I played him the same way as a rubbish COLLECTOR and the reuse of night-soil. Not the most pleasant person to be around but better than a dump truck.
Creative Director
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Actually... like many things in Sandpoint, having the city dump be "Dump the garbage over the cliff and let the sea take care of it" was inspired by the real world—in particular, by my home town of Point Arena. For some time, the city dump was indeed "off the side of the cliff a few hundred yards away from the lighthouse."
Gorvi is not only pretty stupid, but he's also VERY unpleasant—he's described as a lummox, after all (a clumsy, stupid person). He's not fit, socially, to be much more than a garbage baron and a terror to his desperate employees. I doubt he'd be able to maintain a healthy business relationship (or any healthy relationship) for longer than a week before he messes it up somehow.
That said, I'm sure Gorvi sifts through the rubbish and garbage looking for prizes before he throws the stuff over the side. In fact, it's worth noting that the article doesn't go into detail about WHY the town pays him to be the junker, they just do. It's certainly believable to expect that part of his job is to deliver "good junk" to local businesses that need it, but it's also even more believable that Gorvi's bad attitude makes him cut corners there. He's kind of lazy too; it's a lot easier to just dump the stuff over the side of the cliff than it is to sort everything and bother reselling it.
Also: A city that throws its trash over the side of the cliff into the sea and has goblins periodically sifting through that garbage is a lot more entertaining and fun than having a city that's super environment-conscious and recycles everything. There's more adventure hooks with the garbage disposal as written too, which is ALSO good for the adventure/setting.
And try not to confuse PFRPG locations like Sandpoint with "medieval" settings. It's certainly an easy error, since there are no guns or cars and folks carry swords and wear armor, but the simple fact that magic is a part of the world is a HUGE change. As a result, the world of Golarion is different in ways that make analogies to real-world time periods tricky at best.
Of course, if you think that it hurts verisimilitude to have the town garbageman not reselling trash and refuse back to the rest of the town, by all means change it. But Gorvi, like everything in Sandpoint, serves a very specific purpose and I put a lot of thought into the character and why he is the way he is, both to make an interesting NPC and an interesting town AND to make for a location that has a lot of adventure hooks.
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err in 2 different campaigns... Gorvy showed us his true colors... both DM played him as odious and a bit drunkard... so in the 1st one when he tried to abuse a lonely, unarmed cleric of Iomedae... well he was for a surprise... she was 2nd level and has the sun domain... produce flame in a fist is quite a good way to take away such pests... after that the cleric's boyfriend after becoming part of the security forces of the city expelled the thrashman from sandpoint (he wanted to hang him)... not without the cleric giving him another kick ass... with flaming fist.
second adventure... very much similar situation... but direst situation... the cleric finished killing the orc and delivering herself to the authorities... since it was clear it was self defense she was left free.
In my campaign, Gorvi's bad attitude was fueled mostly by a sense of alienation, being one of the only half-orcs in town. It became problematic as described in the book, until one day...
My party's wizard wrote a play "The Goblin Queen of Thistletop" detailing the exploits of the party in Burnt Offerings. Downplaying his own role, the wizard wrote the party's paladin, a half-orc, into the lead role. Gorvi went out for the part, and revealed a hidden talent for theater, and got his 15 minutes of fame in Sandpoint. In playing the role, he realized it was possible for the town's people to respect and venerate a half-orc, and began living by the paladin's example.
Alas, he has returned somewhat to his slovenly ways, but both he and the townsfolk have a renewed respect for the subtleties of Gorvi's character.
My personal games usually don't resemble real world medieval settings that much - because I don't know much about RWMS, and don't want to change it.
Also, RWMS is boring: No real monsters, no magic, no elves, no nothing. In tales, maybe, yes, or as an excuse to torture and kill people, but My games are already a story, and I don't want a story that has everything happening in stories-within-the-story.
so in the 1st one when he tried to abuse a lonely, unarmed cleric of Iomedae... well he was for a surprise...
He was too late? The line had already formed. Well, teaches him not to queue against creatures that don't give a damn about silly stuff like time and space.
I am not looking to make Sandpoint a "RWMS" but it hurts verisimiltude if people do not behave like people, and thowing valuable stuff away is odd behaviour.
So have him pick through it first. If he misses something valuable, he misses something valuable. Just because he picks through it doesn't mean he finds everything. Most of the stuff that goes over the hill is probably vegetable matter.
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I am not looking to make Sandpoint a "RWMS" but it hurts verisimiltude if people do not behave like people, and thowing valuable stuff away is odd behaviour.
