Arcane Duelist - Bladethirst Clarification

[VikingIrishman]

I'm once again looking at the APG archetypes and seeing little bits that need to be clarified.

Advanced Player's Guide, Page 80 wrote:

Bladethirst (Su): An arcane duelist of 6th level or higher may use performance to grant one weapon, one natural weapon, one end of a double weapon, or 50 items of ammunition of the same type within 30 feet a +1 enhancement bonus. This enhancement bonus increases by +1 for every three levels after 6th (maximum +5 at 18th level). These bonuses stack with existing bonuses and may be used to increase the item's enhancement bonus up to +5 or to add any of the following weapon properties: defending, distance, ghost touch, keen, mighty cleaving, returning, shock, shocking burst, seeking, speed, or wounding (Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook page 469). If the weapon is not magical, at least a +1 enhancement bonus must be added before adding special abilities. This performance replaces suggestion.

Now, nowhere in the ability's description does it reference a duration for this ability, nor does the description for the suggestion ability.

Is this supposed to be a permanent ability? And if so, since the bonus granted stacks with all existing bonuses, what's to stop an arcane duelist from pumping out and selling (taking weapon properties into consideration) +10 weapons and having, for all intents and purposes, infinite cash? If not, what kind of duration is it supposed to have?

[Abraham spalding]

It's a performance. Like any other performance it stops when either the bard stops maintaining the performance with a free action, OR he runs out of rounds of performance.

Not sure where it is around here (and it might be in the errata already) but no weapon can have a total enhancement bonus beyond +10. (you can search for it on the forums I know JJ has already addressed this).

[VikingIrishman]

Abraham spalding wrote:

It's a performance. Like any other performance it stops when either the bard stops maintaining the performance with a free action, OR he runs out of rounds of performance.

Not sure where it is around here (and it might be in the errata already) but no weapon can have a total enhancement bonus beyond +10. (you can search for it on the forums I know JJ has already addressed this).

Aha! I was ignoring the forest for the trees, it seems. The fact that it was a performance never even entered my mind. Thank you for clearing that up. ^_^

[Abraham spalding]

VikingIrishman wrote:

Abraham spalding wrote:

It's a performance. Like any other performance it stops when either the bard stops maintaining the performance with a free action, OR he runs out of rounds of performance.

Not sure where it is around here (and it might be in the errata already) but no weapon can have a total enhancement bonus beyond +10. (you can search for it on the forums I know JJ has already addressed this).

Aha! I was ignoring the forest for the trees, it seems. The fact that it was a performance never even entered my mind. Thank you for clearing that up. ^_^

Glad to help.

[Ris]

Question, if it's a performance, then why is the component not listed. I know visual is the obvious choice, but then again, countersong is obvious but they list audible for it.

Also, there's the issue of what is replaces. Bardic Suggestion is something that happens during another performance. Does the fact that Bladethirst replaces suggestion infer it is used during another performance? If so, then what? Certainly it wouldn't be Fascinate.

[Jiggy]

Ris wrote:

Question, if it's a performance, then why is the component not listed. I know visual is the obvious choice, but then again, countersong is obvious but they list audible for it.

Who's perceiving it? The weapon? Not so sure it needs a component type in this case.

Quote:

Also, there's the issue of what is replaces. Bardic Suggestion is something that happens during another performance. Does the fact that Bladethirst replaces suggestion infer it is used during another performance? If so, then what? Certainly it wouldn't be Fascinate.

You don't carry things over from the replaced abilities in an archetype unless they explicitly say so. (I.e., "This otherwise functions as the [whatever]'s normal X ability." For example, the Urban Barbarian's Controlled Rage.)

[WigglyFace]

I have been treating it like the Arcane Pool ability and Divine Bond (Weapon) ability from the Magus and Paladin classes, respectively, with a cost of one round of Bardic Performance, a static duration of one minute, a Standard Action to activate, and a limit of one instance per weapon. I also ruled that using it during another song ends that song (though my Bard has Lingering Performance so he's able to restart before any bonuses drop).

I've found it to not be overpowered compared to the rest of the party.