I thought we'd been told definitely dead? Not that I could find it right now.
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Hmmm,
I think that since the concept is that prophesies and "fate" are no longer reliable because of Aroden's death -- a great metagame design to illustrate that the PCs (and DMs designing campaigns) drive the game and not published material (or railroading) -- we can say Aroden is really dead.
But you could interpret a faked death if you feel Aroden has become "tired" of prophesy and fate and wanted to put the future of the world back in the hands of the mortals.
I think it would be problematic to say he died and "is coming back" because on his return he would want to reinstate prophets and fate, thus hurting the metagame reason for having him die in the first place.
(Someone can look up the quote from [I think] Pathfinder #1 saying that now that he's dead prophesies are breaking down and for the first time the future of the world is open for new heroes, etc. to pave a new way (enter your PCs!)
-W. E. Ray
I find your lack of faith disturbing.
And the end of prophecies had nothing to do with my presumed "death" - huge coincidence (and no one saw it coming - HA!).
I was just tired of my chosen people cheating like that. People who use prophecies are the same who use wallhacks and the like.
I think the death of Aroden - was it real? what happened? - is one of the awesome mysteries of Golarion. I hope Paizo never answers it definitively - or at least without perhaps coming up with an awesome, potentially epic-level, adventure path of heroes setting out to find out what did happen to Aroden (and perhaps attempting to stop it from happening to another god or other such legendary plotline).
Creative Director
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Aroden is dead.
This is official. It's a KEY part of the campaign's flavor and history, and it's not something that we're going to "reverse" or cheat out of. He's dead.
As for HOW he died... for internal consistency, we have the reasons decided on in-house so that we can be consistent in how those reasons ripple things along, so if we ever DO reveal how he died, that revelation will mesh with everything we've done. At this point, we've no plans to ever reveal how he died, though.
Aroden is dead.
This is official. It's a KEY part of the campaign's flavor and history, and it's not something that we're going to "reverse" or cheat out of. He's dead.
As for HOW he died... for internal consistency, we have the reasons decided on in-house so that we can be consistent in how those reasons ripple things along, so if we ever DO reveal how he died, that revelation will mesh with everything we've done. At this point, we've no plans to ever reveal how he died, though.
Yeah. He's dead. Officially dead. No use sniffing down this rat hole anymore. Nothing to see here, move along.
Ha! Right. And you'd have me believe that crop circles are created by people on rakes, too. The lengths some secret societies go to in order to propagate their lies is stunning. I mean, really, suborning the designers into their plans. That takes moxie.
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Aroden is dead.
This is official. It's a KEY part of the campaign's flavor and history, and it's not something that we're going to "reverse" or cheat out of. He's dead.
As for HOW he died... for internal consistency, we have the reasons decided on in-house so that we can be consistent in how those reasons ripple things along, so if we ever DO reveal how he died, that revelation will mesh with everything we've done. At this point, we've no plans to ever reveal how he died, though.
Can't get more official than this!:-)
According to my sources, Aroden is only MOSTLY dead...
According to my sources, Aroden is only MOSTLY dead...
Call Miracle Max! :)
Of course, the death of a god should be so dramatic that any mortal witnesses might not survive or remain sane. So, no reliable account of the death may ever be known - and each god in attendance will likely have their own version of the event...
Well, I guess *some* of us need to get cracking on an epic resurrect.
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At this point, we've no plans to ever reveal how he died, though.Well you guys are just mean teases then aren't you? :p
But then, I'm still holding out hope of the 'real world' matching my home brew where Aroden's death is going to be a springboard for the return to divinity of Arazni! Of course, Arazni may not be quite sane enough to take Aroden's spot after all she's been through, but that's half the fun.
Another member of the Knighthood of the Phoenix?
Arazni Eternal!
Jimi Hendrix, John Lennon, Jim Morrison, Jerry Garcia, Elvis, and now this.
My gods are all dead! WAAAAA!
