I have a slight dislike for the item creation system as it currently stands. I especially dislike that a crafter has access to every item in the book as long as he has the correct feats. That is why I have come up with a simple solution for my own Campaigns that I would like to share with you.
Magic item schematics:
You must identify the item and write down its schematic in your workbook costing 5 gp per caster level of the item. You start with 3+int modifier schematics when you take an item creation feat. The caster level of the items described in the schematics can’t exceed your caster level or ranks in relevant skill (Usually spellcraft) whichever is higher. Successfully writing a schematic into your workbook is DC 10+caster level of the item using your relevant item crafting skill. Each time you gain a new caster level or rank in the relevant skill you gain a new schematic in your workbook. Potions, spell-trigger and spell-completion items don’t need schematics and are only limited to the spells you can cast or have access to. A typical workbook has 100 pages and weigh 3 lbs. It costs the same as an empty spellbook +5 gp for every page of schematics in the book.
If you want to include schematics as treasures you can replace some scrolls and spellbooks found with similarly priced schematics and workbooks.
I like it. May have to try it out with maybe a few tweaks.
Yes, I understand your concern that there doesn't seem to be anything in place to prevent a low level character making a high level (CL) item, except the money. Of course with the exception in items that specifically designate the creator needs to be 'x' caster/character level to create the item.
But one of the biggest things that always prevent low level characters from creating powerful items is the money that is needed to make them.
I know in some campaigns, money is easier to come by, but the way my DM runs is he tries to follow the allotted treasure value per level for each character, as close as possible. So a lot of funds is something we have never run into unless we save for awhile.
But I have some questions in regards to your rules.
What exactly is the 3+int modifier used for? Is that added onto your roll when making the 10+DC check to add a schematic to your book? And are you allowed to use Cha or Wis, for the spellcasting classes that have those as their primary abilities, instead of Int?
When you refer to 'caster level of the item', are you referring to the one listed in the book for each item?
What exactly is the 3+int modifier used for?
I think that is how many magic item blueprints you get. So if your a wizard with 16 int, you get 6 magic item recipes of your choice.
I love the idea, especially in a low magic campaign, but I am not sure if they players are getting their "feats" worth. Maybe if you combined some of the craft feats together it would be better, or eliminate the need for the feats in the first place, the feats grant you bonus schematics but you never actually need the feat, the spell casting prerequisites, the skill rolls, and the schematics are all that are actually needed. So if a player finds a schematic, they can potentially make it without the feats.
I think they would be getting their "feats" worth,they could possibly get one new schematic per level after receiving the feat as well, to say that they've been tinkering with runes, arcanic writings and studying in their free time on how to improve their repertoire.
I love this idea, works well in a steam punk world as well, and meshes well with the concepts of magic as study based and makes a new commodity, worth its weight.
Nicely done Mort. I will be jacking this for my world ^_^
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Ooooo liking this so far.
How about Skematics are the only things you HAVE to have to create an item, but the feats are still 'requirements' in that you need to add +5 to the DC if you don't have them :)
Or, heck, do the same but make the feats 'important requirements' that add +10 to the DC if you don't have them :P
So, taking the feat grants you 3+INT Skematics, and knocks off 5 or 10 from the DC to create that entire type of items. Sounds pretty good to me :)
EDIT: By the by, and idea how would you price Skematics? I'd assume it would be heavily based on the item and/or its caster level.
Ooooo liking this so far.
How about Skematics are the only things you HAVE to have to create an item, but the feats are still 'requirements' in that you need to add +5 to the DC if you don't have them :)
Or, heck, do the same but make the feats 'important requirements' that add +10 to the DC if you don't have them :P
So, taking the feat grants you 3+INT Skematics, and knocks off 5 or 10 from the DC to create that entire type of items. Sounds pretty good to me :)
EDIT: By the by, and idea how would you price Skematics? I'd assume it would be heavily based on the item and/or its caster level.
id say 50 gp per caster level sounds reasonable
What exactly is the 3+int modifier used for?I think that is how many magic item blueprints you get. So if your a wizard with 16 int, you get 6 magic item recipes of your choice.
Ok, right. He did say you 'start with 3+Int modifier schematics'.
But my question still stands from before, can you switch out the Int modifier with the class' primary spellcasting ability score? For example, Wisdom for a Cleric or Charisma for a Sorceror?
Id say Int or Wis strictly and IMO keep it with Int since your crafting, Cha wouldnt have anything to do with your ability to study a magical item and jot down its specs for future creations
You also gain a new schematic each time you gain a new rank in the relevant crafting skill (usually spellcraft) OR a new caster level (you choose when you take the relevant craft feat). 50 GP per item level seems reasonable for a schematic. I would also allow researching schematics like spells. I'm currently testing this system in my Serpent's skull Campaign, although none of the players have a craft feat yet so I haven't got to test them much.
But my question still stands from before, can you switch out the Int modifier with the class' primary spellcasting ability score? For example, Wisdom for a Cleric or Charisma for a Sorceror?
I think it should remain Int only, but if you feel it hampers other casters feel free to do what you want in your Campaigns ;)
You also gain a new schematic each time you gain a new rank in the relevant crafting skill (usually spellcraft) OR a new caster level (you choose when you take the relevant craft feat). 50 GP per item level seems reasonable for a schematic. I would also allow researching schematics like spells. I'm currently testing this system in my Serpent's skull Campaign, although none of the players have a craft feat yet so I haven't got to test them much.
But my question still stands from before, can you switch out the Int modifier with the class' primary spellcasting ability score? For example, Wisdom for a Cleric or Charisma for a Sorceror?I think it should remain Int only, but if you feel it hampers other casters feel free to do what you want in your Campaigns ;)
Well, it wouldn’t be for my campaign, but something I was thinking about bringing up to my DM. I’ll be honest, I kind of agree I think the way crafting is done that is too open and easy to make high level items.
