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Kirth Gersen wrote:TriOmegaZero wrote:The only stickler I haven't worked out is Paladin Smites. It hasn't come up because no one has played one since I adopted this rule. Still waiting for a chance.And I worked so hard to make the paladin prestige class super-awesome... but still no takers!I'll do it!
Can I play a kender paladin?
Let him play one Kirth! I haven't killed a fellow party member in ages!
;)

Kirth Gersen |

Oh, and this thread illustrates why I won't play paladins. I pretty much play fighters or crusaders or clerics that act as a paladin character would without the chance of falling instead.
You can play one in my game! We always used a fall from grace as a player-driven story element, not a DM-imposed punishment. Anyone who wanted to play a murderin', lyin', cheatin' paladin was simply advised to play a different class instead. With a bit of a "gentleman's agreement," as it were, this system works pretty well -- at least insofar as it doesn't totally bone the paladin.
Trying to picture Trog prestiging into paladin after 4th level. Fun!

Krimson |

Such a guy could be true neutral, or Chaotic Neutral.
Because he has no strong motivations or to align himself with any faction whatsoever, let's put aside the Good/Evil axis. Moreover, random acts have no ethical or moral codes, thus you can forget about the Law/Chaos axis.. It might be a side factor that decides for him, but that's no so far from "He does as he pleases"

KenderKin |
KenderKin wrote:Hell, that's only a five to nine hour commute, depending on where in Arkansas you live :)Kirth Gersen wrote:Nope Arkansas....KenderKin wrote:Can I play a kender paladin?Do you live in Houston?
NW corner.....
Hey isn't that why Al Gore invented the internet and bob dole invented skype?To save on long commutes????
Besides sounds like someone is making PC skewers for dinner.....

Clockwork pickle |

Going back to the OP, I don't see the paradox. That is a chaotic character, and given the indifference to Good/evil, CN by default.
the main issue is that the PC in question primarily embraces chaos, entropy, randomness, freedom, chance, etc. easy.
as pointed out by kaeyoss, dedication isn't necessarily lawful. The monk alignment restriction aside (with which I disagree, btw), it doesn't make sense unless all clerics are lawful (dedicated to a deity). If one takes that thinking too far, fighters should all be lawful because they are dedicated to particular weapons, same for rangers (favored enemies, combat style), all prepared casters need to have a routine of study/prayer, bards have their favored performance types and are dedicated to acquiring knowledge, etc. dedication to law and order (or something similar) is lawful, not dedication itself.
as for whether intention is part of the alignment equation? it has to be, but it isn't sufficient. To illustrate using the rules: going back to the point of animals and vermin and neutral because they have no intention (read free will). This might lead one to believe that intention is the only component to alignment. However, mindless undead are evil, even though they can't have intention. Why? maybe it is because they are the product of evil forces, maybe it is because their "instincts" involve evil acts (as opposed to the more survival based instincts of vermin and animals), or maybe it is just about playing for team evil. The point is that it is possible to be evil (or any other alignment) without meaning to be in the objective alignment system of PF.