I've only just gotten around to collecting the various pieces of the Rise of the Runelords adventure path - I've heard superb things about it, and with the way that Pathfinder has been taking off, it seems that it might one day be remembered with the same fondess as such classics as Keep on the Borderlands. I just had to make sure to get it.
I have the first two modules so far and I'm looking over them, hoping a group will come along that I can actually run them for. However, they seem to be built using 3.5 rules, and I have every intention of running them with the PF system. Now, I know that pathfinder is meant to be backwards compatable, but there are a few issues that I forsee arising. The first is that the enemies will be much easier for Pathfinder characters than they will for 3.5. Even their updated pathfinder stats are invariably listed as CR-1 when compared to those presented in the adventure path. Short of going back and rewritting every encounter by adding class levels or additional foes, is there an efficient way to correct this?
The other is experience. Even using the fast XP track in the core rulebook, PCs are going to level up more slowly than they did in 3.5. Does RotRL have enough optional content to carry the PCs to the appropriate levels for the each module in the AP? If not, are there any recomendations to remedy this?
I'm running RotRL for PF for the second time (the first was during the PF Beta playtest), so I'll see what I can do to help.
Starting at the bottom and working up:
For the XP problem the are a few possible solutions. My favorite is ignoring XP entirely; find out what the XP would bring your players if you ran it using 3.5 for your number of players and between each mini-adventure in each book advance them accordingly. With PF scraping XP costs knowing the exact total isn't all that necessary. Another is to alter the encounters so that the XP progresses at the rate to match what you would like. This can ramp up the difficulty pretty fast, however (not that it is too big of an issue - the adventure path is rarely anything resembling "difficult" if your players are experienced; if they optimize they'll roll through it as written with ease). Or, since PF strengthens PC's (at least over 3.X core), let them advance at a slower rate than the AP assumes, they will likely be strong enough to handle it anyway. A final solution is to give out a total of XP at the end of each session to match the rate at which you would like them to advance, regardless of the amount of XP they would have earned through their encounters.
As to the difficulty of encounters...I prefer to rewrite them. When I ran it during Beta, I rewrote them to match PF rules, which was a quick fix, and if I felt the difficulty needed a leg up I just added another class level, or barring the effort to do that gave +1 to all saving throws, attack rolls, caster level, skill checks, and ability checks, and 5 to 10 extra HP and called it a day - worked fine (though I REALLY prefer having all NPC's built within the rules of the game). Running with current rules, including the APG, I did quite the overhaul on the AP. For example, Nualia became an Oracle and Lyrie a Witch. This took more time, but also let the encounter difficulty keep up with the PC's and stayed within the flavor of the story. Obviously any NPC with class levels will need an adjustment at least, but for a quick change to anything else just to increase the difficulty a bit try adding the Advanced or Giant Templates from the Bestiary.
Or just add more. More is good. More goblins, more sinspawn, more, well, anything. More monsters means an increased EL and an increase in XP, which nicely solves both problems. For fights against NPC's this approach will work fine as well, just give them more henchmen, or in the absence of them, add them.
Greetings, fellow travellers.
rant
Lucky bastard, I was only able to secure #2, #4 and #6 of RotRL *grml*
/rant
The AP was written for D&D 3.5. You can get a conversion guide for free for D&D --> PF here on Paizo.
For XP: I would stick to the XP mentioned in the encounters and use the table provided in the 3.5 player's book. Works fine for a group where we just changed from 3.5 to PF and the GM was too lazy to convert monsters.
I think, I remember that James Jacobs said somewhere the table in 3.5 player's guide and the medium advancement track in PF are roughly comparable (and all AP use the medium advancement track as default).
The rewriting due to tougher PCs built according to PF rules could be circumvented by either boosting the monsters, say with the advanced template or 1 to 2 HD or class levels or adding additional (weaker) monsters or just give every monster full hp.
/edit: Ah, just read that's what you wanted to avoid... Anyways, if you fear, there's not enough XP the addition of monsters is a good way to remedy that, isn't it?
You know your players best, so I would run some encounters as written and see how they fare - if it's too easy for them, rewrite the encounter.
Have you checked the AP boards? Methinks, there is a thread where someone has done all that work already.
/Edit2: Found it: RotRL conversion thread.
Ruyan.
They have done awesome job... want more...
There is a specific forum for RotRL stuff here:
http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/adventurePa th/runelords
There are even threads about conversion, difficulty adjustments, additional materials, etc.
The first few encounters are generally considered very easy for 3.5, and that makes it super easy for Pathfinder. If you find it, the total conversion is great, but not strictly necessary. I would avoid doing a half-conversion-on-the-fly however. For the most part, just throw in more mooks, and let everyone adjust to new characters. By the middle of the first book, things are tougher, and you can figure out how to adjust for your specific group (if you need to at all).
If you don't want to go through conversions much, and you feel the enemies are worth -1 CR, I'd just add in an extra enemy or two where needed to balance out the encounter. I'm rather partial to bigger encounters though (multiple weak foes > single strong foes), so your mileage may vary. I've found this has always been a very effective method for adapting quickly to larger or smaller parties, and stronger parties too. You can simply find the XP balance you want and tweak as desired.
If you just want to make 'em tougher, I'd throw a couple NPC levels on enemies. Aristocrat, Expert, or Warrior 2 are quick and easy ways to add +1 CR onto an enemy and pad their saving throws and HP a little more. Adept 1-2 is a good option for a support character, and they have access to some good spells through scrolls & wands.
I'd advise caution against inflating their HP unnaturally though. As one poster mentioned giving monsters max HP. I find this method to be filled with traps. Firstly, I dislike that sort of thing 'cause in my mind it's cheating (unless you give all your players max HP). I also dislike it because it diminishes the value of characters who are damage dealers (if you give NPCs max HP, most all fighter-types will suffer, and blaster-mages will suffer). In short, proceed with such ideas with extreme caution.
Well, I doubt this would work later in the AP, but for Burnt Offerings, I've thought about making all the rank and file goblins 1st level fighters instead of 1st level warriors. Thoughts?
Greetings, fellow travellers.
Sounds good to me. I've done that with my Kingmaker campaign - poor litte buggers wouldn't last a round.
For the following books it should work in a similar way - just add the appropriate level of the creature's class (if any, otherwise just advance it 1-2 HD) and level it up like any other NPC.
Ruyan.
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I think, I remember that James Jacobs said somewhere the table in 3.5 player's guide and the medium advancement track in PF are roughly comparable (and all AP use the medium advancement track as default).
The 3.5 xp chart is roughly equivalent to the fast progression given in the PRPG Core book. I'm in a group playing through RotRL using the Fast chart, and going into the second book we were pretty much right at the level we should have been.
I went through the first two RotRL with Pathfinder PCs and we got mauled a couple of times.
It ended in a TPK, essentially, in the 2nd adventure.
Don't make it harder than it already is! We started with Monk, Rogue, Cleric, Sorcerer and it was quite tough. We ended (died) with Fighter, Monk, Inquisitor, Sorcerer....