I only asked if it could be done for the ability of the primary spellcaster because your rules do limit the amount of schematics you can have at only 1 a level (barring ones you find in treasure). Where I think it is good to limit the CL on making the items, I do feel you should have the option to eventually craft all the items at high level (with the associated crafting feats).
1. What if you want to create a custom item?
2. What is the benefit of the feats if the items you can make are restricted? As it stands the only reason I would take the feats is so I can get what I want in a non magic-mart game.
1. What if you want to create a custom item?
2. What is the benefit of the feats if the items you can make are restricted? As it stands the only reason I would take the feats is so I can get what I want in a non magic-mart game.
1. Creating custom items :
Minor Researching Fees = 25gp per Caster lvl
Research Time = + 1 Day per 5000 gp of its base cost
Research takes a bit of time and lil bit of money.
2. I cant remember strict RAW, but making items is 2/3rds to 3/4s cheaper than buying wholesale from local marty
1. What if you want to create a custom item?
2. What is the benefit of the feats if the items you can make are restricted? As it stands the only reason I would take the feats is so I can get what I want in a non magic-mart game.
1. Creating custom items :
Minor Researching Fees = 25gp per Caster lvl
Research Time = + 1 Day per 5000 gp of its base cost
Research takes a bit of time and lil bit of money.
2. I cant remember strict RAW, but making items is 2/3rds to 3/4s cheaper than buying wholesale from local marty
It is half price to make your own items, but do you guarantee downtime to make them? Downtime is the biggest inhibitor to magic item creation.
PS: I don't know your group so I am just curious as to how this works in actual play.
I am currently a player in the Kingmaker AP, and the wizard in our group has gone crafting crazy, creating all the items we need. I can't remember the last time we kept something we found or bought something at the market. Everyone has optimal gear, probably more than we are supposed to at our level. In Kingmaker downtime is no problem, but that may of course be different in other Campaigns.
I wanted my players to get excited when they found new items and I enjoy role-playing tracking down new items to buy or create. That is why I came up with the schematics idea.
I forgot to write that you could add the schematics of items you have identified as well at the cost of 5 GP per CL of the item to write it into your workbook. As for custom items you would have to research them as Azzy-kun proposed above.
I have yet to get to test these rules however as none of my current players have any crafting feats.
I am currently a player in the Kingmaker AP, and the wizard in our group has gone crafting crazy, creating all the items we need. I can't remember the last time we kept something we found or bought something at the market. Everyone has optimal gear, probably more than we are supposed to at our level. In Kingmaker downtime is no problem, but that may of course be different in other Campaigns.
I wanted my players to get excited when they found new items and I enjoy role-playing tracking down new items to buy or create. That is why I came up with the schematics idea.
I forgot to write that you could add the schematics of items you have identified as well at the cost of 5 GP per CL of the item to write it into your workbook. As for custom items you would have to research them as Azzy-kun proposed above.
I have yet to get to test these rules however as none of my current players have any crafting feats.
I did not know you were in Kingmaker, which does have a lot of downtime, and it is an excellent campaign.
I am currently a player in the Kingmaker AP, and the wizard in our group has gone crafting crazy, creating all the items we need. I can't remember the last time we kept something we found or bought something at the market. Everyone has optimal gear, probably more than we are supposed to at our level. In Kingmaker downtime is no problem, but that may of course be different in other Campaigns.
I wanted my players to get excited when they found new items and I enjoy role-playing tracking down new items to buy or create. That is why I came up with the schematics idea.
I forgot to write that you could add the schematics of items you have identified as well at the cost of 5 GP per CL of the item to write it into your workbook. As for custom items you would have to research them as Azzy-kun proposed above.
I have yet to get to test these rules however as none of my current players have any crafting feats.
Yes, I can certainly understand your concern of how crafting is set up now and why you have set up your homebrew rules. As I already said, I think I am going to introduce them to my DM.
Now, I have not played Kingmaker, but is it a very rich treasure (money) campaign? Because the limitation in crafting anything and everything in our campaign is not having the funds to do so. Even though it is half of the base amount to craft, it still is half, and always having optimal gear would be hard to pull off in our campaign, even at half.
I guess a lot comes down on how much treasure (converted to gold) the DM disperses.
I am currently a player in the Kingmaker AP, and the wizard in our group has gone crafting crazy, creating all the items we need. I can't remember the last time we kept something we found or bought something at the market. Everyone has optimal gear, probably more than we are supposed to at our level. In Kingmaker downtime is no problem, but that may of course be different in other Campaigns.
I wanted my players to get excited when they found new items and I enjoy role-playing tracking down new items to buy or create. That is why I came up with the schematics idea.
I forgot to write that you could add the schematics of items you have identified as well at the cost of 5 GP per CL of the item to write it into your workbook. As for custom items you would have to research them as Azzy-kun proposed above.
I have yet to get to test these rules however as none of my current players have any crafting feats.
Yes, I can certainly understand your concern of how crafting is set up now and why you have set up your homebrew rules. As I already said, I think I am going to introduce them to my DM.
Now, I have not played Kingmaker, but is it a very rich treasure (money) campaign? Because the limitation in crafting anything and everything in our campaign is not having the funds to do so. Even though it is half of the base amount to craft, it still is half, and always having optimal gear would be hard to pull off in our campaign, even at half.
I guess a lot comes down on how much treasure (converted to gold) the DM disperses.
You do have the opportunity to get a fair amount of cash and items in Kingmaker, and since crafting is cheaper, and downtime is no problem, most items get sold to gain more crafting money.