Not trying to open a can of worms... but Gorvi isn't human, so he may not behave like a normal person.. maybe 'valuable' stuff to the lazy half-orc is whatever he can see on top of the open [bag/pile/wagon] without digging through everything. In my run through the goblin attack,part of Gorvi's contract was to provide the smith's ect with any spare bits he found for free. So he would take the things he could clean up and sell off the top, and then sell the rights to go through collected trash for worthwhile trinkets and spare metal bits to someone for a few silver pieces a week, they would make their money back selling the bits off, and he would make a few extra silver. On the weeks that no one bought the sifting rights, he would just dump the whole thing over the side, to avoid extra work for no gain.
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so in the 1st one when he tried to abuse a lonely, unarmed cleric of Iomedae... well he was for a surprise...He was too late? The line had already formed. Well, teaches him not to queue against creatures that don't give a damn about silly stuff like time and space.
yes... apparently people like to die pummeled by hot Iomedaen priestess
If your version of Gorvi picks through the trash for debris he can sell to the smiths and glaziers, then have a handful of goblins periodically creep into the town, grabbing metal items and anything else not nailed down. Let them craft their dogslicers from stolen hinges, weathervanes, lantern hooks, and boat fittings, all pried loose in the dead of night. It works as well.
thowing valuable stuff away is odd behaviour.
Humans do it every day.
Really, if you want weapons-grade odd behaviour, look no further than homo sapiens sapiens.
Also, RWMS is boring: No real monsters, no magic, no elves, no nothing.
[OT:] While the boring part may be open to discussion regarding the real middle ages, a RPG capturing the medieval flavor really good and adding fantasy elements to it is Ars Magica. (Did I mention that I love that game?:-))) [/OT]
Stefan
Also, RWMS is boring: No real monsters, no magic, no elves, no nothing.[OT:] While the boring part may be open to discussion regarding the real middle ages, a RPG capturing the medieval flavor really good and adding fantasy elements to it is Ars Magica. (Did I mention that I love that game?:-))) [/OT]
Stefan
The important part about that is the "adding fantasy elements" one.
The bard seems frustrated in the fights but has spent a lot of time questioning people. She is trying to understand the characters, which means I need to. She is also making assumptions about how the society works, which have mislead her once. She was assuming a more feudal society.
The areas dominated by Magnimar and Riddleport don't really fit a feudal model. Instead of holding land in fealty to a sovereign, most of the area's lands appear to be allodial (privately owned). Preindustrial cultures that followed such a model included the city states of Medieval Italy and parts of Germany.
There may be notable exceptions. I expect that Sandpoint's leading families own significant parts of the town and hope to control more. Townsfolk living in their properties may pay in an odd patchwork of coinage, barter, and required service. As an example, a PC given deed to a cottage as a reward for their heroism might find the current tenants required to yearly pay them 64 gold pieces, 5 chickens, 30 iron nails, and five days labor cutting peat from local marshland. The PCs may be required to provide security against goblins if they wish to collect the peat. If the callous PCs plan to live in their new cottage, they might have to throw out the current tenants.
Water rights were a major bone of contention in Medieval society, with farmers and mill owners building dams and diverting watercourses. In such a culture, the building of mills was often strictly regulated, to keep millers from interfering with each other's business and ensure that local landowners maintained monopolistic control over their mills.
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Environmental consciousness has nothing to do with it.
Pre-modern societies didn't throw valuable "junk" away because there was always someone poor enough to be willing to sort through it, and make a living from it.
Some cities do this by chucking the junk on a big landfill and letting incredibly poor people pick through it.
If we're going to chuck qualifications around... I have a degree, two of them in fact, in Ancient History and Archaeology and one thing I learnt is that a purely utilitarian approach to human behaviour gets you nowhere faster than a speeding bullet (I don't know what the Venus of Hohle Fels was for, but it sure wasn't breeding and reproducing, at least not directly).
Human beings are wasteful when they have surplus.
Whether the lowest rung of the ladder picks up scraps depends upon how low the lowest rung is? Is Sandpoint full of beggars? Does it have a workhouse? Are there people there functioning below subsistence?
No. Not that I can find.
And so we have waste. It is a mark of Sandpoint's prosperity when contrasted with a medieval town.
If that answer doesn't satisfy your bard I am not sure what will.
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Director of Brand Strategy
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Environmental consciousness has nothing to do with it.
Pre-modern societies didn't throw valuable "junk" away because there was always someone poor enough to be willing to sort through it, and make a living from it.
It seems that in this case the "poor enough" are the goblins.