3.5 Experience System in Pathfinder

[Dyllan42]

I'm going to be starting a new campaign soon, and will be switching from 3.5 to Pathfinder.

On the whole, Pathfinder looks awesome. However, there is one thing I don't like. Costs for some things seem too low to me. No cost for death except a temporary penalty and some gold, no cost for crafting except gold, so long as you craft things within your skill level (which includes most things the same character could've crafted in 3.5, usually). Much less significant cost for many spells (such as wish and miracle). And I've realized it all boils down to the experience system.

Since experience rewards are fixed, not based on character level, there was really no option to have experience costs for anything. But I think experience costs were an excellent way of balancing things. Making death really hurt (which it should), and making crafting and spells really cost something substantial (not just gold that can be easily weighed in a cost/benefit analysis).

So, my question is, how hard would it be for me to run Pathfinder, but with the 3.5 experience system... and therefore the 3.5 crafting costs (maybe keep the skill based crafting, maybe just make it work exactly like in 3.5), the 3.5 death costs in lieu of the penalties in Pathfinder, and the 3.5 experience cost for spells that had an experience cost?

Has anyone tried this? Does it translate well?

[Morgen]

The experience costs for crafting magic items were incredibly minor unless your character devotes huge amounts of coin and time to it. You'd get more experience from killing a kobold then you'd lose from using the scroll you crafted to do it. That just made keeping track of it just an extra step to remember that you've accumulated 100 lost experience. Not only that but even despite it being rather minor, it punished you for crafting items for the other party members to use.

1000 gold to get rid of a permanent negative level, plus the costs of a cleric capable of casting it should the party lack in divine casters is hardly minor when you heap it onto the 5000 gold from the Raise Dead. Especially when you consider that it only gets rid of one of the two negative levels you pick up for getting raised and you'll have to wait a week before that one can be removed too. Unless you're willing to shell out another 5k to get rid of both of them which is roughly the price of a Resurrection (which still pops on a permanent negative level). That's 7-11k gold assuming someone in the party can cast the spells, probably another grand or two if you don't. That's a healthy chunk of change to have just sitting about in a pile waiting to be used, especially considering that some things (like a captured spell book) aren't as valuable anymore. Hope only one person died.

Sure level loss is iconic and was part of the game for a long time, but it's can quickly slow the game down. Plus the person who lose the level is now weaker and more likely to die again.

Death is a pretty big punishment for most people. You don't get to play the game until your character is brought back up or you make a new character that gets introduced to the party, you lose the money you were probably saving for something and you don't get any of the experience from encounters you lost or didn't fight in because you were dead.

[Dyllan42]

I do appreciate the response, but I'd rather not make this a debate about the merits of experience loss versus negative levels. My players (okay, most of my players) and I agree that we prefer the steeper penalties and costs involved in the 3.5 experience system.

My question is, has it been tried, and how difficult is it to convert things? What kind of problems could be caused by it?

[Stebehil]

The experience system should work without too much trouble, I guess - the PF medium advancement track should result in pretty much the same advancement speed as the 3.5 system, and it has been said several times that using older adventures should be made using this track. So, this should be relatively easy. I can´t say anything about using the xp penalties from 3.5, but if you use the whole 3.5 xp system, then it should fit in rather seamlessly. But I´m just talking from reflecting on the xp system here, not experience.

Stefan

[Dyllan42]

Stebehil wrote:

The experience system should work without too much trouble, I guess - the PF medium advancement track should result in pretty much the same advancement speed as the 3.5 system, and it has been said several times that using older adventures should be made using this track. So, this should be relatively easy. I can´t say anything about using the xp penalties from 3.5, but if you use the whole 3.5 xp system, then it should fit in rather seamlessly. But I´m just talking from reflecting on the xp system here, not experience.

Stefan

Thanks. I thought the same, but having not played Pathfinder yet, I wasn't at all sure that there wasn't some roadblock I was missing.