do have a number of Chronicles books out so it may be in one of them.
I don't think a good aligned creature would waste resources since the summon auto-cures when it goes back home anyway. It is essentially just a gesture of kindness.
PS:Let nobody tell you how to RP your character. Then again if you burn a restoration on a summon that is not really affected by it when they need it due to a vampire(energy drain) or ability drain they might change their minds. :)
Ahh, that's from previous editions? That explains why I haven't been able to find it anywhere. Well, I guess I might have to just ask my GM about it to see how it will work in his game world, lol.
It isn't that they're telling me how to RP my character, I guess it was more of a disagreement over whether or not these things really harmed the summons in the long run. They seemed to think that summons would only get auto-cured of hit point damage and such (since hp is all that is mentioned by RAW).
The background info is from earlier editions. It may take Paizo a while to duplicate this information if they have not done so already. They do have a number of Chronicles books out so it may be in one of them.
I don't think a good aligned creature would waste resources since the summon auto-cures when it goes back home anyway. It is essentially just a gesture of kindness.
PS:Let nobody tell you how to RP your character. Then again if you burn a restoration on a summon that is not really affected by it when they need it due to a vampire(energy drain) or ability drain they might change their minds. :)Ahh, that's from previous editions? That explains why I haven't been able to find it anywhere. Well, I guess I might have to just ask my GM about it to see how it will work in his game world, lol.
It isn't that they're telling me how to RP my character, I guess it was more of a disagreement over whether or not these things really harmed the summons in the long run. They seemed to think that summons would only get auto-cured of hit point damage and such (since hp is all that is mentioned by RAW).
Pathfinder is basically an update, and a lot of the generic things have not changed. The real creature is never really affected by the summoned one. Decapitation kills the summon, but when it is sent away it is ok again as an example.
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I think the best explanation of the summon monster spells, is that u actually conjure or make the monster, it is therefore a copy of its race but has never been alive as its made entirely out of whatever it is you conjure stuff with. That would also explain why monsters lack certain key abilities when they are "summoned" or as i would say conjured, simply becouse those abilities cant be duplicated with ectoplasma (or the stuff used to conjure with). This would also mean that the summoned monsters is in no way real, and you dont need to treat them well even as good characters. This is either a downside or upside depending on rp situations.
What is the difference between summoning a creature and calling it? Yes, I know that when you call a creature that it is there for real and will die if it is killed. I also know that summoned creatures reform after they die. However, what exactly is different about summoning a creature that allows it to reform?
I've read in a few places that a summon is really just a 'mirror' of the creature that you are summoning, but I haven't been able to find anything official about this in the Pathfinder core rulebook.
I'm asking about this mostly for roleplaying purposes, because I'm wondering about whether or not my good aligned character should worry about curing my summons of diseases and curses before dismissing them. I had always assumed that diseases and stuff would go away when a summoned creature is dismissed because it isn't there for real, but my rp group is giving me a hard time about it ;)
I don't remember how exactly it is supposed to work, whether it's a mere copy that you summon (meaning that the original stays on its own plane)
or if it's something more tangible, BUT the fact remain that the monster goes back unescathed.Remember that you are requesting the presence of a creature from another plane of existence. With summoning, the creature can manifest and act, by the sheer force of magic, but it's only a temporary conduit and as soon as the link is broken, things goes back as they were before the spell went into effect. That's how I see the process, at least.
Like others have said, you can rp as you see fit, personally I wouldn't bother, but if you care for the summoned creature and cure it, you might as well question the summoning in the first place (you are making something suffer for your own goals).
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Its basically just a permanent vs temporary duration difference IMO. The permanent one actually brings it here, while the temporary one just borrows it.
Calling: A calling spell transports a creature from another plane to the plane you are on. The spell grants the creature the one-time ability to return to its plane of origin, although the spell may limit the circumstances under which this is possible. Creatures who are called actually die when they are killed; they do not disappear and reform, as do those brought by a summoning spell (see below). The duration of a calling spell is instantaneous, which means that the called creature can't be dispelled.
Summoning: A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower, but it is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can't be summoned again.
When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.
Summoning, especially an outsider, is essentially astral projection in reverse. You summon an outsider's astral form which takes bodily shape on manifestation, (just as you would if you astrally projected yourself to another plane). If that manifestation is killed then just like what would happen to a PC the manifestation ends and it's soul is snapped back to it's own body.
A Calling spell physically brings the entire creature to your doorstep, so it faces real mortal death when it arrives.
+1 to LazarX
no +2
Cool, thanks for the clarifications. I really like the astral projection explanation; the fact that there is an existing precedent in the raw pathfinder rules for creating a copy of yourself to travel to another plane will make explaining this to my group a little easier ;)
Summoning, especially an outsider, is essentially astral projection in reverse.
Agreed; the difference between summoning and calling is like the difference between Astral Projection and Plane Shift -- one actually brings the creature's physical form to another plane, and the other just makes a functional copy out of "spirit-stuff".