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(This is a copy of the topic I posted in the Rules area. Upon reflection it would seem better placed in Advice. I trust the POWERS-THAT-BE will delete the *other* thread if needs. Thank you for your patience.)
Lullaby spell:
School enchantment (compulsion) [mind-affecting]; Level bard 0
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area living creatures within a 10-ft.-radius burst
Duration concentration + 1 round/level (D)
Saving Throw Will negates; Spell Resistance yes
Any creature within the area that fails a Will save becomes drowsy and inattentive, taking a -5 penalty on Perception checks and a -2 penalty on Will saves against sleep effects while the lullaby is in effect. Lullaby lasts for as long as the caster concentrates, plus up to 1 round per caster level thereafter.
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Backround
I plan to play a gestalt Sandman Bard/Dreamspun Sorcerer who has became addicted to roaming Lovecraft's Dreamland while he was a member of a Dream Cult in our homebrew Lovecraft-Arabian Nights campaign.
As a Sandman Bard the character will be able to send targets of his bardic performance to sleep, as per [Sleep] spell. As a Dreamspun Sorcerer the character will be able to cast Lullaby as SA 3+Cha mod/day.
Dreamspun Spell-Like Ability 'Lullaby':
Lullaby (Sp): At 1st level, you can use lullaby as a spell- like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This effect lasts for 1 minute and does not require concentration. The penalty on saves versus sleep effects increases to –4.
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Problem
-- How best to use Lullaby to support Sleep effects?
-- What exactly are sleep 'effects'? Sleep, Deep Slumber, Symbol of Sleep?
-- Would it possible to use Lullaby and the the Sandman's Slumbersong ability?
-- Would casting the Lullaby be classed as 'initiating combat' and as such prevent the Fascinate/Suggestion(Slumbersong) effect?
-- How would you play such a class combination/character?
Slumber Song (Sp): At 6th level, a sandman can use his performance to cause a creature he has already fascinated to fall asleep (as deep slumber, but with no HD limit). Otherwise, this ability functions like suggestion.
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Thank you for your time.
...and a -2 penalty on Will saves against sleep effects while the lullaby is in effect.
If you are asking whether or not Lullaby will affect the will saves of those affected by Slumber Song, then this is the answer. Slumber Song is a sleep effect and the will saves would be modified.
If you are asking whether or not Lullaby will affect the will saves of those affected by Slumber Song, then this is the answer. Slumber Song is a sleep effect and the will saves would be modified.
...and a -2 penalty on Will saves against sleep effects while the lullaby is in effect.
Thank you for replying.
The thing I am worried about is that, by casting the spell, combat has been initiated/the target might be aware and become hostile towards the caster. I believe this would make it impossible for the Sandman Bard to use their Slumbersong ability.
Slumber Song (Sp)
At 6th level, a sandman can use his performance to cause a creature he has already fascinated to fall asleep (as deep slumber, but with no HD limit). Otherwise, this ability functions like suggestion. This performance replaces suggestion.
Fascinate (Su)
At 1st level, a bard can use his performance to cause one or more creatures to become fascinated with him. Each creature to be fascinated must be within 90 feet, able to see and hear the bard, and capable of paying attention to him. The bard must also be able to see the creatures affected. The distraction of a nearby combat or other dangers prevents the ability from working. For every three levels a bard has attained beyond 1st, he can target one additional creature with this ability.
Each creature within range receives a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 the bard’s level + the bard’s Cha modifier) to negate the effect. If a creature’s saving throw succeeds, the bard cannot attempt to fascinate that creature again for 24 hours. If its saving throw fails, the creature sits quietly and observes the performance for as long as the bard continues to maintain it. While fascinated, a target takes a –4 penalty on skill checks made as reactions, such as Perception checks. Any potential threat to the target allows the target to make a new saving throw against the effect. Any obvious threat, such as someone drawing a weapon, casting a spell, or aiming a weapon at the target, automatically breaks the effect.
Fascinate is an enchantment (compulsion), mind-affecting ability. Fascinate relies on audible and visual components in order to function.
So.. Sandman casts Lullaby then uses Bardic Performance and then Slumbersong? Possible or..
-- Does the initial Lullaby count as combat? It's casting a spell on a target so I think it might make it impossible to Fascinate the target after the spell has been cast.
Hmm...
Sleepy... z.z
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Spell-Like Abilities: Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor never affects a spell-like ability’s use, even if the ability resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.
A spell-like ability has a casting time of 1 standard action unless noted otherwise in the ability or spell description.
In all other ways, a spell-like ability functions just like a spell. Spell-like abilities are subject to spell resistance and dispel magic. They do not function in areas where magic is suppressed or negated. Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counterspell, nor can they be counterspelled. Some creatures actually cast arcane spells as sorcerers do, using components when required. Some creatures have both spell-like abilities and actual spellcasting power.
Emphasis Mine.
It depends... based on RAW it probably does seeing as it functions just like a spell in all other ways... on the other hand this spell isn't likely very flashy or noticeable in its effects and SLAs don't have verbal, somatic, or material component. If it was me running I'd say you could get away with it... so I guess the main thing to do would be to ask your DM.
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Thank you for the information.
..so I guess the main thing to do would be to ask your DM.
Aye, that I will be doing - the specifics of Spell Like abilities that you highlighted coupled with the interesting character concept should be enough to get it the DM NOD OF APPROVAL.
:)