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"Legends claim Pharasma knew the death of Aroden was fast approaching and even judged him, but did nothing to warn her followers, many of whom were driven mad by the event."
"Pharasma's followers are midwives, expectant mothers, morticians and (less so since Aroden's death) diviners.
"Her divine servents are... Echo of Lost Divinity (a spectral soldier who vaguely resembles depictions of Aroden)..."
"She has no true enemies or allies, though Iomedae views her with some resentment for keeping Aroden's death a secret."
"...his unexpected death which tore apart the magic of prophecy."
Sounds to me like he probably won't be coming back.
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Question:
Does a God of Prophesy see into the future (and shows an acolyte what he has seen) and let nature take it's course, or does he manipulate events to come out as he wants them?
If the former, then any prophacy after his death would have come to pass. But since every prophacy after his death has proven false, I say Aroden manipulated events.
Rebuttles?
In my Darklight Sisterhood campaign, he's dead, but only as dead as a power can be. Some powerful relics of his hold fragments of Aroden's conciousness, which are passed on to those who find them, sometimes with tragic results.
Arazni Eternal!
Arazni Undying!
I think it was bad chol-astral-ol.
For this, your suffering shall be eternal!
All that slander. Do I sound dead to you?
For the record: As the god of prophecy, I would see my death coming from a millennium away. I'd take precautions. Being a god of traditions, I'd go with one of the classics. Like hitting on a hundred mortal women and begetting demi-divine progeny to fuel my divine resurrection.
In fact, I'd keep them together and give them a quest. I'd pave the way for this from day 0. I'd instil in them the lust for discovery and create a society just for them, based in my very own city.
Someone's played a little too much HOMMVArazni Undying!Arazni Eternal!
How would that be possible?
It's okay. Someone sooner or later will think of resurrection and a two-pack of restoration spells to get rid of the permanent negative levels.
Point is that a GM can do what they want.
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Nothing has definitively been said (if so, I've missed it), and I don't expect a firm answer anytime soon. I'm perfectly happy with that too. I like a world with mystery.
I am sure I read somewhere James said that Aroden was definitively dead
still i think he rencarnated in someone... just will keep my guns down until it is or not revealed if its who i think or not
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Aroden is dead.
This is official. It's a KEY part of the campaign's flavor and history, and it's not something that we're going to "reverse" or cheat out of. He's dead.
As for HOW he died... for internal consistency, we have the reasons decided on in-house so that we can be consistent in how those reasons ripple things along, so if we ever DO reveal how he died, that revelation will mesh with everything we've done. At this point, we've no plans to ever reveal how he died, though.
mmm interesting
i should finish reading threads before answering :P
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All that slander. Do I sound dead to you?
For the record: As the god of prophecy, I would see my death coming from a millennium away. I'd take precautions. Being a god of traditions, I'd go with one of the classics. Like hitting on a hundred mortal women and begetting demi-divine progeny to fuel my divine resurrection.
In fact, I'd keep them together and give them a quest. I'd pave the way for this from day 0. I'd instil in them the lust for discovery and create a society just for them, based in my very own city.
interestingly enough... being dead doesn't hut him up... at least I am not the only one who suffer him... but you all too...
well now to keep the ehavens free of demons and continue the campaign to free the universe of evil and chaos! my army to my!
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I am less curious about the hows, whys, and whats of Aroden's death than why Pharasima did not warn her followers and let them be driven insane by the event.
does she tell every mortal and their kin when and how would they die? no...
why should she tell them about a deity's death? its part of the circle, stopping, interrupting, etc is not
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Question:
Does a God of Prophesy see into the future (and shows an acolyte what he has seen) and let nature take it's course, or does he manipulate events to come out as he wants them?
If the former, then any prophacy after his death would have come to pass. But since every prophacy after his death has proven false, I say Aroden manipulated events.
Rebuttles?
Well, as he was a god, I'd think Aroden's divine spark(which is what made him a god) had to go somewhere/when or may different somewheres/whens.
