|
Let's say a barbarian has exited his rage and is fatigued. That condition says he can "move at half speed". It does not say his speed is cut in half.
Haste says "All of the hasted creature's modes of movement (including land movement, burrow, climb, fly, and swim) increase by 30 feet, to a maximum of twice the subject's normal speed using that form of movement."
So if the bbn has a base land speed of 40 ft, I'm thinking that the haste adds 30 ft to make 70 ft, then the fatigue cuts it in half, resulting in 35.
Or does the fatigue happen first, which makes his 40 ft into 20 ft, then the haste adds up to 30 ft to make it 50 ft? (I'm letting haste add 30 ft instead of 20 because fatigue doesn't change the base speed, it only limits how much of your base speed you're allowed to use.)
What about magical flying? If a spell provides a movement of 60 ft, how would fatigue and haste affect it? And does it matter if the flying is achieved with wings?
Let's say a barbarian has exited his rage and is fatigued. That condition says he can "move at half speed". It does not say his speed is cut in half.
They're synonymous. Don't try to read too much into the rules. That leads to rules lawyering. Rules lawyering leads to munchkinism. Munchkinism leads to hate, which leads, to fear, which leads to insanity, which leads to Buffalo NY. And you do not want to wind up in Buffalo NY.
So if the bbn has a base land speed of 40 ft, I'm thinking that the haste adds 30 ft to make 70 ft, then the fatigue cuts it in half, resulting in 35.
This is how you should probably do it.
Or does the fatigue happen first, which makes his 40 ft into 20 ft, then the haste adds up to 30 ft to make it 50 ft? (I'm letting haste add 30 ft instead of 20 because fatigue doesn't change the base speed, it only limits how much of your base speed you're allowed to use.)
I wouldn't try to treat fatigue differently from any other movement, or else things get insane. Lets say your barbarian is standing in a swamp that halves movement. Why would a haste spell added in a swamp ( 40/2 =20 +20 (since haste is capped at the creatures movement) = 40 make him move faster than one that had been added before he walked in ( (40 +30= 70/2=) 35 feet ? What happens if the spell is cast in the swamp , he leaves the swamp, and then comes back? Movement penalties work best by squares (1 square= 2,4, or 8 squares) and you can't do that if the bonus to speed is relative to the square you were standing int when it was cast.
What about magical flying? If a spell provides a movement of 60 ft, how would fatigue and haste affect it? And does it matter if the flying is achieved with wings?
"Using a fly spell requires only as much concentration as walking" it doesn't say how much EFFORT it requires, but unless i saw something else i would assume it requires the same amount of effort so yes, you're too tired to fly at full speed.
hmmmm .. am i missing something?
Fatigued: A fatigued character can neither run nor charge and takes a –2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. Doing anything that would normally cause fatigue causes the fatigued character to become exhausted. After 8 hours of complete rest, fatigued characters are no longer fatigued.
- i don't see anything about moving at half speed.
All of the hasted creature's modes of movement (including land movement, burrow, climb, fly, and swim) increase by 30 feet: that would increase your fly speed by 30, then (as stated above) i would cut it in half.
|
|
Doh! You're right! I used "fatigued" in my question and I should have used "exhausted"! Double-darn. I could end up in Buffalo/NY after all...
The bbn is fatigued right now, but I expect the exhausted condition will be applied soon and I wanted to be prepared. :)
So it sounds like both of you are suggesting haste, then exhausted, as the order to apply them in. Is there any rules quote to support that? What about other hindrances to movement?
I agree that the "gut feeling" is to apply haste first, but I can't really put my finger on why that feels better...
|
|
Aha! I found this in the Combat section under Tactical Movement:
Bonuses to Speed: A barbarian has a +10-foot bonus to his speed (unless she's wearing heavy armor). Experienced monks also have higher speed (unless they're wearing armor of any sort). In addition, many spells and magic items can affect a character's speed. Always apply any modifiers to a character's speed before adjusting the character's speed based on armor or encumbrance, and remember that multiple bonuses of the same type to a character's speed don't stack.
That doesn't say what order to apply other conditions (exhausted, entangled, slow spell, etc) but it's a good start for more research.
It almost sounds like all spells (haste, slow, etc) should be applied FIRST, then armor and encumbrance factored in. Which is exactly what King of Vrock said.
But it doesn't help when one modifier says to add a certain amount (haste adds +30 ft) and another says to apply a percentage reduction (exhaustion says to cut speed in half). :(
IMO you :
1) add or subtract any modifier to your initial speed: for example +30ft ,-20 ft or whatever.
2) Then apply any armor or encumbrance penalties.
3) You multiply the new speed by the multiplier -> 0.5 in the case of exhaustion.
At least this is how we always played and this is how I receive the results that I would expect from the system.