Recently got the 4E DMG2 and was looking at the part about Sigil. Reading the section, I came to two conclusions, one of which might be rather blasphemous.
One, I really missed having the Factions (or at least some of them), and Second, the Lady of Pain seems rather useless to me. She never talks, never has an agenda, you can't even reveal anything about her w/o risking her becoming less interesting.
So, at the risk of being banished to the mazes, I've been thinking of running a Sigil where most of the Factions remained to run the city and the Lady of Pain is gone. How bad an idea is this?
It's not necessarily a bad idea. I imaginge it would be like the mob wars of the 1930s. Chaos runs rampant in the streets. The safest places are behhind closed doors that are owned or protected by the disticts' crime lords.
The dabus are her mouthpiece. Her use is as a plot device to explain in the vaguest of terms how Sigil continues to exist and operate.
She was always meant to be a MacGuffen of sorts to fill in the logical questions of how Sigil could exist all.
You should also remember the lady of pain didn't form or approve of the factions and the factions don't report to her.
The lady of pain should be treated as background flavor only for a campaign but never included as anything other than a mobile statue.
Recently got the 4E DMG2 and was looking at the part about Sigil. Reading the section, I came to two conclusions, one of which might be rather blasphemous.
One, I really missed having the Factions (or at least some of them), and Second, the Lady of Pain seems rather useless to me. She never talks, never has an agenda, you can't even reveal anything about her w/o risking her becoming less interesting.
So, at the risk of being banished to the mazes, I've been thinking of running a Sigil where most of the Factions remained to run the city and the Lady of Pain is gone. How bad an idea is this?
I assume you have more than the DMG2 write up of Sigil to go with right? If not beg, borrow or buy Factol's Manifesto and In the Cage: Guide to Sigil anyway you can. The LoP was most deliberately created exactly as you describe - she gives Sigil existence and is a 'bogeyman' of sorts to scare the berks into good behaviour (or at least non-city wrecking behaviour). The Factions can't run Sigil - they have their own deeply ingrained agendas that effectively prevent them for ever doing an even mediocore job of it.
And that is a perfect way to run a PS/Sigil game, imo. Start rumours that the LoP is gone. The Factions start making bolder and bolder moves to dominate the city - up to and including raids and murder. The PCs, being big wheeler-dealers themselves if they aren't some raw Primes on their first visit, can get caught between 2, 3 or more Factions all wanting their favour (and swordarm!). I wouldn't just remove LoP and pretend she never existed. She is, imo, necessary as that omnipotent threat in the background to give Sigil importance and, dare I say it?, believability. Remove her for a time (or she may still be there just hidden from all sight and scrying) and think of how the Factions will fall upon one another.
According to some info I have read the original creators of the whole Faction War never intended for the Factions to leave Sigil forever. If the line had been continued by TSR or WotC, they would have come back albeit in smaller numbers with different leadership.
Recently got the 4E DMG2 and was looking at the part about Sigil. Reading the section, I came to two conclusions, one of which might be rather blasphemous.
One, I really missed having the Factions (or at least some of them), and Second, the Lady of Pain seems rather useless to me. She never talks, never has an agenda, you can't even reveal anything about her w/o risking her becoming less interesting.
So, at the risk of being banished to the mazes, I've been thinking of running a Sigil where most of the Factions remained to run the city and the Lady of Pain is gone. How bad an idea is this?
The factions are one of the four important elements that make Sigil so unique, along with the portals, the dungeon punk atmosphere and the Lady of Pain. I have no idea what possessed the writers to drop them -- change for the sake of change [and sales], I guess. If I ever run PS again, the factions will have never left.
As others have said, the very purpose of the Lady is to be a mood-setter and a plot explanation, not an NPC.
She was always meant to be a MacGuffen of sorts to fill in the logical questions of how Sigil could exist all.
You should also remember the lady of pain didn't form or approve of the factions and the factions don't report to her.
The lady of pain should be treated as background flavor only for a campaign but never included as anything other than a mobile statue.
She appears to be an enigma, a mystery of the city, almost like the cities avatar and it is supposedly her who can close sigils doors as and when she wishes.
This is the only thing that keeps demons, devils and angels from blazing street fights or else they may find there particular group\race banned from Sigil and easy access across the planes.Stats arn't important, if she's on the streets then avoid looking at her or suffer pain, attack her and you'll find yourself dead before your blade strikes. If she is on the streets then it's more like an omen that something is afoot.
As for the factions, put them back in with a couple of 4E tweaks. The factions make for excellent roleplay options and a really different campaign slant.
I've also been going through the 3rd ed books to re-create the old planer groups:-
Demons-tanari
Devil-Baatezu
Angels-Astral Deva, Planetar, Solar these are more like status rather than a creature type.
Archons( Celestial archon not the elemental ones)
Yugoloths
Gehreleths
Slaad
Marut\inevitables and Formions (maybe modrons)
Plus cranium rats etc.
So, at the risk of being banished to the mazes, I've been thinking of running a Sigil where most of the Factions remained to run the city and the Lady of Pain is gone. How bad an idea is this?
It's a great idea! How about this twist? What if the Lady of Pain isn't actually gone, but has just gone missing? What if this is all part of her master plan that noone can comprehend?
So, at the risk of being banished to the mazes, I've been thinking of running a Sigil where most of the Factions remained to run the city and the Lady of Pain is gone. How bad an idea is this?It's a great idea! How about this twist? What if the Lady of Pain isn't actually gone, but has just gone missing? What if this is all part of her master plan that noone can comprehend?
Nice twist, maybe the Debaus are going weird and building walls in odd places, digging holes in wierd places etc. Could be a cool part of a story.
Thinking about the factions a bit: Why not give each faction it's own paragon path (assuming this is a paragon-teir game)?