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Creative Director
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I am less curious about the hows, whys, and whats of Aroden's death than why Pharasima did not warn her followers and let them be driven insane by the event.
Because that's not what Pharasma does. She's perhaps the oldest of the deities in Golarion and her ways are not always for mortals to understand. Also... there's always a chance that Pharasma DIDN'T know what was going to happen until it did. And an even better chance that she did know but kept it from her followers as a method to winnow out the weak among her followers. Or perhaps she has a use for insane followers and let them go crazy on purpose. She's not good aligned, so she's not necessarily a nice person all the time.
She's an enigma!
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I am less curious about the hows, whys, and whats of Aroden's death than why Pharasima did not warn her followers and let them be driven insane by the event.
Actually that kind of fits my theory that Aroden did something that led to his death, acting on what he saw coming.
Pharasima: This is going to suck, but death and life are part of the cycle.
Aroden: If I do X, Y, and Z, it won't happen, so suckage will be avoided.
*Aroden acts, dropps dead*
Pharasima: What? I didn't see that coming!
Followers: *go nuts*
Semi-off topic comic book reference:
A terrible--but beautiful!--upsurgence of the anima!
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I am less curious about the hows, whys, and whats of Aroden's death than why Pharasima did not warn her followers and let them be driven insane by the event.... Or perhaps she has a use for insane followers and let them go crazy on purpose. She's not good aligned, so she's not necessarily a nice person all the time.
She's an enigma!
That's kind of what I am banking on.
I am less curious about the hows, whys, and whats of Aroden's death than why Pharasima did not warn her followers and let them be driven insane by the event.Because that's not what Pharasma does. She's perhaps the oldest of the deities in Golarion and her ways are not always for mortals to understand. Also... there's always a chance that Pharasma DIDN'T know what was going to happen until it did. And an even better chance that she did know but kept it from her followers as a method to winnow out the weak among her followers. Or perhaps she has a use for insane followers and let them go crazy on purpose. She's not good aligned, so she's not necessarily a nice person all the time.
She's an enigma!
Could just be the simple rule about secrets, the more people who know them, they less secret they are and the more chance that someone you don't want knowing them will find them out.
If she tells her people and even one blabs then everyone soon enough will know.
My theory is that Aroden made a deal with Asmodeus to avoid sharing the fate of the other Azlanti when the Starstone fell and destroyed Azlant. Perhaps he felt that becoming a god would absolve him from keeping his end of the deal or maybe he just didn't read the small print. However who is it who benefited most from Aroden's death? Think about it.
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My theory is that Aroden made a deal with Asmodeus to avoid sharing the fate of the other Azlanti when the Starstone fell and destroyed Azlant. Perhaps he felt that becoming a god would absolve him from keeping his end of the deal or maybe he just didn't read the small print. However who is it who benefited most from Aroden's death? Think about it.
mmm Iomedae took his place, but not his realm... actually a lot of people get benefited by this...
Asmodeus the first one, he got a new land to conquere... easily
Lamashtu, the worldwound that Asmodeus has topped reopened with vigor!
the Whispering Tyrant survived his enenmy, even if he was unable to kill him himself... unless it was him
Nethys as god of magic... its evil part would be perfectly happy to kill such a pwoerful practicioner of magic
so lots of demons and devils
every god/dess that thinks civilization and law are a danger gain soemthing of his death...
I think Aroden was not even in this planet when the starstone fell... maybe in one of the close planes/worlds
Aroden is dead.
This is official. It's a KEY part of the campaign's flavor and history, and it's not something that we're going to "reverse" or cheat out of. He's dead.
Somehow, ever since Justin Achilli dared saying "Really, Saulot was a vampire saint" a year before him being outed as the most nefarious villain in the oWoD (Saulot, not Justin) I've started taking all "official statements" with a grain of salt. =P
Besides, if his death broke prophecy and fate, then you yourselves have no way of knowing whether he'll -stay- dead! =D
Wait, here's an eye...
And here's a hand...
No, those are Dracula's, but here's the heart, now go and complete the set! =)